PA - Kenzie Houk, 26, pregnant, murdered, Wampum, 20 Feb 2009

[JaneInOz]

Boys at this age can look a little stout before they hit puberty and stretch out. He just looks miserable to me.

I defintiely agree with the looking miserable, eyes are black as in colour not punched! and puffy and red cheeks - so yes he could have been sobbing and sobbing

Just seems odd that he would have been considering he just walked off to school

Mind you going to a REAL JAIL might have made him understand and made him upset at what he had done.

Does anyone know what he did after he shot her ? did he just take his gun and go to another room and put it down ?

 

[Fairy1]

I have almost always been a working mom, but I've never, ever had a problem making sure my children know they come first - no matter what. I have always made arrangements for their care after school when necessary. They were 2 and 5 when I got together with their stepdad, my now husband, who has been their father since and has adopted them as his own - after their bio father walked away, never looking back. Still, I knew I needed to be in tune with their feelings during the time THEIR lives were in transition. Their discipline has always been my responsibilty and although their "stepdad" is very much a part of their daily lives, he would not be the one to take them to task even now and my babies are now 19 and 17.

My son (17) LOVES the video game Vice City - which is horribly violent. However, he is THE most tender-hearted and sensitive person I have EVER known. We talk about the violence in his video game versus violence in the real world. He understands the difference and it is not an issue.

My point is, parents, particularly those whose children are undergoing life-changing circumstances, need to be aware of their children's feelings and thoughts during transition. That may not be the case here nor the case of the 8-year-old in AZ. A parent - mother or father - cannot discount or downplay the feelings of their children. Ever.

 

[Openmind]

I have almost always been a working mom, but I've never, ever had a problem making sure my children know they come first - no matter what. I have always made arrangements for their care after school when necessary. They were 2 and 5 when I got together with their stepdad, my now husband, who has been their father since and has adopted them as his own - after their bio father walked away, never looking back. Still, I knew I needed to be in tune with their feelings during the time THEIR lives were in transition. Their discipline has always been my responsibilty and although their "stepdad" is very much a part of their daily lives, he would not be the one to take them to task even now and my babies are now 19 and 17.

My son (17) LOVES the video game Vice City - which is horribly violent. However, he is THE most tender-hearted and sensitive person I have EVER known. We talk about the violence in his video game versus violence in the real world. He understands the difference and it is not an issue.

My point is, parents, particularly those whose children are undergoing life-changing circumstances, need to be aware of their children's feelings and thoughts during transition. That may not be the case here nor the case of the 8-year-old in AZ. A parent - mother or father - cannot discount or downplay the feelings of their children. Ever.

Your words are golden. Parents need to know their kids. They need to talk with them and, most importantly, truly listen to them.

 

[Fairy1]

Your words are golden. Parents need to know their kids. They need to talk with them and, most importantly, truly listen to them.

Thank you so much Openmind. I forgot to add.....I do not believe it is a good thing to make your children believe they are the center of the universe. I support my children 100% in everything they do. We have meaningful, intelligent conversations daily and I truly value their opinions and thoughts and senses of humor. I am painfully honest with them about nearly everything because I don't want to send them out into the world without knowing what is truly out there. I believe part of the problem with children nowadays is allowing them to believe the sun rises and sets on them. It's really not true and I feel that when they discover that is when real problems ensue. We can and should teach them how wonderful they are, but it's equally important to make sure they understand there will always be someone smarter, cuter, richer, funnier, skinnier, etc. And to teach them that no one is perfect and that no one can ever take their place in our lives or in the world. It's a delicate balance.

 

[gitana1]

I agree with that. And Gun control may see the rate rise to start with but you do a buyback, you give an amnesty, you start teaching about what guns do, do campaigns showing WHAT Guns do to people.

The school massacres , we just don't have them. Because kids don't have ready acsess to guns of any sort youth or adult..

This 11 yr old thought Guns were fine, knew how to handle one, enough to shoot a 8 mth pregnant woman in the HEAD and blow her away

And THEN just walk off to school like it meant nothing

And that IS Because guns are "a way of life" " a part of the culture"

BUT

No one said there couldn't be a change

Im sorry , i know my opinion on this issue is probaby not welcome here, I am on an American board and I am not American.

But I feel strongly about this issue. And yes I do feel that it is the person behind the gun that is the culprit, I do understand that. But peoples mindesets need to be changed and having the RIGHT to bear arms is wrong - IMO

Jane, I am behind you on this and I don't even think crimes would rise if guns were controlled. I disagree that guns in the hands of private citizens save lives. The crooks that break into homes to rob, rape and kill do not let fear of guns stop them and I can't remember one legitimate news story about, for example, a killing by an intruder being thwarted by a gun. An NRA affiliated, militia supported website would not change my mind.
In fact, the government stats I have seen show that guns cause more death and injury accidentally or via suicide or sudden, unpremeditated violence, than they protect homeowners. Great example is the man who own a gun hears a noise, takes out his gun, sees a shadow and shoots. Then he finds it was a his teenage son who snuck out unbeknownst to him and had just tried to sneak back in. Now, the kids dead. My godfather actually almost shot his wife in the middle of the night under similar cicumstances. However, my point is that due to the mindset of my countrymen, strict gun control laws would never be passed. As I said before, the myth of the cowboy and his gun is in the blood of the people. It's a huge part of our culture. Nevertheless, I feel it is ridiculous that we apparently have all these people running around who allow their children unfettered access to a firearm, without locking the guns up when not in use. This is the modern age. These people act as if there are outlaws or Native Americans waiting to raid the farm that sits several miles away from any neighbor. But it's the modern age. Kids today are much less mature than 100 years ago when guns in the hands of a school-aged child made a bit more sense. Gosh, kids today don't even need to hunt for food! IMO, there is absolutely no need for these types of killings by children to occur. It's senseless, and completely preventable.

 

[JaneInOz]

Jane, I am behind you on this and I don't even think crimes would rise if guns were controlled. I disagree that guns in the hands of private citizens save lives. The crooks that break into homes to rob, rape and kill do not let fear of guns stop them and I can't remember one legitimate news story about, for example, a killing by an intruder being thwarted by a gun. An NRA affiliated, militia supported website would not change my mind.
In fact, the government stats I have seen show that guns cause more death and injury accidentally or via suicide or sudden, unpremeditated violence, than they protect homeowners. Great example is the man who own a gun hears a noise, takes out his gun, sees a shadow and shoots. Then he finds it was a his teenage son who snuck out unbeknownst to him and had just tried to sneak back in. Now, the kids dead. My godfather actually almost shot his wife in the middle of the night under similar cicumstances. However, my point is that due to the mindset of my countrymen, strict gun control laws would never be passed. As I said before, the myth of the cowboy and his gun is in the blood of the people. It's a huge part of our culture. Nevertheless, I feel it is ridiculous that we apparently have all these people running around who allow their children unfettered access to a firearm, without locking the guns up when not in use. This is the modern age. These people act as if there are outlaws or Native Americans waiting to raid the farm that sits several miles away from any neighbor. But it's the modern age. Kids today are much less mature than 100 years ago when guns in the hands of a school-aged child made a bit more sense. Gosh, kids today don't even need to hunt for food! IMO, there is absolutely no need for these types of killings by children to occur. It's senseless, and completely preventable.

Yes hon, this is my point too...It doesn't stop Crime...has crime decreased in America because of "the right to bear arms" ? no it has not - its increased...

Its been going one way for a very long time with no sucsess how about doing it the other way and giving it a chance

Wouldn't the people of America like to see less crime ?

 

[southcitymom]

http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,498165,00.html

WHOA

Whats wrong with him ? Those sunken eyes , black around them and very red cheeks

He does look like a heavy set kid ?

And no he shouldn't be in an adult prison thats ludicrous !

But he needs to be in a Lock up for Juveniles that commit henious crimes. and have very strict jailing standards like adults do, so hopefull he will Never reoffend

I think he just looks like he has been crying and is upset. I don't see anything more sinister than that. Most folks are not at their best in a mug shot.

 

[JaneInOz]

I think he just looks like he has been crying and is upset. I don't see anything more sinister than that. Most folks are not at their best in a mug shot.

I did elaborate and concur a few posts later...perhaps you didn't get there ?

I agree he looks upset

 

[Trino]

Jane, I am behind you on this and I don't even think crimes would rise if guns were controlled. I disagree that guns in the hands of private citizens save lives. The crooks that break into homes to rob, rape and kill do not let fear of guns stop them and I can't remember one legitimate news story about, for example, a killing by an intruder being thwarted by a gun. An NRA affiliated, militia supported website would not change my mind.
In fact, the government stats I have seen show that guns cause more death and injury accidentally or via suicide or sudden, unpremeditated violence, than they protect homeowners. Great example is the man who own a gun hears a noise, takes out his gun, sees a shadow and shoots. Then he finds it was a his teenage son who snuck out unbeknownst to him and had just tried to sneak back in. Now, the kids dead. My godfather actually almost shot his wife in the middle of the night under similar cicumstances. However, my point is that due to the mindset of my countrymen, strict gun control laws would never be passed. As I said before, the myth of the cowboy and his gun is in the blood of the people. It's a huge part of our culture. Nevertheless, I feel it is ridiculous that we apparently have all these people running around who allow their children unfettered access to a firearm, without locking the guns up when not in use. This is the modern age. These people act as if there are outlaws or Native Americans waiting to raid the farm that sits several miles away from any neighbor. But it's the modern age. Kids today are much less mature than 100 years ago when guns in the hands of a school-aged child made a bit more sense. Gosh, kids today don't even need to hunt for food! IMO, there is absolutely no need for these types of killings by children to occur. It's senseless, and completely preventable.

There are definitely people in the US who use guns to hunt for food today. I live in MN, and hunting season is BIG, so big that kids sometimes take off school for the opener. Of course, they go with parents.

 

[mydailyopinions]

This is so horrific. I will not get into the gun debate being a gun owner myself..

One thing I do agree with is charging this child as an adult.
I really hate that our world has come to this, but I do feel that as long as we teach our children they will suffer the consequences of their actions just like the adults do, maybe they will rethink their actions.

Sad...just so terribly sad..

 

[oceanblueeyes]

Jane, I am behind you on this and I don't even think crimes would rise if guns were controlled. I disagree that guns in the hands of private citizens save lives. The crooks that break into homes to rob, rape and kill do not let fear of guns stop them and I can't remember one legitimate news story about, for example, a killing by an intruder being thwarted by a gun. An NRA affiliated, militia supported website would not change my mind.
In fact, the government stats I have seen show that guns cause more death and injury accidentally or via suicide or sudden, unpremeditated violence, than they protect homeowners. Great example is the man who own a gun hears a noise, takes out his gun, sees a shadow and shoots. Then he finds it was a his teenage son who snuck out unbeknownst to him and had just tried to sneak back in. Now, the kids dead. My godfather actually almost shot his wife in the middle of the night under similar circumstances. However, my point is that due to the mindset of my countrymen, strict gun control laws would never be passed. As I said before, the myth of the cowboy and his gun is in the blood of the people. It's a huge part of our culture. Nevertheless, I feel it is ridiculous that we apparently have all these people running around who allow their children unfettered access to a firearm, without locking the guns up when not in use. This is the modern age. These people act as if there are outlaws or Native Americans waiting to raid the farm that sits several miles away from any neighbor. But it's the modern age. Kids today are much less mature than 100 years ago when guns in the hands of a school-aged child made a bit more sense. Gosh, kids today don't even need to hunt for food! IMO, there is absolutely no need for these types of killings by children to occur. It's senseless, and completely preventable.

If you google there are thousands upon thousands of instances where homeowners or home occupants stopped home invaders/robbers/rapists that were inside their homes or trying to break in.

Due to the media bias against guns these cases don't get much air time, especially if the home occupant only had to point their weapon and not fire. The media's motto is "if it bleeds, it leads" imo.

Here is one and the invader was a known sexual predator among many other things. Wonder what ideas he had in his head when he entered that home? I don't think he was there to break bread with the homeowners.

http://www.lvrj.com/news/39770977.html?numComments=27

A case in my own hometown happened about two years ago. An elderly couple had two young thugs break into their home. The husband shot one of the suspects with his shotgun and the other one fled but was later caught by the police. Both suspects were armed. The homeowner wasn't charged with the death of the suspect he shot inside his home.

imoo

 

[Boyz_Mum]

Your words are golden. Parents need to know their kids. They need to talk with them and, most importantly, truly listen to them.

When this boy expressed that he would like to shoot his step-mom (dad's girlfriend) and people said he was showing signs of jealousy, do any of the articles point to where it was addressed?

 

[Linda7NJ]

I defintiely agree with the looking miserable, eyes are black as in colour not punched! and puffy and red cheeks - so yes he could have been sobbing and sobbing

Just seems odd that he would have been considering he just walked off to school

Mind you going to a REAL JAIL might have made him understand and made him upset at what he had done.

Does anyone know what he did after he shot her ? did he just take his gun and go to another room and put it down ?

But I'd bet all the tears were for HIMSELF!

 

[SuziQ]

I never said he was I said he was heavy set. look at his neck shoulder area.

Oooops. I apologize! I meant to use the term you did and for some reason typed obese. :bang:

 

[Kimster]

I'm not going to argue over the right to own a gun but if you do have them in a house with 3 kids and one on the way it should be locked up.

I totally agree with the above statement.

One thing that needs to be brought out is the step-family issue. For 10 years, I raised someone else's boys. I thought of them as my own. They called me "mom" as all was well for a long time. Then, they became teens and started breaking the law with drugs and other things. I put my foot down. Their dad did not. I went from "mom" to "the b----". Their hatred for me was scary, especially the youngest one who wrote a poem that included me in it on his my space that lied about me and frightened me. Their dad said "oh all kids do that, just ignore it. They don't mean it".

Needless to say, the marriage didn't last and the kids I raised for ten years do not even acknowledge my existence. And they all have records now. (I have two sons who have not followed the same lifestyle in the least!)

The term "blended family" is a joke. Sure, some of them "blend" but for the most part, they are step-families and the kids suffer. I thought ours was "blended" until the kids got into high school, then the truth came out.

 

[Kimster]

BTW, the link I would like to add to support my last post is this: www.stepsforstepmothers.com

 

[Boyz_Mum]

I totally agree with the above statement.

One thing that needs to be brought out is the step-family issue. For 10 years, I raised someone else's boys. I thought of them as my own. They called me "mom" as all was well for a long time. Then, they became teens and started breaking the law with drugs and other things. I put my foot down. Their dad did not. I went from "mom" to "the b----". Their hatred for me was scary, especially the youngest one who wrote a poem that included me in it on his my space that lied about me and frightened me. Their dad said "oh all kids do that, just ignore it. They don't mean it".

Needless to say, the marriage didn't last and the kids I raised for ten years do not even acknowledge my existence. And they all have records now. (I have two sons who have not followed the same lifestyle in the least!)

The term "blended family" is a joke. Sure, some of them "blend" but for the most part, they are step-families and the kids suffer. I thought ours was "blended" until the kids got into high school, then the truth came out.

Kimster, I'm sorry you had that experience with your step-sons. In some ways it might be a blessing that they don't recongnize your existence, given their lifestyle, you've mentioned. I'm glad your sons chose a different path.

Do you feel that in the situation with your stepsons, if their dad would have addressed the issues with them, at the time, it would have helped? If he had stood behind you and "put his foot down" and spoke with them about their behavior, could it have made a difference in your opinion?

:blowkiss:

 

[hannahsnana]

I'm sure this must have been discussed, but where is this boy's mother? What's the story with that?

 

[SuziQ]

It is so tough when one parent doesn't agree with the other parent that there is a problem. I was watching Dr. Phil a couple of years ago and he had a blended family on. The son never accepted his step mom was had always been absolutely evil to her and his step siblings. He made no bones about it. He wanted them out of his life. He had poisoned the family on a couple of occasions and sent them to the hospital. He was currently in a residential treatment program and was scheduled to come home soon. Dad just could not grasp how dangerous his son was and how it would just get worse. IIRC, Dr. Phil flat out told the guy that his son should not return to the family and as the kid aged he was just going to get physically bigger and more dangerous.

 

[Linda7NJ]

Oooops. I apologize! I meant to use the term you did and for some reason typed obese. :bang:

I think he looked grossly over weight, that would be "obese" wouldn it?

Fluffy is a kinder word.....:chicken: