PA PA - Ray Gricar, 59, former district attorney, Bellefonte, 15 Apr 2005 - #17

[SeekingJana]

Many suicides are extremely spur of the moment and the person's mind is focused on the action itself and not any type of communication. When you are about to leave this earth, why should you care what note or letter you left?

Some suicides are planned by the long-depressed, of course, but by and large we are treating more suicidal ideation which seems extremely impulsive compared to 30 years or more ago.

I don't think Ray committed suicide. I don't think LE believes that either, or they'd still have a division looking for remains. I don't care for Ichabod Crane at all but believe Ray had a secret or several with his leave- taking and the police have never divulged this to us. IMO, if they tell anyone. it will be Lara, his daughter, and she'll likely tell Barbara, her mother and Ray's first wife for many years. Next of kin and the two people who likely really did love him.

BTW, I'm getting error messages that my Java console is not functioning correctly on this site so if my post is goofy, I apologize. I thought Java script had been eliminated years ago. Hmmm.

 

[minazoe]

leave taking?

 

[J. J. in Phila]

Snipped for emphasis.

I don't think Ray committed suicide. I don't think LE believes that either, or they'd still have a division looking for remains. I don't care for Ichabod Crane at all but believe Ray had a secret or several with his leave- taking and the police have never divulged this to us.

The former BPD Chief, Duane Dixon, thinks it was suicide. Keep in mind that there were developments after he left.

The PSP also recommend using a "dummy drop," and checking with a hydrologist, to determine where a body could have been found. They were considering the possibility of suicide in 2006, at least. Member Notice - Final Argument Podcast

Keep in mind that many of the thing that could point to walk away could also point to suicide.

1. The computer searches. RFG could have wanted to hide his travel plans. He could have wanted to hide personal information or a journal just as well, knowing that he wouldn't be coming back.

2. His unusual demeanor. Was he looking at walking away from his life or ending it?

Both suicide and walkaway are voluntary and they will have similar characteristics.

 

[Quiet Time]

Idk about the suicide.
I would think he'd leave some sort of note or letter to his daughter, at least.
An explanation of some sort.

Just don't feel a suicide happened.

jmo

 

[J. J. in Phila]

Idk about the suicide.
I would think he'd leave some sort of note or letter to his daughter, at least.
An explanation of some sort.

Just don't feel a suicide happened.

jmo

I give suicide the least likely chance of the three major possibilities, but it was still from and center for LE in 2006. The thing that got minimal suggestions for investigation was foul play. Most of it focuses on something voluntary.

 

[SeekingJana]

I find myself increasingly wondering if I'll live long enough to see the case resolved, regardless of the outcome. It's starting to be a very sad feeling- for Ray, for the collective people who care about him being missing this far out.

 

[J. J. in Phila]

While there was suppose to be a podcast from RK out in November, none came out.

 

[Trackergd]

Ray, wherever you may have gone, based on recent international events, I hope it was not the Ukraine.

Edited to add: I as well hope that we get an answer in my lifetime and continue to be curious why no new Governor or State Attorney General seems to want to do a deep dive into why Ray went missing. Suspect they know something that we do not.

 

[J. J. in Phila]

Ray, wherever you may have gone, based on recent international events, I hope it was not the Ukraine.

Edited to add: I as well hope that we get an answer in my lifetime and continue to be curious why no new Governor or State Attorney General seems to want to do a deep dive into why Ray went missing. Suspect they know something that we do not.

They think it is voluntary, and therefor, no concern of LE. That is my guess.

 

[Deleted member 287549]

Haven't read many of these posts yet; I just heard about this case. As with all missing persons, this RG case is creepy & unusual.

If RG did take his own life somewhere, why has the body never been found? I guess it's possible that if he did this in a remote/wooded area, animals may have eaten the remains. Or, the area may have been so remote that for whatever reason his remains have never been found.

It's also plausible he met with foul play - possibly in retaliation to a case/cases he had worked on?!

I need to listen to the "Final Argument" podcast on this.

 

[J. J. in Phila]

New podcast up from Knight: Final Argument: The Disappearance of Ray Gricar, District Attorney

It is from witness Jennifer Snyder, who was working at the Packwood House Museum and saw RFG and the Mini. Snyder thinks that RFG could have been talking on a cell phone (a burner phone).

Other takeaway is that several other witnesses saw RFG moving around Lewisburg on the afternoon of 4/15/05.

 

[J. J. in Phila]

If RFG was using burner phone, he was trying to hide that communication. Why?

1. Arrangements for a voluntary departure.
2. Hiding a relationship from PEF (and possibly others).
3. Engaging in some unethical or illegal activity, where he did not want a record on his phone.

Those are the only things I can come up with.

The one thing this would not point to is suicide.

 

[Trackergd]

I put illegal activity lower on the list as I doubt Ray would have willingly sullied his reputation.

Voluntary departure or hiding a relationship are possible, however going missing is a bit drastic for being involved in a clandestine relationship.

 

[J. J. in Phila]

I put illegal activity lower on the list as I doubt Ray would have willingly sullied his reputation.

Voluntary departure or hiding a relationship are possible, however going missing is a bit drastic for being involved in a clandestine relationship.

He was retiring and that could make a difference.

RFG may not have intended to go missing. I'm looking at either a lover's quarrel that turned violent, or some health situation or accident that led to his demise. The person he was with, a lover, may not have wanted to explain a dead DA, and hid the body, even if it was not her fault.

 

[minazoe]

JJ I haven't had a chance to listen to the podcast..how does she know it was a burner phone? is it because he was talking on a phone and there are no recorded calls for that time frame? I do plan to listen...but I am curious mOO

 

[J. J. in Phila]

JJ I haven't had a chance to listen to the podcast..how does she know it was a burner phone? is it because he was talking on a phone and there are no recorded calls for that time frame? I do plan to listen...but I am curious mOO

They have the records from RFG's county issued cell phone. No calls were completed after the call to the Courthouse. If he was talking on a phone, it would have to be an unknown one.

Snyder did not actually see a phone; she saw RFG talking and gesturing, but nobody else was present.

 

[Trackergd]

If there was no cell phone, that behavior would be somewhat questionable.

 

[J. J. in Phila]

If there was no cell phone, that behavior would be somewhat questionable.

Yes and no.

First, from the Prison Board meeting the day before, RFG was acting unusually. JKA noticed it that week.

I will admit that I talk to myself incessantly and answer myself. It helps me to ask myself questions and verbalize the answers. I mentioned it to a mental health professional, and did not think it was unusual, so long as I wasn't imagining someone that wasn't there. RFG could have been doing that, thinking out loud.

It could be sign of stress, pointing to either walkaway or suicide.

 

[minazoe]

another something that sounds like possible mania.

 

[J. J. in Phila]

another something that sounds like possible mania.

Well, demeanor points away from foul play. It always has.