Patsy Ramsey

[Anti-K]

My guess is that J&P were staging this together but once J planned to remove the body P called police to prevent this, not caring if it no longer made sense.

Sorry, no go. It was a kidnapping being staged, inherent in that is body disposal. If Mrs Ramsey assisted in the staging then she must have understood that and accepted that.
...

AK

 

[InstantProof]

Sorry, no go. It was a kidnapping being staged, inherent in that is body disposal. If Mrs Ramsey assisted in the staging then she must have understood that and accepted that.
...

AK

I think Patsy would have gone to jail before she would have left JB in the elements. Upset and not thinking clearly it took her some time to understand what was going to happen. Not necessarily my theory on what happened, but in an insanely stressful situation like that it's not hard to consider a married couple may be at odds.

 

[icedtea4me]

The ransom note writer is concerned about sleep/ exhaustion.

I agree. It seems that John's having gone to his bed and gone to sleep was of importance to the note writer.

 

[tovarisch]

I agree. It seems that John's having gone to his bed and gone to sleep was of importance to the note writer.

I missed something. Was a trip planned FOR REAL ? to pick up Who ? Where?

 

[icedtea4me]

John opens the door to the windowless, tomb-like room, unwraps JonBenet from the white blanket shroud, and carries her upstairs. Patsy throws herself on JonBenet's dead body and is reported to have cried out "Jesus! You raised Lazarus from the dead! Please raise my baby!" Maybe Patsy had been praying for just that very thing for hours.

 

[tovarisch]

John opens the door to the windowless, tomb-like room, unwraps JonBenet from the white blanket shroud, and carries her upstairs. Patsy throws herself on JonBenet's dead body and is reported to have cried out "Jesus! You raised Lazarus from the dead! Please raise my baby!" Maybe Patsy had been praying for just that very thing for hours.

May be Patsy was praying Lazarus in between the lines describing her daughter beheading ??? It`s even stronger!

 

[OliviaG1996]

I agree. It seems that John's having gone to his bed and gone to sleep was of importance to the note writer.

This could be the reason PR and JR were seen as very distant and detached from each other by some of the police officers; PR was upset JR could just sleep off whatever happened during the night. Another reason for their detachment could be about their possible differing opinions of what to do-- call 911 or hide the body. JMO.

 

[mochii]

I missed something. Was a trip planned FOR REAL ? to pick up Who ? Where?

The Ramsey's were planning a trip to Michigan, to meet up with John's other children for a second Christmas.

Prahasauarus: I posted before I thought the Ramsey's thought timing was of the essence. The sooner they call the police and get the charade over, the sooner their nightmare is over. A whole day is a huge, long thing to stage as opposed to several hours. Perhaps John was hoping LE would find the body, or maybe he had planned to all along. I don't think either Patsy or John wanted to completely dispose of her body. IMO, I don't think the events played out exactly how the Ramsey's intended it to. I don't know, but to me, it makes perfect sense why they'd call 911 if they were involved.

 

[tovarisch]

The Ramsey's were planning a trip to Michigan, to meet up with John's other children for a second Christmas.

Prahasauarus: I posted before I thought the Ramsey's thought timing was of the essence. The sooner they call the police and get the charade over, the sooner their nightmare is over. A whole day is a huge, long thing to stage as opposed to several hours. Perhaps John was hoping LE would find the body, or maybe he had planned to all along. I don't think either Patsy or John wanted to completely dispose of her body. IMO, I don't think the events played out exactly how the Ramsey's intended it to. I don't know, but to me, it makes perfect sense why they'd call 911 if they were involved.

I was sarcastic, RDI make their point that the killer in his ransom gave "motherly" advice to John to have a good rest before long trip for ransom- JB exchange. I asked them if they think motherly advice was for real , WHAT to exchange and WHO will call to direct driving ? Why killer would be so "motherly" to John about long trip and several lines below not so motherly in describing JB`s beheading ?

They , RDI, answered something about Lazarus. That the killer believed it was still possible. To revive and exchange JB for money.
I`m lost with RDI reasoning.

 

[icedtea4me]

I was sarcastic, RDI make their point that the killer in his ransom gave "motherly" advice to John to have a good rest before long trip for ransom- JB exchange. I asked them if they think motherly advice was for real , WHAT to exchange and WHO will call to direct driving ? Why killer would be so "motherly" to John about long trip and several lines below not so motherly in describing JB`s beheading ?

They , RDI, answered something about Lazarus. That the killer believed it was still possible. To revive and exchange JB for money.
I`m lost with RDI reasoning.

Please point out where I said that JonBenet would be exchanged for money.

 

[tovarisch]

Please point out where I said that JonBenet would be exchanged for money.

You have said in your post # 2244 that you believe that sending John to the bed was of importance of the writer of the note. That sleep of John was supposed to give him strengths before long exhausting trip for the exchange of JB-money.

The answer to this question is important for me, and I`m sure other participant on the thread bc many RDI as well as some experts have based their profiling of the writer on this particular advice to go to sleep and I want to hear clear thinking explanation, please .

Again -- why it was of importance for the writer that John will go to the bed and have a nice rest ?

 

[icedtea4me]

You have said in your post # 2244 that you believe that sending John to the bed was of importance of the writer of the note. That sleep of John was supposed to give him strengths before long exhausting trip for the exchange of JB-money.

The answer to this question is important for me, and I`m sure other participant on the thread bc many RDI as well as some experts have based their profiling of the writer on this particular advice to go to sleep and I want to hear clear thinking explanation, please .

Again -- why it was of importance for the writer that John will go to the bed and have a nice rest ?

Perhaps because the writer sensed in their subconscious that John would be elsewhere doing something else.

 

[tovarisch]

Perhaps because the writer sensed in their subconscious that John would be elsewhere doing something else.

Wait a minute. The note was written after the killing, staged for distraction of the police, is this correct ? Why the writer wanted subconsciously for John to go to the bed AFTER the killing ?

 

[icedtea4me]

Wait a minute. The note was written after the killing, staged for distraction of the police, is this correct ? Why the writer wanted subconsciously for John to go to the bed AFTER the killing ?

No, the writer consciously wanted John to have gone to his bed. (Now think about post #2253.)

 

[tovarisch]

No, the writer consciously wanted John to have gone to his bed. (Now think about post #2253.)

Perhaps I need a rest from this topic, I feel it consciously and subconsciously.

 

[BBB167893]

I've seen this statement before and it bothers me.

Well, I can't take credit for it. Wendy Murphy said it back in 2000.

I understand how it's clever, but at the same time it tends to short-out my brain. It has a 1000 different arguments attached to it. It implies that lying is illegal. Getting caught lying in court is illegal, but that's not true with a...oh, I don't know...a CNN interview. Someone lying during a police interview may not be doing it for the crime--there can be other reasons not associated with the crime. It's for the police to try to get to the bottom of the lie and try to find the truth. There really is no statement read to a suspect, "You have the right to remain silent. If you give up that right, you are required to tell the truth."

It's not a question of lying being illegal (although, making false statements to police can be illegal). It's more a question of, if a person lies to investigators, that makes it that much harder for them to do their job.

Just throw-out what the Ramseys said happened that night and the following morning. Trying to understand what is true and what is a lie when they're clearly being deceptive is next to impossible.

Not always.

 

[BBB167893]

I know that many IDI disagree with Smit on several points, and many have alternative theories.

Like I said, he's Patient Zero, and his theory is most well-known. I guess it's a sign of progress that IDI is breaking from him. (I sure did!)

The sexual assault and the asphyxiation could have occurred simultaneously.
1) tightening of the ligature would have taken a few seconds – one quick, hard pull
2) after one quick, hard pull the ligature would do its work and the killer would be hands free
3) a few minutes would have passed between the tightening of the ligature and the time of death
Now, let’s say that the bladder voids when the ligature is tightened. At this point, the victim is on her stomach. The bladder voids. Urine passes through the panties, the leggings and onto the carpet. The victim is alive but dying, she is at or near point of death.

But wouldn't JB be fighting to pull the garrote away unless she'd already been knocked unconscious?

The killer, hands free while the asphyxiation continues, now rolls the victim over and pulls down the leggings/panties and performs the sexual assault. She is at or near point of death.

But to what purpose?

 

[BBB167893]

I don’t see anything wrong with Kane’s impressions.

Now you've got my attention. Go on.

 

[BBB167893]

Hmm, looks like just behind her right ear to me.

http://crimeshots.com/face1.jpg

Like I said: behind.

 

[BBB167893]

Exactly Prahasaurus.

I think police missed a huge opportunity in not pressing the Ramseys on their inaccuracies during the interviews. In just about every episode of The First 48 Hours I've ever seen, tahts exactly how they get to the bottom of things. Keep pushing until the suspect eventually cracks. Isn't that covered in Interrogation 101???

ST seems to think they had come close, when one of the DA's merry band of morons came in and called a break.

Speaking of interrogation 101, Mary Lacy had words with Tom Haney for doing exactly that. She said he was being too tough on her. Give me a break. The greenest rookie walking a BEAT would know the techniques he used.