People being detained and "exported" by ICE

[otto]

<modsnip: Quoted post was removed> Vasquez Sura told The Post Wednesday that when she asked for protection from Abrego Garcia in 2021 she was “acting out of caution after a disagreement with Kilmar … in case things escalated” after she survived domestic abuse “in a previous relationship.”

Alleged MS-13 member Kilmar Abrego Garcia, deported by Trump admin to El Salvador megaprison, accused of physically abusing wife — who’s fiercely advocating for his return

Garcia’s wife, Jennifer Vasquez, applied for a protective order against her husband in 2021.

nypost.com

What does that have to do with detaining the man and deporting him to a brutal foreign prison?

 

[BayouBelle_LA]

What is the name of this witness?

Can invisible witnesses give evidence at invisible trials to justify detention and deportation of USA citizens?

My guess is he is known and for his protection he is not named. I’m sure they know exactly who he is and he would be identified at a trial imo. There’s a PDF of the gang interview field sheet at the link. I haven’t read it.

imo

 

[BeginnerSleuther]

<modsnip: Quoted post was removed> Even if the DV is true (and God knows I despise those who beat anyone), we have laws in this country. You don't just ship someone off to a foreign prison for life or committing DV on our soil. We don't do it. It's immoral. And if your values and morality aren't up to check, then consider that It's cruel and unusual punishment, which is unConstitutional, and as the Supreme Court has ruled, our Constitutional rights apply to everyone on American soil.

If they want to charge Garcia and try him for DV, fine. Then if they want to deport him because he's a criminal, fine. Deport him. But we don't PAY other countries (even if it's his country of origin) to imprison them for us for life. A lifetime of torture on the American taxpayer's dime?!? For crying out loud, how can we defend something so incredibly heinous? What kind of soulless country are we? What kind of soulless leaders did we put in power?

MOO.

 

[Leilei]

<modsnip: Quoted post was removed>From the NYP article:

Vasquez Sura told The Post Wednesday that when she asked for protection from Abrego Garcia in 2021 she was “acting out of caution after a disagreement with Kilmar … in case things escalated” after she survived domestic abuse “in a previous relationship.”

“Things did not escalate, and I decided not to follow through with the civil court process. We were able to work through this situation privately as a family, including by going to counseling,” she said.

They're digging anything up on this man in order to deflect from what they've done.
IMO.

 

[BeginnerSleuther]

"Now, Trump has a new proposal that sounds similarly suited to light Americans’ tax dollars on fire.

“We’re going to give them a stipend. We’re going to give them some money and a plane ticket, and then we’re going to work with them — if they’re good, if we want them back in — we’re going to work with them to get them back in as quickly as we can.”

..... essentially, the same proposal that earned Mitt Romney mockery during the 2012 presidential race. At the time, even Trump called Romney’s plan “maniacal” and “crazy” and said he thought it helped cost Romney the election."

Trump wants to pay immigrants under a self-deportation program

Trump’s idea to pay immigrants to leave the country would be an obvious and idiotic waste of government money.

www.msnbc.com

If he's going to throw away taxpayer money anyway, I'm sure many would rather it go to paying deportees rather than paying the corrupt government of ES to house them in a torture chamber.

MOO.

 

[otto]

My guess is he is known and for his protection he is not named. I’m sure they know exactly who he is and he would be identified at a trial imo. There’s a PDF of the gang interview field sheet at the link. I haven’t read it.

imo

The law states that an accused is allowed to confront the accuser. Secret witnesses are not part of legal decisions in the USA ... unless the USA is an authoritarian country. In that case, by all means, give all accusers a hood. I'd like one. False accusations for fun!

The was no trial, so the imaginary "secret witness" will never be named.

 

[otto]

From the NYP article:

Vasquez Sura told The Post Wednesday that when she asked for protection from Abrego Garcia in 2021 she was “acting out of caution after a disagreement with Kilmar … in case things escalated” after she survived domestic abuse “in a previous relationship.”

“Things did not escalate, and I decided not to follow through with the civil court process. We were able to work through this situation privately as a family, including by going to counseling,” she said.

They're digging anything up on this man in order to deflect from what they've done.
IMO.

I think he's been murdered. If he is alive, the USA government needs to provide proof.

 

[BeginnerSleuther]

A past proven and reliable source told cops with the Prince George’s County police that Abreago Garcia is an active member of MS-13 with the Westers clique in March 2019, according to the gang interview field sheet.
(…)
The confidential source further advised that he is the rank of “Chequeo” with the moniker of “Chele” and that his clothes were reportedly affiliated with the gang.

Alleged MS-13 gangbanger Kilmar Abrego Garcia’s rank, street name revealed as fight over deportation to El Salvador megaprison rages: docs

The feds have claimed Abrego Garcia is part of the vicious MS-13 gang and that he was illegally in the United States.

nypost.com

You understand he was never convicted of this, right? With good reason. We don't convict people based solely on clothing and some anonymous source.

MOO.

 

[Leilei]

I think he's been murdered. If he is alive, the USA government needs to provide proof.

I sadly agree.

IMO.

 

[otto]

<modsnip: Quoted post was removed>
Trump is racist. He has been making rude, derogatory remarks about people from South America for years.

 

[Lilibet]

Kilmar Abrego Garcia’s wife sought restraining order in 2021, DHS says​

https://www.newsnationnow.com/us-news/immigration/border-coverage/kilmar-abrego-garcias-wife-restraining-order-dhs/

Weird, I heard this a few hours ago yet no msn is reporting it.

Go figure.
Jmo

Well, maybe MSM is taking time to check out the accuracy of this story for themselves, as they should.

JMO

 

[keek]

Trump is racist. He has been making rude, derogatory remarks about people from South America for years.

We all know that is a sign of a very stupid tiny minded person. Fearful of anyone not from his circle. Can't understand, bewildered hence hate. Makes them uncomfortable with themselves.

 

[Lilibet]

This was posted on the Tariff thread by @detective.moon, but I think it belongs here too. Ruth Ben-Ghiat is a well known expert on dictatorships. She answers questions people have posted on the internet. This is not an anti-Trump discussion, although he is mentioned a few times. It is a historical explanation of dictatorships. I encourage…implore…dare everyone to watch this video in order to understand the stakes in this country. And yes, it does mention immigration.

P.S. I watched the White House video posted earlier with Rachel Morin’s mother (heartbreaking but not relevant to Abrego García). So I hope those supporting Trump and Bukele will watch this. Thank you.

 

[otto]

We all know that is a sign of a very stupid tiny minded person. Fearful of anyone not from his circle. Can't understand, bewildered hence hate. Makes them uncomfortable with themselves.

Trump has made incredibly rude racist remarks about people from South America, boldly and publicly accusing South American migrants of cooking up the neighbour's pet and eating that pet for supper. Who says things like that except a radical racist. Who believes it, other than racists.

Who gets all worked up because a Senator cares about an abducted, missing, and presumably murdered man except other racists who don't want the truth to be known. Who intentionally attempts to damage the reputation of the abducted man other than racists who do not want that man to have a voice.

Trump is using distraction and obfuscation to hide information about the abducted man. The world needs proof of life at this point.

 

[branmuffin]

Not sure I have the Magna Carta if a factor. That was the King of England. It may have guided US founding fathers, but was never adopted.

You don't 'adopt' the Magna Carta per se. But what you can do is understand the principle enshrined in that document transformed into the Declaration of Independence. This article can explain it much better than I can.

Magna Carta’s Influence on the Declaration of Independence & U.S. Constitution – Constituting America

constitutingamerica.org

 

[Lilibet]

Trump has made incredibly rude racist remarks about people from South America, boldly and publicly accusing South American migrants of cooking up the neighbour's pet and eating that pet for supper. Who says things like that except a radical racist. Who believes it, other than racists.

Who gets all worked up because a Senator cares about an abducted, missing, and presumably murdered man except other racists who don't want the truth to be known. Who intentionally attempts to damage the reputation of the abducted man other than racists who do not want that man to have a voice.

Trump is using distraction and obfuscation to hide information about the abducted man. The world needs proof of life at this point.

BBM
Thank you for your clear statement about Trump’s racism. Here are just a few of Trump’s horrible comments about people from South America. And yes, we do need proof of life for Mr Abrego García. I agree that he very well may be dead and his blood will be all over Trump’s hands. But it’s OK, these people aren’t human…they’re animals (see quote below).

From 'rapists' to 'eating the pets': Trump has long used degrading language toward immigrants​

Trump’s lies about Haitian immigrants were simply his latest rhetoric that dehumanizes and targets immigrant populations.

www.nbcnews.com

—On the day that Trump launched his first presidential bid in June 2015, he accused Mexico of “not sending the best” people.
“They’re bringing drugs, they’re bringing crime, they’re rapists, and some, I assume, are good people. But I speak to border guards and they’re telling us what we’re getting,” he said, setting the tone for his MAGA movement.

—“I think the real number is 15, 16 million people into our country. When they do that, we got a lot of work to do. They’re poisoning the blood of our country.” [12/16/23]

—“They’re rough people, in many cases from jails, prisons, from mental institutions, insane asylums. You know, insane asylums, that’s ‘Silence of the Lambs’ stuff. ... Hannibal Lecter, anybody know Hannibal Lecter?” [3/4/24]

—“The Democrats say, ‘Please don’t call them animals. They’re humans.’ I said, ‘No, they’re not humans, they’re not humans. They’re animals.’” [4/2/24]

And more…although that is quite enough for anyone with a conscience to be disgusted.

 

[keek]

BBM
Thank you for your clear statement about Trump’s racism. Here are just a few of Trump’s horrible comments about people from South America. And yes, we do need proof of life for Mr Abrego García. I agree that he very well may be dead and his blood will be all over Trump’s hands. But it’s OK, these people aren’t human…they’re animals (see quote below).

From 'rapists' to 'eating the pets': Trump has long used degrading language toward immigrants​

Trump’s lies about Haitian immigrants were simply his latest rhetoric that dehumanizes and targets immigrant populations.

www.nbcnews.com

—On the day that Trump launched his first presidential bid in June 2015, he accused Mexico of “not sending the best” people.
“They’re bringing drugs, they’re bringing crime, they’re rapists, and some, I assume, are good people. But I speak to border guards and they’re telling us what we’re getting,” he said, setting the tone for his MAGA movement.

—“I think the real number is 15, 16 million people into our country. When they do that, we got a lot of work to do. They’re poisoning the blood of our country.” [12/16/23]

—“They’re rough people, in many cases from jails, prisons, from mental institutions, insane asylums. You know, insane asylums, that’s ‘Silence of the Lambs’ stuff. ... Hannibal Lecter, anybody know Hannibal Lecter?” [3/4/24]

—“The Democrats say, ‘Please don’t call them animals. They’re humans.’ I said, ‘No, they’re not humans, they’re not humans. They’re animals.’” [4/2/24]

And more…although that is quite enough for anyone with a conscience to be disgusted.

Then we have the sublife of people who think this is allllllllll just fine, they feel comfortable..they relate. THEY RELATE WITH A 'PRESIDENT'. GAG.

 

[otto]

BBM
Thank you for your clear statement about Trump’s racism. Here are just a few of Trump’s horrible comments about people from South America. And yes, we do need proof of life for Mr Abrego García. I agree that he very well may be dead and his blood will be all over Trump’s hands. But it’s OK, these people aren’t human…they’re animals (see quote below).

From 'rapists' to 'eating the pets': Trump has long used degrading language toward immigrants​

Trump’s lies about Haitian immigrants were simply his latest rhetoric that dehumanizes and targets immigrant populations.

www.nbcnews.com

—On the day that Trump launched his first presidential bid in June 2015, he accused Mexico of “not sending the best” people.
“They’re bringing drugs, they’re bringing crime, they’re rapists, and some, I assume, are good people. But I speak to border guards and they’re telling us what we’re getting,” he said, setting the tone for his MAGA movement.

—“I think the real number is 15, 16 million people into our country. When they do that, we got a lot of work to do. They’re poisoning the blood of our country.” [12/16/23]

—“They’re rough people, in many cases from jails, prisons, from mental institutions, insane asylums. You know, insane asylums, that’s ‘Silence of the Lambs’ stuff. ... Hannibal Lecter, anybody know Hannibal Lecter?” [3/4/24]

—“The Democrats say, ‘Please don’t call them animals. They’re humans.’ I said, ‘No, they’re not humans, they’re not humans. They’re animals.’” [4/2/24]

And more…although that is quite enough for anyone with a conscience to be disgusted.

It's been going on for years, and his supporters drink it up and celebrate that Trump is going to rid the USA of criminals, rapists and murderers. Fact is, the USA has many criminals, rapists and murderers, and stopping migrants will change nothing. Trump is doing what Hitler did. For Trump, the bad guy was born in South America. From Hitler, the bad guy was Jewish. Same strategy.

 

[branmuffin]

i would also like to remind everyone living across the world, the link below is a big reason why many us citizens are and have been upset by illegal immigration policies over the past few years - the cost to us taxpayers. this is in addition to the serious violence inflicted by known/judged illegal ms-13 and tda gang-members. the cost to house them in cecot is far less than we would be facing if things had continued under biden-era immigration policies. i've snipped a quote regarding the fact that even those illegal immigrants who pay taxes cannot balance the overall fiscal burden to our country. also, there are many reasons why nearly every country - if not all -has laws and regulations regarding illegal entry/residence. imo, legal entry and continuing to abide by the laws of the usa is fine. illegal entry and failure to obey our laws isn't fine.

Loading…

www.congress.gov

The fiscal burden of illegal immigration is due to several factors. First, because illegal aliens usually havelow incomes, those who do pay taxes pay little, if anything. Second, illegal aliens incur significant coststo the taxpayer on a daily basis, because public services such as policing, K-12 education, emergencyservices, etc., are provided universally. Further, due to loose eligibility criteria – intentional or otherwise– many illegal aliens receive benefits from federal, state, and local jurisdictions, despite the fact thatthey have no legal status.


jmo

eta - freedom isn't free. there 'ain't no free' people, there's a cost paid by someone living now or gave their lives for freedom and the us constitution/laws. and, respect is earned. imo

I'm curious. The issue of illegal immigrants from Mexico, Central America and to a lesser extent South America has been around for decades. Specifically targeting Biden era immigration policies as a problem is disingenuous at best and an outright lie at worst. Biden was president from 2021 to 2025. Are you trying to tell us that all the problems with illegal aliens just popped up like mushrooms in those four years? Please, we're not stupid. People have been caught in the current immigration dragnet that have been in the US for 40 years. Their children and grandchildren were born there. And whether you want to acknowledge it or not, the majority of them were hard working individuals who provided work in much-needed niches that 'real' Americans wanted no part in - domestic help, agricultural work like fruit pickers, maids and housekeeping, child rearing, painters, roofers, drywallers, etc. Statistics say that the segment of illegal immigrants have much lower levels of criminal activity than bona fide Americans. You might want to couch that in the fact that they stay on the straight and narrow because they are fearful of being deported when the reality is they are so thankful for the ability to live in a country that provides them a level of safety not seen in their own countries and the fact they are essential good. The fact is that most people, whether they are in a country legally or not, are law abiding wanting the best for their families. Like many people who have problems getting out of the cycle of poverty if that's where they find themselves or no more or no less likely to engage in criminal behavior than American born individuals.

 

[branmuffin]

i would also like to remind everyone living across the world, the link below is a big reason why many us citizens are and have been upset by illegal immigration policies over the past few years - the cost to us taxpayers. this is in addition to the serious violence inflicted by known/judged illegal ms-13 and tda gang-members. the cost to house them in cecot is far less than we would be facing if things had continued under biden-era immigration policies. i've snipped a quote regarding the fact that even those illegal immigrants who pay taxes cannot balance the overall fiscal burden to our country. also, there are many reasons why nearly every country - if not all -has laws and regulations regarding illegal entry/residence. imo, legal entry and continuing to abide by the laws of the usa is fine. illegal entry and failure to obey our laws isn't fine.

Loading…

www.congress.gov

The fiscal burden of illegal immigration is due to several factors. First, because illegal aliens usually havelow incomes, those who do pay taxes pay little, if anything. Second, illegal aliens incur significant coststo the taxpayer on a daily basis, because public services such as policing, K-12 education, emergencyservices, etc., are provided universally. Further, due to loose eligibility criteria – intentional or otherwise– many illegal aliens receive benefits from federal, state, and local jurisdictions, despite the fact thatthey have no legal status.


jmo

eta - freedom isn't free. there 'ain't no free' people, there's a cost paid by someone living now or gave their lives for freedom and the us constitution/laws. and, respect is earned. imo

As an addendum to my prior comment, you list the issues that are a burden on public services like emergency services and policing. As far as I can tell those services are readily available to other people who are not American citizens, eg. tourists and long term visitors with legal status like snowbirds who spend several months in the US in the winter. Are you going to start kicking them out the country, too? I mean, most of them are elderly probably with health issues. They may have health insurances from their countries but they are still going to be utilizing your doctors, hospitals, your ambulance services and policing services. About 1 million Canadian snowbirds enter the US every fall. If a undocumented immigrant and a snowbirder never engage any of those services are they showing respect? Are they getting respect? How does respect enter the calculation? I'd hazard a guess that a large swath of born and bred Americans have zero respect for the rule of law. IMO