Peru - Stephany Flores, 21, murdered in Lima hotel room, 30 May 2010 #5

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  • #201
I'm not sure. I think maybe because they had been drinking and her age. I remember doing things at that age that in hindsight weren't the best decisions. There was just something about that video where she seemed ashamed to me. That video was very chilling to me, Joran's arrogance at the front desk, did he know at that point he would kill her? And that last scene of her following him into the room. So sad...

I don't think he planned to kill her in that moment.

I think he planned to take what he wanted from her (money in my opinion).

Even at his level of arrogance he could not have possibly thought hey let me take this girl back to a room that is registered in my name, where I am on video with the victim, and I have no way to dispose of the body.

If anyone on this planet knows no body/no crime is the best defense, it is Joran.
 
  • #202
I've no idea if JVDS is a serial killer or not but it is a possibility. Some were wondering how he could come out of the room so calmly. What I have read about serial killers is they have a need to kill that keeps building and feel a release once they have done it and are calm again. Again, I've no idea if this is true of JVDS.
 
  • #203
Maybe something to do with her being mad or sad after the discussion with father about not wanting to go out again (if that part was true). I say this because by her text sounds like she was going to her room. Perhaps they argued again and she left. Runs into JVDS she tells him her story and he tells her to come on and hang out in his room where something terribly goes wrong...Just a thought...

We know that she did return home & sent the text to her friends that she was going to bed. Maybe Joran then texted her to meet up with him back at the casino for more play, to hang out, whatever.
 
  • #204
I'm becoming more confused with each new bit of info.

Now we hear video tracked the couple walking before dawn Sunday from the
casino to Joran's hotel. (a 15 minute walk). Where was her car? Why walk?
Didn't we all think her car would be with her wherever she was at the time?
I'm totally confused on this. Had she already left her car at his place?
I wouldn't think so, but at the end of the story that's where it was.

Had anyone else wondered how be smuggled the murder weapon into the room?
Was he carrying a bag large enough to hold a tennis racket?
I got to noticing the large, "loose shirt" he was wearing and thinking maybe he
could even conceal one under that shirt??? Anyway if a tennis racket was found
to be the murder weapon- to me that proves premeditation!! That is not an item
usually supplied with a hotel room!
Besides...we also heard that they did drive to the hotel and he later moved her car further away.
Does anyone know if we've been able to match the time stamps on all of the videos?
 
  • #205
if he went and got coffee and she was still alive, maybe she was going thru his stuff when he got back....hmm he might not like that.
personally i think she was dead between 6&7 a.m. He was just too cool at departure time for the crime to have just been committed
You know, the rush, adrelin flow, etc.
 
  • #206
I read a link today that Peru's Interior Minister has essentially gagged the Peruvian press unless they have his consent. I think that's a good idea.

He gagged the authorities. Peru has the same constitutional freedom of the press as the US does. I think it's a good idea too, but it could be a double-edged sword for Joran - if the press can't get to the authorities, they can't see what the authorities are doing to Joran. That could be very bad for him.
 
  • #207
He gagged the authorities. Peru has the same constitutional freedom of the press as the US does. I think it's a good idea too, but it could be a double-edged sword for Joran - if the press can't get to the authorities, they can't see what the authorities are doing to Joran. That could be very bad for him.

Thanks for clearing that up, sorry for my mistake. I think the Peruvians will be fair to him, the whole world is watching (not that they wouldn't be fair to him otherwise!).
 
  • #208
I don't think he planned to kill her in that moment.

I think he planned to take what he wanted from her (money in my opinion).

Even at his level of arrogance he could not have possibly thought hey let me take this girl back to a room that is registered in my name, where I am on video with the victim, and I have no way to dispose of the body.

If anyone on this planet knows no body/no crime is the best defense, it is Joran.
Amen to that last part! That is exactly why I don't believe it was premeditated ~ meaning planned before entering the hotel room. I still am going back to him planning to drug her, rob her of her money, and her waking up later on not knowing what had happened. Only something went terribly wrong, maybe just like five years prior. MOO
 
  • #209
I too am not comfortable with this but the sarcastic part of me wants to say that he should have picked another country to commit his crime.

I watched as Joran was bought to the border and imagined how difficult it will be to get a fair trial in a country where the victim's father is so well connected. He is a gringo in a latin country and all sorts of gross speculation is circulating the media. First he stabbed her or he viciously beat her with a bat. By the time the real truth comes out it will be too late. It could have been an argument gone bad. But because of what happened with NH it's hard to give this guy a fair chance. As an American we want eveyone to have a fair trial even if they are creeps and predators. It doesn't look like this is going to happen for Joran.

Hi French Vixen. I'm not attacking your post. I am jumping off some things that were said. :)

All of the below is my humble opinion, based on the fact that I am an American and I have lived outside of the USA for extended periods of time.

First, I think it's important for us to keep in mind that Joran is not an American citizen. Therefore, what we consider American rights and freedoms to not pertain to him.

Second, Peru has it's own laws and culture and I learned a very long time ago (from the experience of living outside of the USA for an extended period of time) that citizens of other countries must abide by the laws of the country they are either living in or visiting. As I said I do not know what Peruvian law is and I do not know their legal system as of yet, but I do intend to read up on it once I get settled into my new home (we are now in the Pacific).

We must be cautious not to assume that because JVDS is a foreigner to Peru that he will automatically be railroaded and that the justice system in Peru is corrupt only because it is different from ours. (I am aware of anecdotal cases of imprisonment within Peru by foreigners). But at this point in time I'm going to have to refrain from passing judgement on their legal system until I see exactly how it works. JMHO.

The only term I take issue with is to refer to JVDS as a "gringo" It has been my personal experience that that particular term is used for the most part as a slur against someone of caucasian race. However, I understand the reason it was chosen when I looked at it in the context of the sentence. Again, I will say (I've said it here on WS many times in the past) Hispanic is an ethnicity, not a race. IMHO JVDS' race will not be an issue.

I can't say if JVDS will get a fair trial or not at this point but I will say this: When any of us travel to Country of which we are not a citizen, our rights and civil liberties extended to us by our native country no longer apply. We are at the mercy of the country in which we break their laws. (I have lot's of stories I could share about personally seeing fellow Americans breaking laws in various Countries).

Most importantly, I have learned that the media will usually report incorrect information in the rush to get info out. Happens in the US media so much it's aggravating and confusing to the point of peeving most of us off! Add to that the language translations, (even Peruvian dialect to the dialect of other Spanish speaking countries then into English or other languages and you got yourself a hot mess IMHO).
 
  • #210
Well, it needs to be gagged if they can't get the facts straight plus the citizens are complaining this story is a diversion so they don't know what's going on in the jungle. (whatever that means)
 
  • #211
Exclusieve beelden Joran van der Sloot

Exclusive video Joran van der Sloot

De Telegraaf heeft exclusieve beelden gemaakt van Joran van der Sloot, op het moment dat hij net de grens over was gezet vanuit Chili naar Peru.

'De Telegraaf' has taken an exclusive video of Joran van der Sloot the moment he just crossed the border from Chile to Peru.

Op de beelden is te zien hoe een zwijgende Joran, gehuld in een kogelvrij vest van Interpol, wordt overgedragen door de Chileense autoriteiten aan de Peruaanse autoriteiten.

The video shows a silent Joran, wearing a bulletproof vest, being 'handed over' by Chile authorities to Peruvian authorities.


The video can be viewed here. I hope there's someone here who can understand what they're sayin'.

WOW, very interesting video! I would love to know what was going through Joran's mind while he was sitting there. So uncanny that he sits there so calm. I wonder just how much he understands what they are saying since I have read several times he is not that fluent in Spanish. It is not uncommon to come across someone that cannot speak Spanish well but can understand if fairly well when someone is talking in Spanish.

Did anyone notice that it almost looked like he was chewing gum about 4 minutes into the video? Not that it matters but before that when showing footage of him it did not look like he was chewing anything.

As I sat here and watched that video - I just am not able to understand how someone can be so dis-attached from doing the horrible things he has done - like it is nothing and they just go on with their life with their arrogant, self-righteous attitude. I mean.... if I passed him on the street and never had met him before or had no idea what he has done, he does not look like a killer and someone full of rage. There are many criminals out there that DO NOT HAVE that look. However I have seen pictures of many criminals that LOOK LIKE CRIMINALS. Do you know what I mean?
 
  • #212
if he went and got coffee and she was still alive, maybe she was going thru his stuff when he got back....hmm he might not like that.
personally i think she was dead between 6&7 a.m. He was just too cool at departure time for the crime to have just been committed
You know, the rush, adrelin flow, etc.
I also believe her death took place closer to the time of arrival than inbetween him returning with the coffee and leaving for good ~ for another reason. What would they have been doing in the room for over two hours if she wasn't "interested" in him? If she were able to I would think she would've left the room long before the time he went out for coffee. And if she were able to, why didn't she go get the coffee with him? :waitasec: MOO
 
  • #213
I might be barking up the wrong tree here about the angel's trumpet. According to wikipedia the active ingredient in that plant is scopalamine which was previously used as a TRUTH SERUM.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Scopolamine#Addiction

The plant is also known as Hell's Bells.

Maybe Joran was using it? Effects of ingestion of datura [family of plants that includes angel's trumpets] -

A complete inability to differentiate reality from fantasy (delirium, as contrasted to hallucination);

hyperthermia; tachycardia;

bizarre, and possibly violent behavior;

and severe mydriasis with resultant painful photophobia that can last several days.

Pronounced amnesia is another commonly reported effect.

It could explain the lip-licking.
 
  • #214
I'm not sure. I think maybe because they had been drinking and her age. I remember doing things at that age that in hindsight weren't the best decisions. There was just something about that video where she seemed ashamed to me. That video was very chilling to me, Joran's arrogance at the front desk, did he know at that point he would kill her? And that last scene of her following him into the room. So sad...

Thank you. Yes, BTDT too. By the grace of God, I'm still here.
Agree that their whole interaction in the video is very odd and disturbing. I don't know if he knew at that point if he wanted to kill her, but I think he was striking one up for himself in maybe scoring or getting money from her in some way. His smirk upon getting the room key, and fumbling with (IMO) her keys in the other hand prior, says he was definitely planning and succeeding at that point.
 
  • #215
I also believe her death took place closer to the time of arrival than inbetween him returning with the coffee and leaving for good ~ for another reason. What would they have been doing in the room for over two hours if she wasn't "interested" in him? If she were able to I would think she would've left the room long before the time he went out for coffee. And if she were able to, why didn't she go get the coffee with him? :waitasec: MOO

ITA. Also, I don't see him as the type to go get coffee for a woman. Just look at the disrepect he has for her, walking in front of her, walking into the hotel room first, etc.
 
  • #216
I just have a thought about Stacey going back to the room with JVDS.

Eventually we will probably find out why. But I wanted to share something that I am trying to now teach my teenages before they come of age and venture out into the world on their own.

That is in my personal experience for the most part, we tend to judge the trustworthiness of others by our own trustworthiness. Meaning, if you, yourself, will not rob, assault, lie to others then you (especially when young) assume others in your company are going to treat you the same way.

There's no telling why she went to his room but once she stepped across the threshhold she was in his world. I do believe that JVDS is severly personality disordered and probably can appear to be quite harmless to anyone that does not know him and what he is capable of doing. She never stood a chance against him once he had her in his company. Bless her heart.
 
  • #217
just read the story on prison life in Peru....seems perfect for JVS.

but i doubt he will last very long.
 
  • #218
(respectfully snipped)

The Dutch criminal law is ridiculous in my opinion. When you rape someone here, chances are that you spend only 2 years (!!) in prison where you have your own private cell with tv and sometimes even a playstation. Prisoners can cook their own food and can call someone every day. It's like sleeping at the Hilton only the pool is missing.

Which makes me wonder if Joran thought he could run ram shod over other countries, committing crimes along the way, and only have to face the penal system in his native Netherlands or Aruba.
 
  • #219
TRUTH SERUM
I am all for that!
 
  • #220
Well, it needs to be gagged if they can't get the facts straight plus the citizens are complaining this story is a diversion so they don't know what's going on in the jungle. (whatever that means)

LOVE IT!!!! :clap:
 
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