GUILTY PLEA DEAL ACCEPTED - 4 Univ of Idaho Students Murdered, Bryan Kohberger Arrested, Moscow, Nov 2022 #114

[whirrledpeas]

His DNA on the sheath imo

Yeah but it was touch dna which isn’t very strong. Still dna though.

 

[gremlin444]

Touch dna is still DNA but could easily try to be explained away because it was touch. I’ve read through almost all of the doc dump and they really just didn’t have a lot. Some but not a lot. JMO

Given the other agencies working on the case--Latah County Sheriff, Idaho State Police, and the FBI, we are only seeing a small amount of the information. And I'd be utterly shocked if we ever got much info from the FBI. Additionally, there are sealed court documents which may or may not end up being unsealed and released.

I don't think there is going to be a mega bombshell in the remaining documents. I think there will be some more things we don't know, and then a lot of other things that serve to round out the picture on the information that we have.

There's always going to be evidence that doesn't add up to much on its own, but when put in combination with other pieces of evidence creates a fuller picture--whether that's to motive, methods, etc. And some of those things would be things that wouldn't have come in at trial due to the very strict rules of evidence.

AT could try to hand wave away the dna on the sheath, which would require us to believe that it's all just an unfortunate coincidence that BK made a purchase on Amazon several months before the murders of the same type of knife sheath (which, I saw upon glancing through the docs had some identifying number on it--serial, lot?) that had his DNA on it as well as a knife that the ME said was highly consistent with the stab/slicing wounds and yet he somehow no longer has the knife or sheath to prove to LE that the one at the site couldn't be his. But when the other details that show a striking similarity between him and whoever committed the murders are added on to the DNA (having a car that is the same model and color as the one caught on the next door security camera with only a back plate in a region where most cars have 2), having an educational background with studies that provided him with a lot of knowledge on forensic evidence and how to avoid leaving it, etc....then we end up with a level of unluckiness for BK that starts approaching that of Scott Peterson. IMHO.

And when AT is ready to explain to us by what roundabout means BK's touch DNA made it into the tiny grooves of the knife sheath, I'm willing to listen and evaluate that.

 

[DizzyB]

The speculation I've read - eg Gray Hughes, but also others - is it may have had a lot to do with his lawyers advice.

She did everything she could to try to make it a case she could defend, even up to the last minute - eg motions to get things included or excluded at the trial, but all those motions were denied.

So, if she didn't believe she could win the case against him, it was in his own best interests for her to advise him to get a deal and at least save his life. And, as a defendent should do, he followed his lawyer's advice.

IMO, he first spoke his family and confessed to them, and they agreed he should plead guilty.

JMO

If he did confess to his family, I picture it being with the same flat affect he had in the courtroom. They could have even been victims of him, who knows. Did he have any feelings for them? I believe there was something in his alleged online writings that said he did not.

 

[Warwick7]

https://twitter.com/x/status/1950984008730550510

 

[MissyRie]

Yeah but it was touch dna which isn’t very strong. Still dna though.

It was touch dna on a sheath that they had proof that he purchased. That’s way more than “just” touch dna.

 

[Warwick7]

I know he has pleaded guilty and I believe that he IS guilty, but something has been semi-bothering me.

Why do you think he entered a plea so close to trial? Bill Thompson admitted at the press conference that he had no online or offline connections to any of them. No motive. No murder weapon. No forensic computer data.

Is there maybe something in discovery that came through that made him take the plea? Something damning?

Yes.... He realized AT couldn't blame it on someone else.

 

[cottonweaver]

IMO

This murderer is sick in the head.

I doubt even he understands why murderous urges possessed him.

Nobody knows or will know.
Psychiatrists can only guess.

I think his parents and sisters ask themselves the same questions over and over again.
And they will till they die.
With no exact answer.

Sometimes
even we don't understand our motives,
(as they are often subconscious)
so how can we understand other people?

JMO

yes for sure, nobody is a mind-reader so nobody can prove exactly why X does Y but Thompson is stretching credulity wrt to FBI profilers' role there.

Thompson said ' Um as they were looking at the case, even just the little we knew then. They were telling us in all likelihood we would never find out '

It's what the FBI's behaviorists and profilers do, day in, day out - endeavour to understand ( goal- prevention & detection)
Analyse crimes and give investigators scenarios in the hope their profiles help identify a perp type.
So, they'll have given probability on a range of motives too, and will have supplied options such as- likely psycho-sexual and others may have said revenge- rage- rejection etc

If Thompson was correct this would also mean there's no value to BAU going in to interview & study him as they've done with all the other SKs and mass murderers over the last 50 years.

Peter Van Sant has to ask the same question in four different ways because he's not satisfied.
Personally I think the plea deal itself was the right choice but that's a different issue and beyond the scope of my point in my post

ETA - also that FBI unit is arguably the best, most experienced in the world

 

[Cedars]

I believe there was something in his alleged online writings that said he did not.

Yes - I recall some online posts from a long time ago, when he was a teen, he shared he felt cold towards his father and perhaps other family members, and he regretted it. He wasn't bragging about it.

Anyone's psychology and mental states are very complex. For eg, perhaps at the time of those postings, he was clinically depressed. A lot of things happened after that, including addiction and addiction recovery, in some ways trying to turn his life around, getting caught up with violent porn, killing people, driving home across the country with his father, getting caught in a massive raid at his family's home over that Christmas vacation, spending a long time in prison awaiting trial..

IMO his attitudes to his family would fluctuate a lot over that time.

I guess when humans are replaced by robots, and there is the AI robot that's been programmed to only express one emotion ever, it will be a big relief to not have to deal with those pesky complicated humans any more.

JMO

 

[Boxer]

Memory unlocked. I used a roll of nickels in my first fight, back when I was a little "stormier" than I am now in my old age.

I think it was the butt of the K-bar that made the marks on KG. moo

Agree. And the knife is made for it.

 

[PunishThenForgive]

48 Hours interview with Bill Thompson.

SBM

Other highlights from the podcast version of the 48 Hours interview with Prosecutor Bill Thompson shared by @MassGuy:

When asked “Wasn't it your responsibility to take this case as far as you could, so that he gets the maximum penalty that is in Idaho law? What do you say to that?,” here is Thompson’s response:

I would say that it's my responsibility as a prosecutor to do justice. Prosecutors who blindly go into court on an agenda, I think, are doing a disservice to their profession and the public. This case and his actions certainly deserve the death penalty if we had had to go to trial.

When asked “When do you believe the Kohberger family realized that their son was the murderer in this case?,” Thompson responded:

I don't know for sure. When the investigators spoke with them after his arrest, there was nothing the investigators heard or saw to suggest that the family knew that Mr. Kohberger was responsible for this information we have, and the defense maintained his factual innocence all the way up to the time of the plea would suggest to us that he never acknowledged guilt to his family quite possibly, not until he stood up in court on July 2nd and entered his guilty pleas. As his parents were there at that time, that may very well have been the first time they actually heard it.

Finally, here is Thompson’s last message to the murderer if he happens to listen to the podcast episode:

Goodbye and good riddance.

I concur.

 

[Dotta]

SBM

Other highlights from the podcast version of the 48 Hours interview with Prosecutor Bill Thompson shared by @MassGuy:

When asked “Wasn't it your responsibility to take this case as far as you could, so that he gets the maximum penalty that is in Idaho law? What do you say to that?,” here is Thompson’s response:



When asked “When do you believe the Kohberger family realized that their son was the murderer in this case?,” Thompson responded:



Finally, here is Thompson’s last message to the murderer if he happens to listen to the podcast episode:



I concur.

Re the message

Famous Last Words hehehe

 

[LinasK]

I know he has pleaded guilty and I believe that he IS guilty, but something has been semi-bothering me.

Why do you think he entered a plea so close to trial? Bill Thompson admitted at the press conference that he had no online or offline connections to any of them. No motive. No murder weapon. No forensic computer data.

Is there maybe something in discovery that came through that made him take the plea? Something damning?

First of all Thompson said that they didn't find a connection, not that there wasn't one. I also read that Thompson said that he DID believe that one of the girls on the 3rd floor- either Maddie or Kaylee WAS his target. Secondly, they didn't need the murder weapon. they had his DNA on the sheath. 3) Kohlberger ran out of road on his defense. I think it was his attorney who convinced him to plea when they couldn't use the SODDI defense.

 

[jesse]

The problem with using the empty house to test acoustics is that empty houses have echo that is not present when filled with furniture.

You can also not really duplicate the experience of being a 19-year-old, half-awake at 4am and possibly drunk.

The house itself didn't have significant evidentiary value, imo.

 

[LinasK]

Touch dna is still DNA but could easily try to be explained away because it was touch. I’ve read through almost all of the doc dump and they really just didn’t have a lot. Some but not a lot. JMO

They also had the CCTV footage that Dateline aired of him in his car speeding away from the house, and cell phone data. It was a STRONG case against him.

 

[jesse]

I am just jumping off here because you mentioned the food sack. While I am not a DD type of person, when I was in college I was definitely a JITB person. The tacos were cheap eats. (Taco Bell was a favorite as well) The bags either ended up in my car or the kitchen table or the kitchen counter until such time as I got around to cleaning them up (or someone else got the cleaning bug) usually the next day, but during busy times they'd stay a week. Strangely, the contents were usually gone and trashed, but the bag remained (I think because I thought I'd use it for something else.) My car could get pretty bad in a week because the food packaging was always in the bag if I ate in there. If I didn't have any spare hands, then the bag(s) remained in the car until I did have spare hands on exit.

While I, personally, believe that is the DD bag from that night and I also believe it was moved around by investigators, I don't rule out that that particular bag could have been from another day because my life experience is not a neat and orderly one. I don't, however, think Xana placed the bag behind the sink. That is a crazy place to put a paper bag, unless there was no room in the trash can (possible).

I agree, and I said the same in this thread a week or so ago. It's a bag from JITB, but we don't know that it's THE bag. Xana may have done late-night ordering from there frequently. Considering how quickly BK entered the house after the DD driver left, I wonder did X take the contents out, stash the bag behind the sink, and go upstairs with her food? Surely she didn't have time to sit and eat it.

I think it's probably the bag... but I'm not absolutely certain of it. I wonder if it will be referenced in one of the doc drops. I'm surprised it wasn't already.

 

[jesse]

I may be very wrong but as long as he minds his business most others will mind theirs

I'm not sure he'll be able to mind his own business (reference the alleged screaming at the prisoner whom BK thought was cursing at BK's mother, but was actually watching sports on TV and talking to it).

A hair-trigger temper and inner rage won't do him well.

 

[Boxer]

You can also not really duplicate the experience of being a 19-year-old, half-awake at 4am and possibly drunk.

The house itself didn't have significant evidentiary value, imo.

Agree. And it needed 24/7 security as it was becoming a macabre creepy attraction.

 

[gremlin444]

I know he has pleaded guilty and I believe that he IS guilty, but something has been semi-bothering me.

Why do you think he entered a plea so close to trial? Bill Thompson admitted at the press conference that he had no online or offline connections to any of them. No motive. No murder weapon. No forensic computer data.

Is there maybe something in discovery that came through that made him take the plea? Something damning?

I think the decision was made after Judge Hippler filed his orders to deny the use of the 4 alternate suspects in his defense and denied the defense's motion to continue, both signed on Thursday, June 26 (one of them has the 27th on it as the date it was put in the Idaho case file on the website).

I think it was the combo of the two--no, you can't bring in these weak alternate suspects on hearsay and no, we aren't delaying the trial because you are still trying to find some mitigating factor in his extended family history that might stop him from getting the death penalty (which, IMHO, implies AT had already accepted that he was going to be found guilty so she was going to need all the mitigation she could get).

Edited to add--the judge's orders came on Thursday, June 26. The plea deal was publically announced on Monday, June 30. Seems a pretty direct link.

 

[NottaYutz]

I’m just now understanding what an incel is, I had no idea it was an organized online movement that draws in young males. Guys get pulled in like being recruited or radicalized.
Most think of Andrew Tate, Elliot Rodger come to mind, and how they have BK to celebrate.

Type incel into Google, there is some kind of public discussion forum, and my guess is there are groups everywhere- all over the world.

Take a look at the YouTube video of DM’s victim impact statement- the comments section.
It is terrifying how these young men think, and they are anonymous, feel brave, and hype each other up, and celebrate events like BKs murders.

And it doesn’t just include harm to women- who are referred to as “Stacy”
It also includes harm to young men who are successful with these women- called “Chad”

Speaking for myself, and likely most people, I knew the word and the type but had no idea it was an organized community
IMO

There are Beckys and Stacys. Below is a good summation article about incels. I read the Elliot Rodger manifesto after his murder spree, and found it immensely disturbing; classic narcissistic personality disorder IMO.

Incels Categorize Women by Personal Style and Attractiveness

There are “Stacys” and there are “Beckys.”

www.vox.com

 

[Warwick7]

First of all Thompson said that they didn't find a connection, not that there wasn't one. I also read that Thompson said that he DID believe that one of the girls on the 3rd floor- either Maddie or Kaylee WAS his target. Secondly, they didn't need the murder weapon. they had his DNA on the sheath. 3) Kohlberger ran out of road on his defense. I think it was his attorney who convinced him to plea when they couldn't use the SODDI defense.

Thank you for saying this.

I feel anxiety sometimes when I read some of the posts. I hope I'm not stepping on anyone's feeling when I say that I don't want to hear from prosecutors and LE that they didn't find a connection, they have no idea what the motive was, that they don’t have anything, that they can't prove why.....

It's not rocket science.

He wanted to kill.

He was at that home 23+ times.

He was around that house even before KG and DM moved in.

Maddie was stabbed and killed. In my own opinion he couldn't have wanted to abduct her. Why? Because to say the least she had stab wounds to her liver and lung.

He wanted to kill.

He waited till they were terribly inebriated and late in the night.

It's not rocket science, he wanted to kill.