Prosecutors have new material and information that they dont want released to the pub

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I think the biggest "mystery" about this motion is NOT the "WHO" (is being investigated) but more of the "WHY" is SA requesting that the defense NOT be present!

To date, there have been no allegations (apart from a few bloggers) that the prosecution has operated in an underhanded method, has purposely withheld or hidden evidence from the defense, has "leaked" information to the media, or any other unsavory behavior. They have shown to be very experienced, dotting every I, crossing every T.

Filed with this motion was a motion for discovery schedule, etc and in this proposal, which I believe JS will grant since it was he who requested that the SA and defense meet and set up a schedule, all discovery is to be exchanged at the earliest by August.

SO....

If SA is still investigating this "new material and information" and are not required to pass the info to the defense until the investigation is complete, and if granted, have until at least August 2010 to do so, why are they wanting to go before JS to ask his permission?????? And why do they not want the defense to witness this? Makes absolutely no sense that SA has now decided to be sneaky and underhanded...

IF this "new material and information" is related to only DC, CA/GA, Lee, or any other witness, why would SA be opposed to the defense hearing the following...

"JS....we have recently received new material and information from LE that we believe is very important to the case and warrants further investigation. We would like your permission to refrain from releasing this information to the defense until it is fully investigated." If pushed, why couldn't the defense hear..."We are currently investigating DC (or GA/CA/Lee)..."

I just don't get why SA would find it so important that defense team not be privy to this conversation (re: stating "who" they are investigating but not the "why")

HOWEVER...

If the conversation were similar to the following....

"JS....we have recently received new material and information from LE that we believe is very important to the case and warrants further investigation. We would like your permission to refrain from releasing this information to the defense until it is fully investigated. We have evidence that the defense team has (or may have) been involved in impeding the investigation into the recovery of Caylee's remains and would like your opinion on how to proceed."

Now I CAN understand why they would not want the defense privy to this conversation....

So again...question to me is not the "WHO" but the "WHY"

You've made an excellent point! The WHY is the most important aspect of the prosecution's request. I think it pertains directly to the defense team, which is why it's been requested that they not be present. But, I do think the WHO is also important because if it's any of those close to the investigation, ie: DC, CA, GA, or LA, that would be a particularly sensitive investigation, which the defense could exploit. The new material and information may pertain indirectly to the case, a parallel case under investigation, such as withholding of or tampering with evidence.
 
Still listening to the video
And yes thanks Harmony
TM said Hoover was on a search site on Nov, 8?
This is before Hoover and DC go searching in the woods on Nov. 15, which he tapes :waitasec:

Yes and I think Hoover had "big pants-itus" too, he claimed he was working for the A's and would loose his job --- yet, didn't he testify he just came out to help! Lots of "shady" characters in this story - but I think once he really realized what he was involved with, he ran his video and came clean -- certainly to keep from being part of anything fraudulent. IMHO, etc

Oh, and I bet "BEAR" was already on the way to Texas and GL by then! wink, wink!
 
Thank you sooo much!! That settles it for me, she says the Anthonys sent her the bear, she had been e mailing back and forth and she had spoken to him before. There is absolutely no chance, zero, that Cindy did not get the truth out of Casey on those nights home on bail that she slept alone in the room with her. Cindy knew where the baby was. This explains the difference in her reaction of shock and horror when LP was searching at Blanchard Park compared to not rushing to the scene of the woods once she and George departed the plane (having heard that remains were found near their home). Can you imagine Beth Holloway rushing to the scene if she received a phone call that possibly the remains of her daughter were found? Did the Anthonys even go to the scene? No. They went to the Ritz, had dinner and took walks. People tell on themselves.
It is a fact that detectives heard Cindy say that she had sent someone to the woods. There is no getting around that.
It is possible this gal was on the phone with Dom and also possible that it is Cindy who set it up.

Surely even Dom could see that there is no reason to imagine that these folks would treat him any differently than they had everyone else if it would suit their purpose. He saw first hand that they would go in to a discredit and destroy mode in two seconds flat if they set their sites on anyone that could deflect attention away from Casey, Amy, Jesse, the Grunds, Ricardo, Tony, Kronk. What is that saying of Dr. Phil's ...if they will do it with you ...they will do it to you. A lot of time has passed and emotion has faded. Infatuations are fleeting and enough time has passed that the fog of any unrequited romantic notion he may have had toward Cindy has lifted.

I think he may have taken a number of steps to cover his butt, just in case, he may have recorded and memorialized things, handed over his bat phones and everything else he had been gathering over this year and half.

Someone who has nothing to hide, hides nothing. The lengths he has gone to and the protracted fight he has put up to avoid testifying ( for a year ) indicate he has things that are damaging. That is a given. We know there is no love loss between he and Baez as he did not hesitate to make a bar complaint against him. It was apparent in the recent hearing when Baez did a double take to Andrea when Ms. Tennis told the judge that Dom would be perfectly willing to testify if the Anthonys would waive their confidentiality agreement terms, and that he had been communicating back and forth with the defense over time, apparent that Baez was shocked by that remark. The inference we can draw from Baez finding that so incredible was that no... Dom and the defense do not have a perpetual relationship, quite the opposite. So, he hasn't been silent to protect Casey. That leaves us with mom and pop. George has stated publicly ( in the ZFG depo) that he rarely ever speaks to Dom. That leaves us with Cindy. She hasn't divorced, as he may have imagined she would by now. So there he is as many have pointed out, unpaid and his reputation a joke in his industry, didn't get the girl.....

so reality has set in. The judge did tell the state to go ahead and use the time they had scheduled and exercise their right by statute to question him under an investigative subpoena, so I trust that did happen. He had no reason not to answer any questions, as I am sure the judge set him straight about real quickly. Remember the judge told Ms. Drane-Burdick to call him if there was a problem? Mr. Hornsby explained to us that the judge meant that literally, call during the depo and the judge will rule over the phone as to any objections. It may have been with a heavy heart, but in my opinion, Dominic did answer questions and supply any all items related to the case he has compiled, including the phones, his computer and anything else they asked for. Even hard core lifetime mafia members squeal when it comes down to the me or them question. The best he could do for Cindy, he did, which was delay the inevitable.

The fact that he suddenly closed up his office .....you just can't make this stuff up!http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ls_dUmQTgNMhttp://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xAuXZ3jqJ70 Watch Mr. Baez closely in the second video. Priceless! He seems to have a very poor understanding of the proceeding.
o/t Just a side note: Ms. Tennis has opined publicly, on national TV that she thinks the defense should consider a insanity/diminished capacity angle.

Excellent post and I think you're right on target! :clap:
 
The child screaming was a special needs child which was reported as having been checked out by police. Plus why would Oct 9th be an issue? Normal life goes on, does not mean it is suspicious.

Not all buses have cameras and not all buses with cameras are hooked up. And what would seeing a car prove? I would think there is a lot of traffic on that road because of the school. Plus there are innocent children on the bus and the public has no right to view them just because we want to see what could be on them. JMO

Well yes the police did report of the screaming child, but their actions were searching in the woods with cadaver dog. The problem is that they searched the wrong end of suburban. The witnesses pointed to the other end of suburban. Looking at the google map, I can understand the confusion.

October 9th is an issue to me, because Yuri stated that Rk worked the route in Sept or October after aquiring Rk employee records. Normal day is the 11th, but the 11th is a Saturday in October. So it was possible that Rk read the route on the 9th . 8:50 am is the time on the 911 call. Same time of the morning Rk discovers remains in Dec. I speculated that it was possible that that was Caylee being killed right then and there. Pure speculation on my part. So I tried to verify by asking if anyone had those employee records. As far as I know, they have never been turned over in discovery.

I thought a bus video could clear this up. And your right, we do not have the right to look at those video's, but the defense does.

I thought the videos could have something to do with this new material and information, but am starting to worry about getting off topic here. So I think there is a lot of things this motion could be about. Not sure about how to keep it on topic. Do not want to steer the thread in a different direction. Sorry for being off topic if I am and I will be more careful next time. Moo
 
Well yes the police did report of the screaming child, but their actions were searching in the woods with cadaver dog. The problem is that they searched the wrong end of suburban. The witnesses pointed to the other end of suburban. Looking at the google map, I can understand the confusion.

October 9th is an issue to me, because Yuri stated that Rk worked the route in Sept or October after aquiring Rk employee records. Normal day is the 11th, but the 11th is a Saturday in October. So it was possible that Rk read the route on the 9th . 8:50 am is the time on the 911 call. Same time of the morning Rk discovers remains in Dec. I speculated that it was possible that that was Caylee being killed right then and there. Pure speculation on my part. So I tried to verify by asking if anyone had those employee records. As far as I know, they have never been turned over in discovery.

I thought a bus video could clear this up. And your right, we do not have the right to look at those video's, but the defense does.

I thought the videos could have something to do with this new material and information, but am starting to worry about getting off topic here. So I think there is a lot of things this motion could be about. Not sure about how to keep it on topic. Do not want to steer the thread in a different direction. Sorry for being off topic if I am and I will be more careful next time. Moo

LINK TO WHERE THEY POINTED, please!!!!!
 
Remember this case is international. There have been many posters who have said that the area by the school (hidden oaks ele.) would be the place to seach if they could.

Just think for a moment of how many lookey-loos have done drive-by's of that area near the school and close to the remains sight. I think you have even mentioned there is a chance the school keeps video tape for an indefinate amount of time, so who ever has been down by the school or even driving down suburban and turning around in front of the school, that will be on tape? I hope so. And I hope that KC herself is on tape making that very turn after dumping Caylee (imo).

There were some folks called "Body finders" or "Body searchers" they had white dogs, black t-shirts and they were in a van.(not down by the river :)) They did a drive-by on Suburban with a camara running, and their dogs apparently got sick right near the area that Caylee was eventually found. This was all on tape. We use to have a link to their site here, but can't find it anymore. Maybe someone else knows or remembers this incident and can shed more light.

But my point. There were other people out there searching other than TES searchers.

Thx.:crosseyed:

I found the link to the site about the body finders i will post it. If you have to remove it thats cool.
http://🤬🤬🤬🤬🤬🤬🤬🤬🤬🤬🤬🤬🤬🤬🤬🤬🤬.com/blinddrive/

I remember the people who were searchers, not associated with TES, who did the drive-by down Suburban. They were from Ohio and initially searched the area near the Orlando Airport. They came back to Orlando for a second search in September or early October and it was then that they drove down Suburban and one of their dogs reacted. But, they didn't get out of the car and do a foot search.
 
I have a question.

I am just speculating... but, if this new information would directly link one if not all of the Anthony's to crimes committed after the fact (I think they have done enough obstruction to be charged now! But, that's irrelevent) like obstruction or accessory after the fact... couldn't they claim their 5th Amendment Right to not answer questions on the stand in Casey's trial?

I think I remember nearly a year ago, Brad Conway's excuse for not wanting the Anthony's to give their depositions in the civil case was because they thought that obstruction charges were pending and they would just claim the 5th in any question that had anything to do with the murder trial.

I really think that DC knows a lot and a lot of what he knows more than likely consists of multiple crimes, maybe even tampering with evidence. He was looking for something by that house and it wasn't Caylee. Maybe he found what he was looking for and it wasn't on the video. Maybe he turned it over. Maybe it was gloves? Maybe a murder weapon?

Maybe they need to have it tested?

I'm getting myself too excited but I really think it is something BIG and I think it is going to have something to do with one or more of the Anthony's... not named Casey.
 
LOL! That direction is like the Hurricane landfall prediction cone. No "directly" to it. The further away, the wider the "zone" is. In this case, that zone would be east past the school to west past where the body was found,, right?

Which is why the student screaming ,fit with what was being reported.

So no, they did not directly point to where the body was found. They pointed in the direction across the retention pond and the woods. Which is in front of the school.

They pointed North West, not North East to the school. Its in the police report. Nothing funny about it to me. Moo
 
Another quote.
http://www.wftv.com/pdf/21910328/detail.html
12396 - Paragraph 6
According to faculty member Tracey Wollam,there was a child who she identified only as Hermes (NOI), who was in front of the school at approximately 0845 hours yelling, because Hermes is what she referred to as a "High performance autistic child".Tracey stated she did not recall Hermes yelling the word "Help" however, he was yelling very loudly, and some of the words could have been mistaken as "Help".
 
Ok, I quit. I didn't come here to argue. I came here seeking justice for Caylee Marie Anthony. Something I feel that her family refused to do. I have found more love and caring on this forum for this child than anywhere. NTS, I respect your opinion, so I will just leave it at that. ;)
 
You've made an excellent point! The WHY is the most important aspect of the prosecution's request. I think it pertains directly to the defense team, which is why it's been requested that they not be present. But, I do think the WHO is also important because if it's any of those close to the investigation, ie: DC, CA, GA, or LA, that would be a particularly sensitive investigation, which the defense could exploit. The new material and information may pertain indirectly to the case, a parallel case under investigation, such as withholding of or tampering with evidence.

It must be a compalint about the defense or JB himself that the SA is looking into and they do not want to risk JB knowing they have this information. I honestly believe it is something concrete about JB and DC - lawyer misconduct interfering with an investigation etc.
 
You know, I didn't think of that. Perhaps that is what this motion is all about. Thanks for pointing that out. Perhaps the defense did provide the witness list this week and the Sa discovered a new witness that they were not aware of.

This is the tit for tat that I do not believe the Judge is happy with. The defense holds out their witness list until the Sa comes full disclosure with discovery. I don't know if that is a typical strategy or normal or what. Perhaps a good question for one of the Lawyers.

Do they really expect the defense to give up a witness list until the Sa gives up all discovery? I do not know the answer to that. I do know that the defense has no intentions of giving up their strategy, nor are they required to.

I have thought about who would be on the witness list for the defense. Perhaps Hl , Dr Baden, Dc, JJ, various experts. Most of the witnesses are already on the States list, so the defense can use them in cross.

I am frustrated at the system. Both sides appear to be playing a tit for tat game over discovery and somebody's life hangs in the balance. I wish they would just get all the information on the table and lets move on to trial. Moo

With the Sunshine Laws, if the Defense had submitted a witness list to the SA, we would have it. They have submitted nothing, including insisting they had evidence Caylee's body was not there before Casey was incarcerated. They missed their Feb 1st deadline given to them by JS.

Their motion regarding TES was simply smoke and mirrors, IMO. Why would they need additional TES names if they already have the evidence to prove it, as TM declared in court.
 
LINK TO WHERE THEY POINTED, please!!!!!
I'd like a link to LE using cadavre dogs to investigate the report of a screaming child too while we're at it.
 
So NTS, what you are saying is that because TES has not released ALL of their records, and from back posts because it appears the FBI has not yet released approximately 10% of their findings, (not 10% of all evidence from SA so far) - that for these reasons the Defense is unable to come up with a witness list at all?
Because JS didn't ask them to provide their full and final witness list - just what they have ready at present - which seems to be- based on their production - to be ZIP.

As an example, SA's witness appears fairly lengthy - and I assume they also will continue to add witnesses from the 10% missing referenced above.
You're right...they can always amend their witness list, though I'm not sure of what the cut-off date would be...if any...but holy cow they have till 2011!!
 
I have a question.

I am just speculating... but, if this new information would directly link one if not all of the Anthony's to crimes committed after the fact (I think they have done enough obstruction to be charged now! But, that's irrelevent) like obstruction or accessory after the fact... couldn't they claim their 5th Amendment Right to not answer questions on the stand in Casey's trial?

I think I remember nearly a year ago, Brad Conway's excuse for not wanting the Anthony's to give their depositions in the civil case was because they thought that obstruction charges were pending and they would just claim the 5th in any question that had anything to do with the murder trial.

I really think that DC knows a lot and a lot of what he knows more than likely consists of multiple crimes, maybe even tampering with evidence. He was looking for something by that house and it wasn't Caylee. Maybe he found what he was looking for and it wasn't on the video. Maybe he turned it over. Maybe it was gloves? Maybe a murder weapon?

Maybe they need to have it tested?

I'm getting myself too excited but I really think it is something BIG and I think it is going to have something to do with one or more of the Anthony's... not named Casey.

Lola - Let me give your question about Anthonys/charges/5th a try. At that time, yes BC was saying that - to delay, avoid, etc. What happened was that the prosecution gave them all "USE IMMUNITY" for their testimony on the deposition and any info they gave at that time that would or could indicate a crime. HOWEVER - that does NOT preclude them from being charged if information not derived from that testimony points to a crime. IE: hypothetical example: If G. Lucas, were to send the bear and say a note that one of them had placed inside that contained directions to the body, well then that would be independent information (not from their testimony) and they would be certainly able to be charged.

AZ - correct me if I am wrong, but I also think their testimony they were given the use immunity for could be used to impeach them, should they be charged with a crime.
I also believe if they are charged, prior to the trial they would then be able to claim the 5th and might be why if they can, LE won't file any charges until after the trial.
 
You know, I didn't think of that. Perhaps that is what this motion is all about. Thanks for pointing that out. Perhaps the defense did provide the witness list this week and the Sa discovered a new witness that they were not aware of.

This is the tit for tat that I do not believe the Judge is happy with. The defense holds out their witness list until the Sa comes full disclosure with discovery. I don't know if that is a typical strategy or normal or what. Perhaps a good question for one of the Lawyers.

Do they really expect the defense to give up a witness list until the Sa gives up all discovery? I do not know the answer to that. I do know that the defense has no intentions of giving up their strategy, nor are they required to.

I have thought about who would be on the witness list for the defense. Perhaps Hl , Dr Baden, Dc, JJ, various experts. Most of the witnesses are already on the States list, so the defense can use them in cross.

I am frustrated at the system. Both sides appear to be playing a tit for tat game over discovery and somebody's life hangs in the balance. I wish they would just get all the information on the table and lets move on to trial. Moo
NTS...this is an ongoing process. There will be plenty of twists along the way, I imagine. Jeesh...we have till 2011 to find out more info.
 
You're right...they can always amend their witness list, though I'm not sure of what the cut-off date would be...if any...but holy cow they have till 2011!!

I only glanced over SA's proposed schedule but wasn't the defense given until October for their final witness list? Oh that may not be right - I know one was there - I'd better go back and look again!
 
I'd like a link to LE using cadavre dogs to investigate the report of a screaming child too while we're at it.

All I can find is this: http://www.cfnews13.com/News/Local/...hear_caylee_anthony39s_body_being_dumped.html
But, call me a hard nose, I want to see the police report stating just where they pointed EXACTLY (not a general area and a video would be cause for me to not post for a week! ) and what if anything they did with cadavre dogs on that day.

I would go look at the doc's relased that day, but I feel as if I am in a hearsay word war, not a discussion with facts backed up and therefore am gonna go find that ignore feature! (Not you, btw! I am not always the best with my words, so want to make sure you know I don't mean you!)
 
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