Regroup/Refocus for 2013

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  • #201
The information and posts regarding Miss Marples media information have been moved to the appropriate Searching for Seka thread.

just an fyi for anyone who might be checking for them here.

link to thread were posts were moved: Moved posts start on page 3 of the following thread.

Searching for Seka - Websleuths Crime Sleuthing Community
 
  • #202
I don't know if I have ever mentioned this here but for the past 7 years I have been actively searching for an uncle who was placed in a children's home when he was 4 or 5. He was 5 when the actual adoption took place. Two months ago I was able to locate him. Unfortunately, he passed away in 2003 from cancer. I wanted to share a few things that I learned about my uncle Stanley or rather John -as he was called for most of his life, from his wife.

1. I was surprised to learn that didn't recall very much from his childhood before his adoption. This included his birth name. His lovely wife Linda shared that she feels that this was due to the psychological trauma of being "given up" along with the fact that his new parents had no desire, reason or incentive to keep those memories alive. I think that is an important thing to understand about early memories ... are they really our memories or are they "stories" we've heard told to us time and again for as long as we can remember? Even if we do have genuine memories, what happens to those memories if they are not reinforced or worse ... if they are negatively reinforced?

2. He was told that his parents had died young. He was told that he had 7 siblings but that he was the only one placed for adoption. Both of these things were for the most part false and when you think about it, actually contradicted each other a bit. He did have a large family, including 8 siblings. Both parents were very much living. My grandmother, we believe, knew all along who adopted Stanley, however took that information to her grave. She only ever said that she made a promise and in exchange knew that he was well cared for. I know that she felt lifelong guilt. I understand that she made the decisions she did because after having 9 children in 14 years and then raising all of them alone, she was extremely overwhelmed.

I believe that the history given to Stanley/John was carefully crafted and effectively measured. What could you tell a child to be certain he would not want to look for his birth family. His mother was almost cruel in the way she made John feel that he was unwanted by not only his parents but also his siblings. I think that they first told him that his parents had passed away because that would be the most efficient way to quell any curiosity from a child and also relieve them from feeling that it was somehow their fault. I suspect that later, as John matured, he may have begun to ask about his siblings and at that time it became necessary to generate resentment toward them as well.


So, I when I apply this to Anna, I wonder what she actually remembers of her time before her abduction/adoption. I wonder what she was told -so that she would never look ... not for her Mom ... not even for her brothers.

I just have one more thing to share. Stanley/John died from a type of cancer that only develops as a result of a rare hereditary disorder of the blood vessels. When he was diagnosed, Linda said he was given a pamphlet with information from the foundation of which I am a member and serve as a support liaison. Given where he lived, I would have been his regional POC if he had contacted us. I don't know if I would have made the connection ... but it just goes to show what a small world this really is!
 
  • #203
There is a new caseworker in charge of Anna's file at the National Center for Missing and Exploited Children: Terry Torgersen, a retired police officer from San Diego. They have a new NAMUS data base and he will be checking with Detective Gilletti to make sure that the DNA samples they obtained from me and Anna's brothers are appropriate for comparisons. I do not know, by the way, what NAMUS is.
 
  • #204
There is a new caseworker in charge of Anna's file at the National Center for Missing and Exploited Children: Terry Torgersen, a retired police officer from San Diego. They have a new NAMUS data base and he will be checking with Detective Gilletti to make sure that the DNA samples they obtained from me and Anna's brothers are appropriate for comparisons. I do not know, by the way, what NAMUS is.

The National Missing and Unidentified Persons System (NamUs) is a clearinghouse for missing persons and unidentified decedent records. NamUs is a free online system that can be searched by medical examiners, coroners, law enforcement officials and the general public to solve these cases.

The Unidentified Persons Database contains information entered by medical examiners and coroners. Unidentified persons are people who have died and whose bodies have not been identified. Anyone can search this database using characteristics such as sex, race, distinct body features and even dental information.

The Missing Persons Database contains information about missing persons that can be entered by anyone; before it appears as a case on NamUs, the information is verified. NamUs provides the ability to print missing persons posters and even map out possible travel routes in a search for a missing person. Other resources include links to state clearinghouses, medical examiner and coroner offices, law enforcement agencies, victim assistance groups and pertinent legislation.

When a new missing persons or unidentified decedent case is entered into NamUs, the system automatically performs cross-matching comparisons between the databases, searching for matches or similarities between cases.

NamUs also provides free DNA testing and other forensic services, such as anthropology and odontology assistance.

http://www.namus.gov/
 
  • #205
Thank you magicrose, you beat me with the post about NamUs.

Anna's profile is in NamUs. When NamUs was started all the profiles from NCMEC were transfered/entered into NamUs.

Main Link to Annas NamUs profile:

https://www.findthemissing.org/cases/44/1/

I noticed a different detective is mentioned for contact for Annas case.
A Marcus Gathright. I don't think I/we have seen that name posted previously.

Here is the link to Annas case report at NamUs.

https://www.findthemissing.org/cases/case_report_html/44

It does read DNA samples submitted and complete. That means Annas DNA has been submitted against all UID's listed at the database with DNA profiles and no match has been found.

I'm not a DNA expert, but what I have learned through WS is there are fewer dna in Nuclear DNA and it is less stable over time. (It degrades faster than mitochondial dna). As far as I recall there is no nuclear dna available for Anna because none was found in the submitted personal items which belong to Anna.

The DNA submitted by Annas family is mitochondrial dna - from the maternal line - and would be sufficient for sample comparison. Mitochondrial dna is also far more stable and more available? or there are far many more mitochondrial dna per cell than nuclear dna which is only 1 per cell.

In other words, the samples submitted from Annas family are mitochondrial dna and that is the type of DNA we want in this case, as they are far more stable and reliable over time.

hth
 
  • #206
The National Center for Missing and Exploited Children posted Anna's picture at Wal-Marts in Arkansas, Idaho, Nevada, Oregon, South Dakota, Washington, Wyoming, and MT (whichever state that is) on October 26.
 
  • #207
MT is Montana, isn't it?

Wonderful news!
 
  • #208
  • #209
I won't have access to a computer tomorrow so I wanted to post today that I am thinking of Anna.
Anna's case has touched my heart (and many, many other people's) I cry every time this day comes and goes without an answer. I don't know how you do it, Annasmom. You are incredibly strong and you are an inspiration to many. I wish I could give you a big hug in person. I pray that one day you will find Anna.
 
  • #210
Thinking of Anna, her family, and all who love her today as another anniversary of her disappearance has arrived. I'm reflecting on how Anna has brought so many of us together. How much she is loved and missed by not only those who knew her, but by those of us who have been brought together in the search for answers. Annas case has touched my heart in a way few cases do and I am praying this year is the year we find answers to the mystery of Annas disappearance.

Anna, you are loved and missed where ever you are and we'll continue searching until we find answers.


Cubby and J'
 
  • #211
I have to share for those of you who have not seen this story already.

As a teenager, Carlina came to believe she was not related to the family that was raising her. She began to check missing children websites, and she eventually found her own case.

She called the website for help, and they called Joy, the mother who had kept her baby's picture on display all these years.

"She said she just had a feeling, she felt different from the people raising her," said Nance's maternal grandmother, Elizabeth White, 71. "She searched, and then she found Joy."

DNA testing proved Carlina was the stolen child.

http://abclocal.go.com/wabc/story?section=news/local/new_york&id=7907784

This gives me continued hope in Anna's case. I pray that this not only gives hope to the families of missing children, but for those children who strongly believe something is just not right and may be afraid to or not know where to begin to search if they think they may be a kidnapped child to search and seek the assistance of NCMEC.

Other MSM articles indicate when Carolina reached out to NCMEC there were initially three missing persons cases which might have been a match prior to the DNA match to the one.

Anna, if you are out there looking, or contemplating looking - we are still looking for you and pray you find us or we find you.
 
  • #212
A few more thoughts. Carlina is only 23..... I can't help but wonder if perhaps Anna did search long before the internet was available and became frustrated and put that behind her. I pray, if that scenario is possible this story about Carlina might enourage or give renewed hope for Anna or those who might believe they were abducted to resume their search.

still praying for answers regarding Annas disappearance.
 
  • #213
annasmom, thank you for the video of "oh, little anna of the snow" it is so beautiful!
 
  • #214
Hi,

This is my first Anna-related post and I'm not sure it's in the right place.

Do you think it would be worth sending Anna's photos, and her age-progressed photos to every library in the US (I know this is a huge task) --- in the hope that either someone sees it and recognizes her, or that perhaps she sees it and it kicks her memory into action?

I thought perhaps she is not on the internet, or if she is, her name is different and she hasn't come across any sites about her, or someone of the older generation(s) might remember something and they are not on the internet. Perhaps one of the librarians might remember her when they see the posters?

Thinking of Anna and her family.

F75 xx
 
  • #215
bumping
 
  • #216
  • #217
What does this mean?

Bumping the thread for attention, I think that's what it means.
By the way I read through most of the treads.......WOW!
What a whirlwind, many of my questions were answered though.
GB's actions in general, and GW's once he met GB are intriguing.
So is the fact that he never called you to see what was going on when she went missing, and support you.....just seems very odd....even for the "Odd Couple".

Blessings!
 
  • #218
Pertinent Information Check List.

I thought we could do a check list of things so we know they have been looked into and crossed off.

1. The Passports
2. Anna's Birth Certificate-amended birth certificate
3. No Ransom
4. No letters received from anyone to the Water's Family
5. All matters in the evil but important BFH
6. The Italian TV Show
7. The FBI - anything they can provide/not provide/did provide
8. Contacting any USA media for televised show for Anna
9. The Bank Accounts
10. TWA -
11. Train of the day. (anyone can check which trains were active in 1973) check for passenger lists
12. Adoption Sites
13. Italy
14. Greece
15. USA - any connections we have missed...
16. Possible sightings? The girl and her Father...
17. Any weird phone calls to date? Hangups?
18. No one can find any relatives of Evelyn Wanek...
19. Interpol
20. :banghead:
21. Yearbooks from the 80's
22. Facebook - Highschools in the surrounding area
23. :fence:

Thinking of precious Anna Christian Waters ♥

~ Please add if you can think of anything we have missed
 
  • #219
Brainstorming a few more ideas.

Someone refresh my memory please. IIRC Anna did not yet have a SS# when she disappeared, is this correct?

If anyone has a classmates membership, it is my understanding more and more schools are adding yearbooks online. Anyone with a classmates membership and some time might want to start choosing schools in some order (maybe by city? or schools in their county or state) and review class of 1985 or 1986 as they have time.

As far as I know we've never explored any half moon bay directories of anykind for a list of sportsman club members. (or any other member lists that might be applicable). We can post the list of names then behind the scenes see if any of these people had any arrest records or anything that might pertain tie to Anna's case/abduction. I would not have the first clue of how to find these directories so assistance on idea's would be great!

Brainstorming and praying this Holy Week for answers and direction on Anna's case.
 
  • #220
Another idea. Is there any way we can get Annas most recent NCMEC age progressed photo compared to/run through any of those programs that compare to DMV photo's not that (I think) almost all states if not all states have DMV photo's on computer? Doogie if you are still checking in any idea's on pursuing that avenue? Or do we run into privacy issues with that route?
 
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