Retrial for Sentencing of Jodi Arias - 11/14/14

[LinTX]

It's a minor detail, but where did you find that Lonnie Dworkin examined the image in 2008? In his testimony in the trial, he said that he received the read-only mirror image on November 5, 2012.

I was not able to find anywhere that he ever had the original hard drive.

Sorry, I messed up that sentence! I meant to say the image copy was made in 2008, not that he examined it then. I've listened to his testimony a few times now, and still don't hear him give a date for that. Do you know if this was on direct? I agree that he never had TA's HD, but maybe that part was to the OP?

 

[bsk]

No, he said he was present for the examination made in 2009, not this one made in 2014. The computer was handed over to the defense and they apparently have had it ever since. Nurmi even said it would take weeks to examine it. There was a recent motion made, presumably by Juan, to have to computer turned back over to them.

I could swear he said the other day they were present - maybe that's the "hole" in my story.

 

[fifteen89]

Ah, thank you! I'd save myself so much time by just reading a bit more carefully. :silenced:

Seriously? I don't know how we're not all cross-eyed! There's so much to read to keep up with this case and to make things worse we have to read tweets rather than watch testimony for the re-trial.

 

[MeeBee]

I could swear he said the other day they were present - maybe that's the "hole" in my story.

I don't think he was and I don't think he said that. The defense has been examining the hard drive for weeks now, since they first requested it last month, I think it was. They probably just handed it over and let them have their way with it.

He was referring to the 2009 incident. He was present for that and had to get a power cord for them, signaling the battery was dead and it did not wake up when they flipped it open.

 

[LambChop]

Religion and politics: we are not going to get into discussions about these topics on this thread. This is a discussion about the retrial of the case only.

Here are the rules, less we forget:

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[fifteen89]

One problem with the "heat of the moment" part of the post.....This was not a "heat of the moment" murder. This was planned out more than a week in advance. The theft of JA's grandfathers gun, the car rental (non descript white one please instead of a stand out red one, thanks), the purchased gas can/borrowed two gas cans, cell phone turned off the entire time while in AZ, the "I got lost" for more than 24 hours while on her way to Utah, etc all point to this being planned out from beginning to end.

There are several women that have brutally killed a man that was larger than they were, moved their bodies all by themselves, without any help from anyone else. JA is not the first female to do this and she will not be the last.

If JA claimed that someone else had helped her kill Travis or even stage the scene, that would have been investigated completely. The evidence points to JA acting alone. JA also did not claim self defense until after changing her story/version at least twice before.

MOO

And can't we all picture her rage/hatred building by the second during that drive to his house? imo her adrenaline was way beyond over-drive by the time she started stabbing him.

 

[daisydomino]

Sorry, I messed up that sentence! I meant to say the image copy was made in 2008, not that he examined it then. I've listened to his testimony a few times now, and still don't hear him give a date for that. Do you know if this was on direct? I agree that he never had TA's HD, but maybe that part was to the OP?

Not at all, your sentence was fine—I just didn't read carefully.

My notes say that it was on direct from the testimony on Day 12. My notes say that he never had the original hard drive, but my notes suck.

So I'm watching his testimony again now
http://youtu.be/HTpvEnF4ubA?t=1h1m

 

[Zuri]

I have just watched JM's closing argument and I truly wish I hadn't. It made me realize that I should leave all this stuff alone, his story of what happened even though quite possible and wasn't all that probable and as we all well know everything is possible even such things as time travel, Jodi not killing Travis and existence of God, however all these things are very improbable...

<modsnip>

P.S I truly hope I am wrong on this one.

As is "Billy Goat's Gruff".

 

[Zuri]

Here's what is inconsistent about Juan's story:
- His motion asks the judge to order the defense to provide a copy of the image(s) made during his examination(s) of the computer.
--- If he is talking about the instance when he and Flores were in the room, then wouldn't he know what if any images were made and why didn't they get one then if it looked like anything changed?
- He says the defense expert damaged the hard drive and it was impossible to take a mirror image of it afterward.
--- Unless JA got a hold of it and did like she did to her computer, then why couldn't a mirror image be made now? And if they were present, wouldn't he have been able to tell right away if it had been damaged? And don't they have a mirror image of what it looked like before the defense touched it?

This would make more sense if he was talking about Dworkin and not this later instance, but he seems to be referring to this later incident. It just doesn't make sense to me.

I would imagine more specifics will come out. I can't get my mind wrapped around that either unless an error occurred during the process and it was too late to fix it.

 

[Sulamith]

One problem with the "heat of the moment" part of the post.....This was not a "heat of the moment" murder. This was planned out more than a week in advance. The theft of JA's grandfathers gun, the car rental (non descript white one please instead of a stand out red one, thanks), the purchased gas can/borrowed two gas cans, cell phone turned off the entire time while in AZ, the "I got lost" for more than 24 hours while on her way to Utah, etc all point to this being planned out from beginning to end.

There are several women that have brutally killed a man that was larger than they were, moved their bodies all by themselves, without any help from anyone else. JA is not the first female to do this and she will not be the last.

If JA claimed that someone else had helped her kill Travis or even stage the scene, that would have been investigated completely. The evidence points to JA acting alone. JA also did not claim self defense until after changing her story/version at least twice before.

MOO

I wonder if she checked on TA's roommates schedules? He had three or four? How did she know they would not be there? (Not directed at you TorisMom) I am still leaning toward the possibility that he became angry with her and lashed out at her. No proof she stole her grandfather's gun. I would want proof of that if I were to count it towards premeditation. Amazing to me that none of the roommates showed up during the murder.

 

[Bernina]

I'm not going to try and poke any holes in JM's case, but I will say you all this to make my point perfectly clear:
Firstly, it is almost next to impossible to stage anything in the heat of the moment ,especially, when the victim fights back and I believe Travis gave "them" his worst and in most cases where a woman of Jodi's size attacks alone a man of Travis' size with a knife or other deadly weapon like a shovel, an axe or pickaxe a man manages to subdue his attacker.

Secondly, there's no doubt in my mind that Jodi killed him she ,just, might have had some help with the killing. To me it looks like a clear-cut assault by two if I ever saw one and I have seen a lot of those in my day.

Please note that this is just conjecture (for I have never been to the crime scene) and conjecture never did anybody any good, but on the other hand I have decades of experience under my belt with this kind of thing.

BBM: Get yourself verified on WS.........and size doesn't matter: I'm 5'1, 109, cold cocked a sober 6'2/220 lb. man and he was out for the count. He wasn't naked, wet, in the shower, with his back to me. I also have an issue with how you are "reading" the blood splatter, trail, pooling, ect., because of my experience tracking and hunting.

Let's say she says there was a second attacker with her in the room and that second attacker says that she masterminded and premeditated the whole thing (which is what she or he is most likely to say), what would happen then,huh? How would saying such a thing benefit her when it could only hurt her self-defense case?

BLUE in quote in response by me to bolded text above it.

And to the last paragraph of the quote: First defendant with their "side" gets a plea deal. "He said/she said", we see it all the time in trials.

 

[TorisMom003]

I wonder if she checked on TA's roommates schedules? He had three or four? How did she know they would not be there? (Not directed at you TorisMom) I am still leaning toward the possibility that he became angry with her and lashed out at her. No proof she stole her grandfather's gun. I would want proof of that if I were to count it towards premeditation. Amazing to me that none of the roommates showed up during the murder.

Remember the phone call between JA and Travis before she showed up at his house. She also knew (pretty much) what his roommates schedules were from her time stalking Travis while she was living in Mesa. Juan explained the stolen grandfathers gun very well during his closing argument. A burglar would not pick and chose 1 item from each of the 4 rooms only. A burglar would also not take just the small handgun while leaving the more expensive rifles behind. The date of the burglary (May 28, 2008) which was only 2 days after the text messages from Travis to JA that he was done with her, she was the worst thing that ever happened to him, that she was evil......point to the premeditation by JA to steal the gun to use to kill Travis.

I am including the link to the closing argument by Juan for anyone that would like to listen to refresh their memories.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t64ZDuL0Rac

MOO

 

[Tiger09]

Imo....The defense team totes would back false accusations for JA. Why? The state has the burden of proof. Not defense. The defense, I could be wrong, but I think they are considered innocent (I know, Jodi Arias and innocent) till proven guilty by the state. So JM had to prove why she killed Travis Alexander and that it was especially cruel. It sounds like a cake walk, looking at the evidence. But, Nurm and Willmi's job is to discredit JM and confuse the jury. They don't care about JA anymore than the man in the moon. It's a paycheck. And imo for Nurmi, it's a way to build his private practice and be the next Jose Baez. And if you recall, Baez got down and dirty.

There are some accusations, sadly, that once they're in the minds of people, they cannot be driven out. Example: George Anthony and the alleged abuse of CA. Once that image was in the jury's mind, there was reasonable doubt. However, the thing this case has that Baez didn't was that Arias left a graphic untouched (mostly) murder scene and the person the defense is accusing is victim. I can't see a jury going hmm well he deserved that unless she has proof of extreme abuse or rape- which she doesn't seem to have. By all accounts, Nurmi's strategy will blow up in his face.

 

[Wagara]

I'm not going to try and poke any holes in JM's case, but I will say you all this to make my point perfectly clear:
Firstly, it is almost next to impossible to stage anything in the heat of the moment ,especially, when the victim fights back and I believe Travis gave "them" his worst and in most cases where a woman of Jodi's size attacks alone a man of Travis' size with a knife or other deadly weapon like a shovel, an axe or pickaxe a man manages to subdue his attacker.

Secondly, there's no doubt in my mind that Jodi killed him she ,just, might have had some help with the killing. To me it looks like a clear-cut assault by two if I ever saw one and I have seen a lot of those in my day.

Please note that this is just conjecture (for I have never been to the crime scene) and conjecture never did anybody any good, but on the other hand I have decades of experience under my belt with this kind of thing.



Let's say she says there was a second attacker with her in the room and that second attacker says that she masterminded and premeditated the whole thing (which is what she or he is most likely to say), what would happen then,huh? How would saying such a thing benefit her when it could only hurt her self-defense case?

I see clouds that look like teddy bears but they aren't. I have to apply more than a view of the sky to my vision. I believe your opinion is wring but you are entitled to it.

 

[MeeBee]

I wonder if she checked on TA's roommates schedules? He had three or four? How did she know they would not be there? (Not directed at you TorisMom) I am still leaning toward the possibility that he became angry with her and lashed out at her. No proof she stole her grandfather's gun. I would want proof of that if I were to count it towards premeditation. Amazing to me that none of the roommates showed up during the murder.

It's common sense, really. No proof she did burglary, it's circumstantial. A strange burglary occurred at her house a week before the murder. Only one tiny gun was stolen and all the other guns were left. And a DVD player and the remote. Coincidentally, the tiny gun that was stolen was of the same calibre used to kill Travis. Not a single shred of evidence Travis ever owned a gun. Jodi dropped a DVD player and a remote off to Daryl when she borrowed the gas cans. No evidence that she returned the gas can she bought and a paper trail of her having used it after she killed Travis. Keeping receipts from her entire trip save for the ones that show she'd been in AZ. The cover up. The voicemail, the email. Her story of his attack being improbable, even the foreman admitted this. The roommates had alibis. Why are we still accusing the roommates when Jodi admits to the killing? SO MANY THINGS! When taken alone it's like, so what? But when you put them all together it is so clear what happened. The why is slightly hazier. But I am 100% certain she planned this crime.

 

[Nosey Parker]

:seeya: Oh dear, I think I'll come back later.

 

[Hope4More]

About that computer thing. The worst case scenario would be that Flores deleted the files , per Nurmi's allegation. It has already been proven that didn't happen. She doesn't get to walk and the DP is very much on the table.

The second scenario is that regardless of who or why or how the files were deleted, Nurmi will get to argue that Travis had on his computer. It seems even that possibility is greatly lessened by the fact that the HD was damaged recently. If JM isn't given a mirror copy of what the expert saw of deleted files ( expert didnt make one or Nurmi won't turn it over ), then game over. The doesn't come in.

Last, at least one person messed up somewhere along the line. It happens. So what, in terms of what happens next, because the state is not at fault, and its mighty clear that JM can prove the was caused by malware.

I can't imagine even JSS holding up the trial because of this. In fact, She's already indicated she won't.

 

[ShadyLady]

Can't believe Jodi managed to destroy two computers. I remember her saying Travis was viewing videos when she arrived....then later they were trying to load photos she brought. But, when did she say she saw the bugs on the screen. I am convinced the virus was on the CD, and why did defense have access to computer at all, since even her expert says he usually examines a "copy", read only....???

 

[janx]

Well...She has been tried and convicted in Arizona, so there you have it. :yes: I don't see what second guessing the conviction does at this point. After sentencing, she always has the chance to appeal the verdict.

 

[janx]

About that computer thing. The worst case scenario would be that Flores deleted the files , per Nurmi's allegation. It has already been proven that didn't happen. She doesn't get to walk and the DP is very much on the table.

The second scenario is that regardless of who or why or how the files were deleted, Nurmi will get to argue that Travis had on his computer. It seems even that possibility is greatly lessened by the fact that the HD was damaged recently. If JM isn't given a mirror copy of what the expert saw of deleted files ( expert didnt make one or Nurmi won't turn it over ), then game over. The doesn't come in.

Last, at least one person messed up somewhere along the line. It happens. So what, in terms of what happens next, because the state is not at fault, and its mighty clear that JM can prove the was caused by malware.

I can't imagine even JSS holding up the trial because of this. In fact, She's already indicated she won't.

I just want to know who this recent "expert" is!