Russia Attacks Ukraine - 23 Feb 2022 #13

[Snoopster]

NAFTA was definitely a while ago—it got replaced by the USMCA in 2020, but the trade relationships are still pretty similar.

As for trade balances, the U.S. actually runs a trade deficit with both Mexico and Canada—meaning we import more from both than we export. In 2023, the U.S. imported about $476 billion in goods from Mexico and exported $323 billion. With Canada, we imported $450 billion and exported $354 billion (source). So, while Canada is a big trade partner, we still buy more from them than we sell. IMO

Keep in mind that trade involves more than products, it also involves services. And the USA gets a lot of money from selling their services (think product of human labor). So those simple numbers you posted don't reflect the whole picture.

 

[Bluebear15]

https://www.reuters.com/world/how-much-aid-have-ukraines-western-allies-provided-2025-03-04/

This article includes a breakdown of financials for various countries who have given grants and LOANS to Ukraine. I don't know that it's unreasonable to expect some compensation. Funds are just not unlimited and the United States has given a lot. Plenty of countries in Europe also have loaned money so I'd assume that means there is an agreement that compensation at some point will be provided.

I don't agree that President Trump is siding with Putin. I think he's trying to get a peace deal that benefits Ukraine and prevents WW3.

You aren't seeing what the rest of the world is seeing. If ww3 starts then it will be Trump and Putin to blame. Neither are interested in peace - just money. Jmo, moo

 

[Stella123]

Nope I watched it live and the replay three times. His first words were thank you for the invitation and immediately pulled out photos and went into an 8-point list of his demands. He might have thought he thanked us but he did not. He did say in he confronted JD and was called out...I said thank you. I watched it once entirely just to catch when he said thank you. He spent a lot of time thanking Europe.

If you look at his Twitter account he's not thanked us. He repeatedly thanks everybody in Europe by name. Hoping Donald sits on all that military aid for a while.

Please let me know what the time mark is and I'll go back and watch the video again. I would hate to accuse him of not thanking us for our support unjustly.
Moo...

"Zelensky: I am thankful.
Trump: You don’t have the cards. You’re buried there, your people are dying. You’re running low on soldiers.
Zelensky: Don’t, please, Mr. President."

He says he's thankful, he's begging for the unpleasantness to stop. "Don't, please, Mr President".

How much more grovelling do you want? This is all sick - all this stuff about he should apologise. He wasn't the one being aggressive.

Excerpts From the Fiery Exchange Between Trump and Zelensky at the White House

During the Oval Office meeting, President Trump told the Ukrainian leader: “You’re either going to make a deal or we’re out.”

www.nytimes.com

 

[nao]

 

[SouthAussie]

https://www.reuters.com/world/how-much-aid-have-ukraines-western-allies-provided-2025-03-04/

This article includes a breakdown of financials for various countries who have given grants and LOANS to Ukraine. I don't know that it's unreasonable to expect some compensation. Funds are just not unlimited and the United States has given a lot. Plenty of countries in Europe also have loaned money so I'd assume that means there is an agreement that compensation at some point will be provided.

I don't agree that President Trump is siding with Putin. I think he's trying to get a peace deal that benefits Ukraine and prevents WW3.

This fact check article provides information about the loans. The US has provided loans.

I will point out a couple of parts, though you can read the article to see the rest ....


In the 2024 emergency supplemental appropriations bill, about $9 billion of the assistance was provided as loans.

Fakhurdinova pointed out that “the first half of this loan [$4.7 billion] was forgiven by President Biden in November, so President Trump has power over the other half of these funds.”

Also, as we noted above, some of the U.S. military aid never left the U.S., since it was provided to U.S. companies to produce or replenish weapons.

AND

Separate from any of the other aid provided by the U.S. or Europe, the G7 — which includes the United States, Canada, France, Germany, Italy, Japan and the U.K. — agreed in 2024 to provide $50 billion in loans to support Ukraine.

The loans are to be paid back with the profits from frozen Russian assets, according to the Treasury Department, and the U.S. has the same terms as the rest of the G7 countries.

The U.S. portion of the loan is $20 billion, which was disbursed in December.

Trump Exaggerates on U.S. and European Aid to Ukraine, Loans - FactCheck.org

As President Donald Trump has sought to secure rights to Ukraine's minerals as compensation for U.S. aid to fight the Russian invasion, he has repeatedly overstated the amount of aid provided by the U.S. compared with Europe and exaggerated the extent to which European assistance – unlike U.S...

www.factcheck.org

 

[UK Girl]

The problem is only France and Uk have offered to do the peacekeeping so it had to be one of usCalls for JD Vance to APOLOGISE over 'shameful' troops comments

 

[Charlot123]

IMO, it all comes down to Trump wanting Z to basically fall to his feet and thank HIM profusely and “kiss the ring”. So while we can all see that Zelensky has been plenty thankful and grateful, especially to people of the US, it’s not enough for Trumpx which is why he melted down and he and Vance started yelling. Zelenskyy never one yelled or even raised his voice, he was very calm the entire time. He showed way more patience than most, while being publicly berated by a national leader (again, all IMO)

One rule. If you know that you are not personally liked, don’t dwell on a person’s nerves. Zelenskiy knew that he was invited to the Oval Office because of the deal. He tried to make it about everything else before the deal. So it happened as it did.

It became an issue of personalities. Trump who is blunt essentially said, you have bet on Biden last time, now I am elected (he said something about all the counties turning red), and with me, the rules are different.

I think lengthy meeting was unnecessary given the prior history. You came, you sign, you leave. The problem is, even some Ukrainian commentators say that at European meetings, there is some cross of boundaries by Zelenskyy (like, not taking an interpreter). Here, whatever he did, was viewed as boundaries crossed.

And I yet haven’t made up my mind as to why Vance intervened.

 

[UK Girl]

In previous trips abroad Zelensky wore green/khaki combat outfit to match what the military wear, but to meet Trump/Vance he wore all black non combat outfit, he was dressed as if he was going to a Metallica concert not meeting the leader of the free world

He wore the same outfit to meet the KING

 

[SouthAussie]

One rule. If you know that you are not personally liked, don’t dwell on a person’s nerves. Zelenskiy knew that he was invited to the Oval Office because of the deal. He tried to make it about everything else before the deal. So it happened as it did.

It became an issue of personalities. Trump who is blunt essentially said, you have bet on Biden last time, now I am elected (he said something about all the counties turning red), and with me, the rules are different.

I think lengthy meeting was unnecessary given the prior history. You came, you sign, you leave. The problem is, even some Ukrainian commentators say that at European meetings, there is some cross of boundaries by Zelenskyy (like, not taking an interpreter). Here, whatever he did, was viewed as boundaries crossed.

And I yet haven’t made up my mind as to why Vance intervened.

Zelenskyy did not need an interpreter. He has a very good command of the English language. And he speaks with a Ukraine accent - which, to me, is very easy to understand.

I have listened to so much of what he says. He knows what people are saying to him, and he linguistically responds very well.

imo

 

[UK Girl]

I am fully supportive of Ukraine, I don’t think that they should surrender a single inch of Ukrainian soil in any deal, Russia need to give up every inch of territory they have stolen over the years, but Zelensky needs to step down and be replaced by another leader, he has reverted to his old comedian mode with his dress sense and other aspects of his behaviour he also has a habit of rubbing people up the wrong way. Needs to step aside

Yeah? he has upset two people..those two people have upset most of the world!

 

[UK Girl]

That was on February the 23rd before he came to the White House. Before he got on Twitter and said negative things about the United States and making demands.
Moo

what negative things did he say about America?

 

[UK Girl]

Really???????

Wow!

caught up in traffic? his cars get let straight through LOL

 

[Charlot123]

This fact check article provides information about the loans. The US has provided loans.

I will point out a couple of parts, though you can read the article to see the rest ....


In the 2024 emergency supplemental appropriations bill, about $9 billion of the assistance was provided as loans.

Fakhurdinova pointed out that “the first half of this loan [$4.7 billion] was forgiven by President Biden in November, so President Trump has power over the other half of these funds.”

Also, as we noted above, some of the U.S. military aid never left the U.S., since it was provided to U.S. companies to produce or replenish weapons.

AND

Separate from any of the other aid provided by the U.S. or Europe, the G7 — which includes the United States, Canada, France, Germany, Italy, Japan and the U.K. — agreed in 2024 to provide $50 billion in loans to support Ukraine.

The loans are to be paid back with the profits from frozen Russian assets, according to the Treasury Department, and the U.S. has the same terms as the rest of the G7 countries.

The U.S. portion of the loan is $20 billion, which was disbursed in December.

Trump Exaggerates on U.S. and European Aid to Ukraine, Loans - FactCheck.org

As President Donald Trump has sought to secure rights to Ukraine's minerals as compensation for U.S. aid to fight the Russian invasion, he has repeatedly overstated the amount of aid provided by the U.S. compared with Europe and exaggerated the extent to which European assistance – unlike U.S...

www.factcheck.org

I voted for president Biden in 2020 so I hope I can say it. These loans came out of our taxpayers’ pockets.

 

[Stella123]

"Donald Trump is not planning to sign a minerals deal between the US and Ukraine tonight, Scott Bessent has said.

Earlier reports indicated that Mr Trump was planning to conclude the controversial “rare earths” deal this evening and announce it in his joint address to Congress just after 9pm ET.

However, Mr Bessent, the US Treasury Secretary, told Fox News there was “no signing planned”.

White House insiders said there had not been any movement on the proposal, which would grant the US half of Ukraine’s revenues from its critical minerals as payback for military support.

It was due to be signed last week but was placed on ice following an explosive row between Mr Trump and Mr Zelensky in the Oval Office on Friday.

One person familiar with talks between the US and Ukraine told CBS News that the Republican was now holding out for a “bigger, better deal”.

The Ukrainian president said earlier today that he was “ready” to sign the agreement hours after Mr Trump suspended all military aid to Kyiv, calling it a “step toward” in securing “solid security agreements” from the administration.

Mr Trump is set to speak at 9pm local time to 2am GMT. You can watch the speech live on our stream here."

It says "the Republican was now holding out for a “bigger, better deal”." What does that mean? A bigger better deal? More for the US and less for Ukraine? Or is he considering adding the security requirements Zelensky wants? MOO

Trump ‘appreciates’ Zelensky’s peace negotiations letter

Donald Trump says he received a letter from Volodymyr Zelensky in which the Ukrainian signalled he was ready to sign a rare earth minerals deal.

www.telegraph.co.uk

 

[UK Girl]

Euro's may want to built their arsenal a wee bit more prior to wishing the U.S. depart from NATO. I'm thinking the current administration has looked at doing just that. I can only imagine the terror in London, talk about groveling....ouch.

What terror in London?? We are stronger than that!

 

[SouthAussie]

I voted for president Biden in 2020 so I hope I can say it. These loans came out of our taxpayers’ pockets.

As did the loans from the other countries. As did the grants from countries like mine and many others.

I am not sure what makes the US taxpayer so special in this regard? Taxpayers around the world are helping fund Ukraine in many ways.

imo

 

[Marantz4250b]

In previous trips abroad Zelensky wore green/khaki combat outfit to match what the military wear, but to meet Trump/Vance he wore all black non combat outfit, he was dressed as if he was going to a Metallica concert not meeting the leader of the free world

He may have been at one point. If that was ever true it ended on Friday.

imo, obvs.

 

[nao]

Moo...does USA have any foreign bases on their soil?.. the reason USA bases are on foreign soil, is an agreement to defend. But if the agreement has changed, USA cannot ask for payment. The only reason the USA is powerful is because they have military bases all over the world. But now the USA wants money for doing nothing. I do find it a lot scary that friend is now foe. .unless you pay up...moo

 

[UK Girl]

He is the CEO of the DOGE, a major government department, he wont have been on any ballot paper but nor was other senior roles like secretary of state

Arent they elected senators?

 

[keek]

Zelenskyy did not need an interpreter. He has a very good command of the English language. And he speaks with a Ukraine accent - which, to me, is very easy to understand.

I have listened to so much of what he says. He knows what people are saying to him, and he linguistically responds very well.

imo

He def does not need an interpreter. He understood the ugly, at first, subtle remarks. Loved his response regarding the suit, great comeback right off. He is clear.