Russia Attacks Ukraine - 23 Feb 2022 #14

[LoveyG]

I remember back in the 1950s thru 1980s many HS graduates immediately entered the military. It was a rite of passage in my family. It built character, strength, determination, discipline and a sense of self-worth. It helped build Future Leaders. It also provided a pathway for a 4-year college education and financial success.

I'm just in AWW of this leader. He is definitely developed a plan for success and future security for his country.
Moo

LoveyG: It would be interesting to know what your military family members think of all of this. Have you talked to them about your stance? 1950s through 1980s most should still be alive. I would be very interested in hearing how their ideology has changed from the Cold War era to now.

We had the above exchange in the last thread but I didn't see your response. Maybe it was missed. I am still interested in hearing what your military family members think, especially since your recent post indicates you have war PTSD from childhood. That causes me to think maybe your childhood wasn't spent in the US, which is totally fine and might explain some of our differing opinions. Russia Attacks Ukraine - 23 Feb 2022 #13

Your recent post about wartime PTSD Russia Attacks Ukraine - 23 Feb 2022 #14

Edit: added link

 

[Summerliz03]

JD Vance said it. There is a growing chasm between American and European values and it goes beyond free speech. There is a “national interest” chasm where Europe is focussed on itself and America is focused on China. We have limited resources. We can't fund European wars while China is looking on the horizon.

IMO, the problem with this chasm between the US and UK values (which I’m not sure I agree with) is that Trump’s actions seem to want to align the US with Russia. He has done this through his words (saying that Russia is “easier to deal with” and that they are just “doing what anyone would do” in regards to invading their neighbor) and his actions (abruptly cutting off aid to Ukraine, not sharing intelligence with them, which pretty much immediately led to a Russian attack which killed civilians).

As a proud American, I would much rather be aligned with the UK and EU than Russia and it worries me greatly that the President is making these choices.

 

[UK Girl]

We have spent enough resources on this conflict and have given an ultimatum. A peace deal or we're out. It's pretty simple. Ukraine does not have to agree, they can go on fighting with the support of their other allies.

Ukraine is not a priority for the US especially as we are pivoting to address the rising power and influence of China.

According to Trump the other week he gets on very well with the President of China

 

[Sarahlou]

"Shocking Pentagon DEI Purge" - the US really is becoming Putin's Russia IMO - I am very sorry. MOO The erasion of history starts the brainwashing JMO I mean no disrespect to American people - and I hope some people can fight all this stuff going on and bring some sanity back. JMO

"As many as 100,000 photos and online posts including a female Medal of Honor recipient, Black soldiers and people whose last name is ‘Gay’ may be axed in the diversity eradication ordered by Donald Trump"

This includes a photo of the plane Enola Gay - because of the word "gay". MOO

"References to a World War II Medal of Honor recipient, the Enola Gay aircraft that dropped an atomic bomb on Japan, and the first women to pass Marine infantry training are among the tens of thousands of photos and online posts marked for deletion as the Defense Department works to purge DEI content, diversity, equity and inclusion content, according to a shocking database obtained by The Associated Press."

Enola Gay, women, Blacks being erased in shocking Pentagon DEI file purge

As many as 100,000 photos and online posts including a female Medal of Honor recipient, Black soldiers and people whose last name is ‘Gay’ may be axed in the diversity eradication ordered by Donald Trump

www.independent.co.uk

How is this real life? Something I wonder every day these days.

 

[statt#1]

I didn't see anyone claim that the "worlds press" had any authority in the US or anywhere for that matter.

But, if one truely wants to see what the world thinks about "the Leader of the Free World" (a title bestowed upon him by ... all those claiming he is the only one "leading the world to peace" in this case)

Then one should get out more and actually see what the world has to say about opinions of those "in the Free World".

Heck, even in the US that opinion is firmly divided right down the middle regardless of the "world press".

The "world press" is not the problem. The problem is a mere mortal man who currently lives in a big white house.

.

The problem isn't Trump, never was. The war will continue unabated until Putin comes to the negotiation table. Send Z money, arms and troops...<modsnip: unnecessary>

 

[UK Girl]

JD Vance said it. There is a growing chasm between American and European values and it goes beyond free speech. There is a “national interest” chasm where Europe is focussed on itself and America is focused on China. We have limited resources. We can't fund European wars while China is looking on the horizon.

Vance likes to say a lot especially if it is insulting European people. I totally disagree that Europe only cares about Europe.

 

[Sundog]

Everyone should watch/listen to this video linked by @PommyMommy. The Uk parliament is united in this issue - and it's cross party. Here you have a conservative MP praising a Labour Prime Minister. What he says is very very interesting and in particular about Musk's own Grok AI! He posted on Twitter/X that Trump could be a Russian asset. Musk replied to him with just a link to a site about "retards". He explains very carefully why it is entirely possible that Trump is a Russian asset of Putin (Putin who spent his life as a KGB agent grooming people toso work for Russia). He blows out of the water the argument that Trump is just being philosophical. But more importantly, he says he has faith - in the people of the US and the US consitution, to keep Trump in check and restore world order. He is quite clear that Trump's actions mean US is currently no longer an ally and Europe is on its own. MOO JMO

The personal opinion of a member of parliament making outrageous statements like this is hardly unique. If you watched the confirmation hearings for some of Cabinet nominees of the new administration, you would hear and see some of these outrageously off the wall statements as well. His fifteen minutes of fame, I guess.

 

[UK Girl]

The personal opinion of a member of parliament making outrageous statements like this is hardly unique. If you watched the confirmation hearings for some of Cabinet nominees of the new administration, you would hear and see som of these outrageously off the wall statements as well. His fifteen minutes of fame, I guess.

Tbh I would not say they are as outrageous as somethings I hear from American ministers. Btw the last few weeks is that Vance's five mins of fame? to try and take the Presidency next time?

 

[Summerliz03]

The problem isn't Trump, never was. The war will continue unabated until Putin comes to the negotiation table. <modsnip>

Then why can’t Trump himself get Putin to the negotiation table? He has said many times that he has a good relationship with Putin, so why hasn’t he gotten Putin to start any sort of peace negotiations? He called him by his first name just a few days ago, seems like they are pretty close.

 

[Deleted member 352484]

Then why can’t Trump himself get Putin to the negotiation table? He has said many times that he has a good relationship with Putin, so why hasn’t he gotten Putin to start any sort of peace negotiations?

It's been widely reported Trump's been talking to Putin about ending the war. I expect the Russians and the Ukranians won't be meeting until talks are more advanced.

Russia and US agree to work toward ending Ukraine war in a remarkable diplomatic shift

The meeting is meant to pave the way for a meeting between U.S. President Donald Trump and Russian President Vladimir Putin.

apnews.com

 

[Sundog]

Then why can’t Trump himself get Putin to the negotiation table? He has said many times that he has a good relationship with Putin, so why hasn’t he gotten Putin to start any sort of peace negotiations? He called him by his first name just a few days ago, seems like they are pretty close.

World leaders are often on first-name basis with their counterparts, and sometimes will switch back and forth in public between formal position name of world leader and use of first name. Think of Obama when he said to the Russian rep "Tell Vladimir I'll have more to say after the elections." (paraphrased)

 

[UK Girl]

It's been widely reported Trump's been talking to Putin about ending the war. I expect the Russians and the Ukranians won't be meeting until talks are more advanced.

Russia and US agree to work toward ending Ukraine war in a remarkable diplomatic shift

The meeting is meant to pave the way for a meeting between U.S. President Donald Trump and Russian President Vladimir Putin.

apnews.com

It's a pity that Trump does not give the President of the invaded country the same courtesy as he does the invading one. He see's fit Putin about ending the war but not Zelensky. Then again Zelensky is just an unelected dictator..supposedly

 

[nhmemorymaker]

Oh my. The Russian dossier type smears only work in the echo chambers of those against Trump trying to up the agitation against him. Most Americans know better.

Fake News.

 

[LovesPeace2]

Vance likes to say a lot especially if it is insulting European people. I totally disagree that Europe only cares about Europe.

I think Vance just likes insulting all other countries , they have been insulting us in Canada to and we are suppose to be allys . not so friendly now though. Tbh how much respect do other countries have for them now. No one is forcing trump to help Ukraini if you don't want to help don't but don't be a jerk about it and point a big red arrow telling Russia to. The more we hear the more disgusted people are in what trump is doing. How many country's besides Russia approve of Trump's actions. Respect is earned and I have no respect for trump just my own opinion

 

[iusedtofloat]

French prime minister again lashes out at US over Ukraine, says pause in aid is 'unbearable'

France’s prime minister has decried the U.S. pause on military aid for Ukraine as “unbearable.” François Bayrou mounted his second sharp criticism of the administration of U.S.

apnews.com

“If Russia stops fighting, the war stops. If Ukraine stops fighting, Ukraine disappears,” Bayrou said.

I don't see how anyone can support our current regime, which is more akin to NK and Russia daily.

Things are scarier than ever before in my lifetime.
We need to support our allies, period.
America is not elite.
America is not above everyone else.

We should be a team player. I'm sick and tired of nationalism, elitism, I-know-you-are-but-what-am-I? immaturity taking over crucial, life-changing, life-ENDING (in many Ukranians and Russians case, and with the ending of USAID funding many Americans too) political issues. I don't know how to explain to people that they should care about others.

I'm just tired. And scared. Very scared.

 

[iusedtofloat]

Also - Zelenskyy hardly said anything in Washington. At all. To my eyes, it was a planned attack.

What they said: Trump, Zelenskyy and Vance's heated argument in the Oval Office

President Donald Trump and Vice President JD Vance had a heated exchange with Ukrainian President Volodymyr Zelenskyy in the Oval Office over the war in Ukraine, accusing him of not showing gratitude after he challenged Vance on the question of diplomacy with Russia’s Vladimir Putin.

apnews.com

Reading the transcript, it is obvious he was cut off basically every 5 seconds. He was spoken to with massive condescension and clear annoyance by Trump's supposed vice president (we all know who the real one is...)

Z has thanked America. A LOT.

https://www.cnn.com/2025/02/28/politics/volodymyr-zelensky-thankful-us-fact-check/index.html

 

[Deleted member 352484]

Also - Zelenskyy hardly said anything in Washington. At all. To my eyes, it was a planned attack.

What they said: Trump, Zelenskyy and Vance's heated argument in the Oval Office

President Donald Trump and Vice President JD Vance had a heated exchange with Ukrainian President Volodymyr Zelenskyy in the Oval Office over the war in Ukraine, accusing him of not showing gratitude after he challenged Vance on the question of diplomacy with Russia’s Vladimir Putin.

apnews.com

Reading the transcript, it is obvious he was cut off basically every 5 seconds.

If you watched the entire meeting Zelensky rolled his eyes and made faces throughout. Trump was asked repeatedly by reporters about doing a peace deal to which he responded they were using diplomacy. Zelensky would then start arguing with Trump that diplomacy wouldn't work. Towards the end JD rightly intervenes telling Zelensky we are trying to help him end this thing and act grateful instead of arguing.

Zelensky was in the wrong. I doubt we'll see him back at the White House.

 

[UK Girl]

I think Vance just likes insulting all other countries , they have been insulting us in Canada to and we are suppose to be allys . not so friendly now though. Tbh how much respect do other countries have for them now. No one is forcing trump to help Ukraini if you don't want to help don't but don't be a jerk about it and point a big red arrow telling Russia to. The more we hear the more disgusted people are in what trump is doing. How many country's besides Russia approve of Trump's actions. Respect is earned and I have no respect for trump just my own opinion

We are meant to be their allies too but...but hey at least Zelensky has thanked us a lot

 

[Vern]

French prime minister again lashes out at US over Ukraine, says pause in aid is 'unbearable'

France’s prime minister has decried the U.S. pause on military aid for Ukraine as “unbearable.” François Bayrou mounted his second sharp criticism of the administration of U.S.

apnews.com

“If Russia stops fighting, the war stops. If Ukraine stops fighting, Ukraine disappears,” Bayrou said.
...

RSBM,

I do agree. But, I also hope that she credited Israel's Golda Meir for the paraphrase.

.

 

[iusedtofloat]

I think Vance just likes insulting all other countries , they have been insulting us in Canada to and we are suppose to be allys . not so friendly now though. Tbh how much respect do other countries have for them now. No one is forcing trump to help Ukraini if you don't want to help don't but don't be a jerk about it and point a big red arrow telling Russia to. The more we hear the more disgusted people are in what trump is doing. How many country's besides Russia approve of Trump's actions. Respect is earned and I have no respect for trump just my own opinion

Exactly this. Respect is earned. What is he doing to gain the respect of anyone not in his cult? Cutting their benefits, firing them from their jobs, removing their healthcare, making fun of their gender identity or sexual preference on a national stage, golfing when he should be working, and now putting down the leader of a wartorn country (an actual leader). I got the vibe he and JD were sort of jealous of Z for the respect he has from others, and his courage to stay and fight for his country when he could've left and been safe. Respect from the general public neither JD or T could ever, ever hope to attain.