SC - Columbia - Sheriff Slams Female Student to Floor In Class - #2

[vestigare]

Unlawful order? No, it wasn't. Arrested her because she hurt his feelings? That's one opinion for sure.

Another is that the situation was spiraling way out of control and that allowing a hysterical girl to keep on screaming risked pushing others over the edge.

I'd feel different if the bystander student was more in control of herself and /or had directly challenged Fields. She wasn't and didn't and he did the right thing by arresting her since the teacher and the AP sure weren't stepping up to take responsibility for anything.

I don't think she should have been arrested and I think this will come back to haunt him. It was a bad arrest and the city and school will probably end up paying.

I think he should have just told her to stand aside (not that she was actually in his way as I can see on the film) and just let her get hysterical. She is not responsible for other people as long as she does not actually call for a riot. Anyone else who stepped in to interfere would have been dealt with accordingly. However you do have a legal right to defend yourself and others from police brutality. Now that won't stop you from getting beaten by the cop or arrested but is a legal standard in court.

 

[Hope4More]

I realize in a school student have their first amendment rights curbed for various reasons, however, this incident of arrest did not involve school action. It involved police action independent of the school.

Corporal punishment is ridiculous and shouldn't be allowed in schools but that has to come from the parents because it is only allowed if the parent allows it. My mother always signed the disclaimer that no one at school was allowed to touch her kids and we were told this and told that if they ever threaten to paddle us or whatever they were to call my mother and consult my file. If they even tried to bypass her orders we were to resist, run, whatever we needed to do and then find a phone and call her.

I agree that disobedience and abuse differ from person to person but in this case I agree with you that the punishment of excessive force in no way should have fit a school policy infraction.
I think this is why they should have well fleshed out legal definitions of what is an infraction, abuse, punishment etc...

But see. ..it wasn't a police action independent of the school. It was an SRO action inside a classroom inside a school enforcing laws having to do with student behavior in schools.

That's exactly what is so messed up about SC's approach.

 

[KaaBoom]

RBBM

I respectfully disagree with you. We are taught, even as adults if you see something, say something. In that moment what was she supposed to do? Who was she going to turn to - the teacher and VP or perhaps the officer.

I will be shocked if the second girl arrested is charged with anything. She did the right thing IMO.

Well, she already has been charged. But I would expect the charges against both of them to be dropped soon. No way in hell is a DA going to prosecute that case. A jury would take one look at the video, and see that it was the cop who was creating the disturbance, not the girls.

 

[kimlynn]

Unlawful order? No, it wasn't. Arrested her because she hurt his feelings? That's one opinion for sure.

Another is that the situation was spiraling way out of control and that allowing a hysterical girl to keep on screaming risked pushing others over the edge.

I'd feel different if the bystander student was more in control of herself and /or had directly challenged Fields. She wasn't and didn't and he did the right thing by arresting her since the teacher and the AP sure weren't stepping up to take responsibility for anything.

I wouldn't describe it as screaming. What kind of challenge should she have mounted against LE? She couldn't step in between them, so she voiced that it was wrong.
I don't think she should have been arrested but I'm not surprised that she was. IMO

 

[DexterMorgan]

If some kid starts shooting. Most would be happy that a cop was on board. Jmo. But bringing them in for a dispute like this shouldn't happen unless violence occurred.

 

[bluesneakers]

I thought each of the girls had 3 day suspensions, and pending criminal charges?

From the link:

Columbia, SC (WLTX) - Richland School District Two officials say two students involved in Monday's incident at Spring Valley High School have been allowed to return to school. Meanwhile, a substitute teacher is now in that classroom where the incident happened and an administrator in the school is on paid leave over the situation.

 

[JeannaT]

As I said, I'd be interested in seeing the case you first mentioned play out, because I have a sneaking suspicion the bystander student's rights in that situation are WAY more circumscribed than what you're stating with such certainty.

BTW....did you catch my earlier post that corporal punishment is still legal in SC? If teachers and principals are allowed to smack kids there, I'm thinking maybe the definition and perception of abuse AND of disobediance there is also a whole lot different than what has become the norm most places.

I think you might be right. School districts that still paddle teenagers have a populace that is insensitive to violence against the students. I grew up with that in my high school, and although girls were seldom paddled, boys were with some frequency. And there is nothing that would get them in line faster than the threat of being sent to the office. You don't misbehave more than once if you get paddled.

I don't understand this dynamic, but corporal punishment in the home doesn't work. Corporal punishment in the school achieves the desired effect - gets excellent rule-following behavior out of the student body. Barbaric.

BTW, I saw a John Stossel piece on paddling in high school. He witnessed paddling, and afterwards asked the principal if he would mind submitting to the level of force he subjected his students to, all the while saying it doesn't really hurt it just gets their attention. So John gave him two swats and the principal had tears in his eyes and kept saying wow that hurt. Like, somehow, oddly, he really didn't know.

 

[vestigare]

But see. ..it wasn't a police action independent of the school. It was an SRO action inside a classroom inside a school enforcing laws having to do with student behavior in schools.

That's exactly what is so messed up about SC's approach.

He is a sheriff's deputy. He is controlled and under the charter of the Sheriff. That is why even if the students want him back he can't return because he is no longer a Sheriff's Deputy.
I agree the entire system seems confused and disjointed.

 

[Hope4More]

BBM Like criminal defense lawyer Joey Jackson says, you do what the LEO says and file your complaint afterwards. Wise words imo

That's not just Joey's advice. It is also the advice of many civil rights organizations....as in, there is no complaint to be had if you aren't alive to make it.

 

[sorrell skye]

:facepalm:Body slamming a girl and throwing her across the room equals a beating by any reasonable standards.

I agree. A person doesn't have to be beaten with fists (or an object) to meet the definition of being beaten.

In a DV situation, if a woman had been grabbed in a chokehold and thrown across a room, I think many of us would agree that she had been 'beaten'.

Why is it considered acceptable to grab a defiant teenager around her neck? Why is it considered acceptable to throw her across the room in order to force her removal from a classroom?

Why are we parsing words and arguing about whether or not this teenager was 'beaten'?

This student was assaulted - regardless of whether or not she was pummeled by anyone's fists.

Until the roots of institutionalized violence are addressed, we will never find solutions to domestic violence in all its forms, let alone find solutions to address police brutality. As long as institutionalized violence is condoned and endorsed, domestic violence will continue to be a public health issue that continues to threaten the lives and well-being of thousands of women and children.

 

[KaaBoom]

I thought each of the girls had 3 day suspensions, and pending criminal charges?

Well, thats not what the article says.

 

[BayouBelle_LA]

I only know about California. Which is apparently too confusing for others so we shall not talk about it here. I do know that if a teacher had to leave students alone in a classroom that another credentialed adult needed to be present. Not just any adult.

I was speed reading, trying to catch up and I understood you were talking about California.

 

[JeannaT]

Well, thats not what the article says.

The article doesn't address their length of suspensions at all. "They've been allowed to return to classes" indicates at one point, they were not. IMHO. The article doesn't address one way or another if they had a 3 day suspension, except to hint that they're now allowed to return.

 

[bluesneakers]

Like I said. I think they had 3 day suspensions. They were involved in this incident on Monday. It is now Sunday. They've now been allowed to return to school, my guess is either Thursday or Friday. Or maybe the article, published yesterday, means they were cleared to return tomorrow.

Do you have a link?

 

[EllieBee]

That's not just Joey's advice. It is also the advice of many civil rights organizations....as in, there is no complaint to be had if you aren't alive to make it.

The problem with that logic is that you might never live long enough to make that complaint.

 

[JeannaT]

Do you have a link?

I'm feeling lazy. What's the girl's name who was arrested along with the anonymous girl who is the subject of this story? Then, I'll google that girl's name and "3 day suspension" and supply you with a link that it was originally stated they both will be suspended for 3 days.

Then, consider this. The incident happened on Monday, with a 3 day suspension they would have been allowed to return to classes last Friday.

 

[katydid23]

It's common practice when statements are made as if they are fact for posters to ask for links or more information.

We're discussing the issue in general, at least I was, as a solution or procedure of how to deal with students. Some people think it's a great idea, but you're suggesting no, it's not allowed, and is potentially dangerous. How do you know? What is the reasoning behind the rule? Is it that way everywhere?

I will answer the BOLDED portion. What I know about the situation of leaving a student alone in class is from my experience in my old job, at one particular High School. But I had to look up the exact rules/regulations because of a specific situation that kept occurring in one classroom.

The junior English teacher was a popular teacher that liked to take her class outside on the lawn when they read poetry. And she liked to take them to the school library to pick out books to read. One semester she ended up with a very emotional/obstinate student. This kid would get angry easily and be upset and then not want to take part in the class that day.

She would have all her students up and ready to go to the library and one student would refuse to leave. She called the office a few times with this predicament. It was tough, because according to OUR SCHOOL REGULATIONS, she was not allowed to leave the kid alone in class while the others left. I was told that very clearly. But not just anyone could go sit with him. It had to be a credentialed adult. Not a parent or a custodian.

So he had to be sent to the office but that was a chore in itself. We had resource officers but they never sent one for him. They sent the counselor usually. He eventually was sent to the Alternative school.

 

[vestigare]

I'm feeling lazy. What's the girl's name who was arrested along with the anonymous girl who is the subject of this story? Then, I'll google that girl's name and "3 day suspension" and supply you with a link that it was originally stated they both will be suspended for 3 days.

Then, consider this. The incident happened on Monday, with a 3 day suspension they would have been allowed to return to classes last Friday.

It is easy to find her name. I will not add the name to this forum.
But this link has her name if you need it:
http://edition.cnn.com/2015/10/28/us/south-carolina-school-arrest-videos/

 

[popsicle]

District Two Chief Communications Officer Libby Roof said Saturday that no suspension or expulsion decisions have been taken against either student.

http://www.wltx.com/story/news/loca...alley-incident-allowed-return-class/74942096/

 

[Tricia]

I'm going to instruct SB to start issuing time outs.

It doesn't matter who said what to whom first. STOP MAKING IT PERSONAL. If someone is snarky then alert and scroll. If you respond then you will also receive a time out.