scotland yard investigation

[SapphireSteel]

These two dogs are not only trained for human remains, they react, alert on blood too.. and they also reacted on animal remains, this is why they stopped using them because this animal remain alert which was these two dogs mistake cost government a lot

Oh dear.

Can I suggest you read back there is a specific thread for the dogs.

They do not both alert on anything, Eddie was cadaver and Keela was blood. The dogs are a lot smarter than your average bear and know the difference, just like we can tell red from green.

 

[haden]

Yes why not.

It makes life easier if you blindly trust those "in charge".

:seeya:

I studied science myself, there are reasons why science is used in police work..

If the police in Portugal followed the standard procedures which are followed in most of the developed countries like Portugal we wouldn't be here today.

I am pointing here on researching the Jane Tanner's e-fit, instead of the witchcraft the PJ could for example interview the parents who had their children in the night crèche as well as checking the CCTV cameras near the Smith's sighting.
Let alone protecting the crime scene, checking the DNA on the shutter cord, not allowing the officers to touch the windows so they don't leave the finger prints, ask the officers not to leave the footprints on the floor or not to drop the ash on the floor..

And in charge of all of this was Mr Amaral..

 

[Dushi]

How many people were in and out of that apartment between the time Kate noticed her daughter missing and the time the police were called?

 

[Linda7NJ]

I studied science myself, there are reasons why science is used in police work..

If the police in Portugal followed the standard procedures which are followed in most of the developed countries like Portugal we wouldn't be here today.

I am pointing here on researching the Jane Tanner's e-fit, instead of the witchcraft the PJ could for example interview the parents who had their children in the night crèche as well as checking the CCTV cameras near the Smith's sighting.
Let alone protecting the crime scene, checking the DNA on the shutter cord, not allowing the officers to touch the windows so they don't leave the finger prints, ask the officers not to leave the footprints on the floor or not to drop the ash on the floor..

And in charge of all of this was Mr Amaral..

Wow just wow


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[haden]

I'd like a link that they stopped using these two dogs because they cost the government a lot. Thanks in advance.


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http://news.sky.com/story/844071/sniffer-dogs-can-hinder-police-work

 

[SapphireSteel]

I'd like a link that they stopped using these two dogs because they cost the government a lot. Thanks in advance.


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Here's one I found...I'm tired of these dogs being rubbished...



In the New Year, Keela will be travelling to America to assist the FBI with two murder inquiries. A South Yorkshire force spokeswoman said the crime scene investigation dog has saved more then £200,000 nationally since April this year, helping with investigations in Ireland, Cornwall, Wiltshire, Surrey and the Thames Valley areas...Her programme involved training her to ignore decomposing body materials other than human blood....instead of barking when she smells blood, she has been trained to have a "passive" alert - freezing with her nose as near to the subject matter as possible without touching, to enable scientists to recover the sample quickly and efficiently.

This technique has saved time and money on major investigations.

South Yorkshire Chief Constable Meredydd Hughes said: "Keela's training gives the force an edge when it comes to forensic investigation, which we should recognise and use more often.

http://news.sky.com/story/395084/keelas-nose-makes-her-top-dog


By the way the above was published in 2005 long before the McCann PR machine got hold of them and turned them from a valuable and incorruptible investigation tool into a couple of mongrels run around by a fraudster looking for bacon.

:sigh:

ETA: that fraudster, Grime, was actually PC Grime, dog handler and trainer for the South York police.

 

[Linda7NJ]

http://news.sky.com/story/844071/sniffer-dogs-can-hinder-police-work

Says nothing about the dogs abilities. The dogs accurately identified items that had the scent of human cadaver.









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[aa9511]

Well, I rather trust FSS which is the reputable body than some unknown internet post.. :floorlaugh:

I trust the dogs more than I do first of all, Kate and Gerry McCann's version of what happened, more than Tapas' version of what happened, more than police investigators, more than private investigators, more than DNA specialists, and the list goes on and on.

I don't think you're appreciating the sensitivity of their smell, it is not something we as humans can understand. And they alerted to SPECIFIC places, after they were taken in all the bedrooms of all the Tapas group, and alerted nowhere else. Only specific places and specifc clothing which was that of Kate and Madeleine, which would make sense. They did not go alerting to any of the other Tapas group clothing or the clothing of any of their children or the clothing of anyone else.

 

[Fefster]

I trust the dogs more than I do first of all, Kate and Gerry McCann's version of what happened, more than Tapas' version of what happened, more than police investigators, more than private investigators, more than DNA specialists, and the list goes on and on.

I don't think you're appreciating the sensitivity of their smell, it is not something we as humans can understand. And they alerted to SPECIFIC places, after they were taken in all the bedrooms of all the Tapas group, and alerted nowhere else. Only specific places and specifc clothing which was that of Kate and Madeleine, which would make sense. They did not go alerting to any of the other Tapas group clothing or the clothing of any of their children or the clothing of anyone else.

On but Kate said it was Sea Bass and the fact that they had attended dead bodies as part of their jobs. That alone makes me so skeptical about their version of events.

 

[Linda7NJ]

I trust the dogs more than I do first of all, Kate and Gerry McCann's version of what happened, more than Tapas' version of what happened, more than police investigators, more than private investigators, more than DNA specialists, and the list goes on and on.

I don't think you're appreciating the sensitivity of their smell, it is not something we as humans can understand. And they alerted to SPECIFIC places, after they were taken in all the bedrooms of all the Tapas group, and alerted nowhere else. Only specific places and specifc clothing which was that of Kate and Madeleine, which would make sense. They did not go alerting to any of the other Tapas group clothing or the clothing of any of their children or the clothing of anyone else.

I agree. Dogs don't lie or have a preconceived agenda.


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[haden]

Says nothing about the dogs abilities. The dogs accurately identified items that had the scent of human cadaver.









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Here you go, what the dog in question alerted on and was thought to be a child skull actually was a coconut shell

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...d-abuse-probe-branded-20million-shambles.html

 

[Cappuccino]

I agree. Dogs don't lie or have a preconceived agenda.


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They do give false positives though.

 

[Linda7NJ]

On but Kate said it was Sea Bass and the fact that they had attended dead bodies as part of their jobs. That alone makes me so skeptical about their version of events.

Ah yes, and they routinely drive around with soiled diapers on the trunk, eyeroll


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[Linda7NJ]

Here you go, what the dog in question alerted on and was thought to be a child skull actually was a coconut shell

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...d-abuse-probe-branded-20million-shambles.html

Yawn... Already have had this conversation...


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[aa9511]

On but Kate said it was Sea Bass and the fact that they had attended dead bodies as part of their jobs. That alone makes me so skeptical about their version of events.

Exactly. They act like those dogs are stupid. When in fact they are a million gazillion times smarter than these two parents who, whether innocent or guilty in the murder or whatever the circumstance was, left their kids alone for hours at a time while they socialized.

 

[haden]

Nobody says dogs are stupid. But you have to understand that dogs will point at something like in this case a coconut shell and it is up to the scientists to check what they are pointing at.
Same with McCanns case, dogs have pointed at something, the science researched it and found out not to be of Madeleine's origin

I am OK with using dogs but to be paying a dog handler 750 pounds a day, later to find it was a coconut shell, it is loss of money and loss of the police time

 

[Linda7NJ]

Nobody says dogs are stupid. But you have to understand that dogs will point at something like in this case a coconut shell and it is up to the scientists to check what they are pointing at.
Same with McCanns case, dogs have pointed at something, the science researched it and found out not to be of Madeleine's origin

You're wrong on both counts.


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[SapphireSteel]

Good grief I am soooo sick of the coconut shell.

The dogs alerted to collagen at that site - collagen from a human body.

Human remains were found at that site.

As the dog didn't actually dig up and place the coconut in the evidence bag itself, I cannot see how it is relevant.

Instead of focusing on a case where human error occurred, how about looking at the successes when handled properly?

No, lets look at a coconut shell as "proof" there was no dead body in that alert site - hang on, they found teeth and bone....ummmm....

The dogs themselves were not wrong in Jersey, nor Portugal, nor any of the other myriad countries they were worked in (which included working for the FBI btw).

:banghead:

 

[haden]

That is your opinion Sapphire Steell and this is mine.. we both explained our sides, eh?

 

[haden]

Different set of dogs,for example, Portugese dogs, were brought up much sooner after Madeleine disappeared and 4 dogs separately went the same route, they showed Madeleine walking towards a car park next to the Ocean Club.

Why no one is mentioning these 4 dogs? Why no one is investigation who parked their car in the place they all stopped?