scotland yard investigation

[Linda7NJ]

Here you go, it is mentioned here in this Guardian article that Kate and Gerry have requested employment of the British sniffer dogs.

http://www.theguardian.com/uk/2007/sep/23/ukcrime.internationalcrime

I want a link that proves your assertion that human remains detection has an expiration date and therefore the dogs were wrong. That's what you claimed!




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[Linda7NJ]

I followed the news about Madeleine from the DAY1, from the day only one little forum was there on the net about Madeleine's case.
Also, I am told I've got an elephants memory so these the facts I know back from the 2007.
I am not going to provide any link to prove this. I signed a petition for Keela and Eddie to come to Portugal and also was chatting with a Portuguese policeman at the time who explained to me about the Portuguese dogs.
This was before the secrecy law on the case in Portugal was implemented and people were more open about the case, so everything about the case was coming out to the media and people interested in the case.
When they put secrecy law in action, the misinformation started coming out. Like many Madeleine myths that still circulate on internet.

This^^^^


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[haden]

I want a link that proves your assertion that human remains detection has an expiration date and therefore the dogs were wrong. That's what you claimed!




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Well, I don't have link to that. This is why the petition was written at the time back in 2007, this was the argument against using British sniffer dogs. Kate and Gerry were back then fighting for it, the petition was to bring the UK dogs to Portugal.
Regarding the Portuguese search dogs, they are not so bad.. they search operations are the second in the world, after Canada.

::Three different agencies are responsible for providing search and rescue in Portugal. The Portuguese Navy is responsible for all sea rescues, the Portuguese Air Force[91] for all the rescues originating within the airspace, including aircraft crashes and the Autoridade Nacional de Protecção Civil (ANPC) for all inland rescues. All of the above coordinate closely with each other providing a comprehensive search and rescue service.

The Portuguese area of responsibility is the second largest in the world, only to Canada's. It compromises the Lisbon Flight Information Region (FIR) and Santa Maria FIR.[92]

Search and rescue - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia ::

 

[Jmoose]

Well, I don't have link to that. This is why the petition was written at the time back in 2007, this was the argument against using British sniffer dogs. Kate and Gerry were back then fighting for it, the petition was to bring the UK dogs to Portugal.
Regarding the Portuguese search dogs, they are not so bad.. they search operations are the second in the world, after Canada.

::Three different agencies are responsible for providing search and rescue in Portugal. The Portuguese Navy is responsible for all sea rescues, the Portuguese Air Force[91] for all the rescues originating within the airspace, including aircraft crashes and the Autoridade Nacional de Protecção Civil (ANPC) for all inland rescues. All of the above coordinate closely with each other providing a comprehensive search and rescue service.

The Portuguese area of responsibility is the second largest in the world, only to Canada's. It compromises the Lisbon Flight Information Region (FIR) and Santa Maria FIR.[92]

Search and rescue - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia ::

I am sure there's nothing wrong with their dogs, but they function differently than the English "sniffer" dogs. Some experts say that SAR dogs aren't really used in different situations than cadaver dogs, and some say they are; the training between the Portuguese tracking dogs and Eddie and Keela was very different though, and they really aren't used interchangeably. It would be for this reason that the McCanns would have wanted them.

 

[Cherry]

Did any of you see the video of Gerry and maddy on the bus the shuttle, and how pissed off he was?

 

[haden]

I am sure there's nothing wrong with their dogs, but they function differently than the English "sniffer" dogs. Some experts say that SAR dogs aren't really used in different situations than cadaver dogs, and some say they are; the training between the Portuguese tracking dogs and Eddie and Keela was very different though, and they really aren't used interchangeably. It would be for this reason that the McCanns would have wanted them.

I wouldn't agree with this.
McCanns fought for bringing the UK dogs into Portugal and that time PJ was against it.. the same dogs they were fighting to bring into Portugal made them suspects in the eyes of PJ

 

[Linda7NJ]

Haden thank you for the dog link.


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[haden]

Haden thank you for the dog link.


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You are welcome.

Regarding the files:
I read the whole Madeleine file which was available on the net, all of the statements too.. and somehow I have a feeling that these dogs statement, the one I posted before are very very important, I don't know why but this is what my intuition is telling me..
Same goes for the gardener statement, the one who used to do the gardens next to 5A.. not sure why this statement has caught my attention..maybe poor guy was just scared to speak to the police but somehow I felt something wrong there. Probably the same feeling some people have when they suspect the McCanns
What also caught my attention is how many people actually had keys for the apartments available to them, some would take them home if they have some work to do in the apartments.
I have a feeling the answer to Madeleines whereabouts are in the files and in front of everyone's nose.

 

[Linda7NJ]

Did any of you see the video of Gerry and maddy on the bus the shuttle, and how pissed off he was?

Yep, means nothing to me.. I'd need more context.
IMO We have all been miserable and have had our complete moments. I just like to think mine are very few and far between


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[Jmoose]

I wouldn't agree with this.
McCanns fought for bringing the UK dogs into Portugal and that time PJ was against it.. the same dogs they were fighting to bring into Portugal made them suspects in the eyes of PJ

I think they (the McCanns) were always going to be suspects to the Portuguese authorities, dogs or not. Maybe the McCanns didn't understand what the dogs were going to do-if they did know, they would have left well enough alone when the Portuguese dogs tracked Maddie's movements to the car park. They are damned if they do and damned if they don't. Their best options, and I am sure legal counsel explained it to them, is to let the Portuguese authorities try to pin this on them, and not to volunteer for dog searches, polygraphs and things like that. Nobody's going to be able to convict them of anything-unless they really are responsible, and somebody confesses.

 

[Linda7NJ]

You are welcome.

Regarding the files:
I read the whole Madeleine file which was available on the net, all of the statements too.. and somehow I have a feeling that these dogs statement, the one I posted before are very very important, I don't know why but this is what my intuition is telling me..
Same goes for the gardener statement, the one who used to do the gardens next to 5A.. not sure why this statement has caught my attention..maybe poor guy was just scared to speak to the police but somehow I felt something wrong there. Probably the same feeling some people have when they suspect the McCanns
What also caught my attention is how many people actually had keys for the apartments available to them, some would take them home if they have some work to do in the apartments.
I have a feeling the answer to Madeleines whereabouts are in the files and in front of everyone's nose.

I do realize I am very very biased against them. I would NEVER take my child on holiday to ditch them in daycare everyday and leave them alone every night. I don't like them. Kate every time she speaks the baby hairs on my neck stand on end. I think she's a narcissistic liar that orchestrated this entire abduction scenario to cover up madeleines death.

If she's dead, and I believe she is. I hope her death was swift and accidental by her moms hand. I'd rather she leave this world that way than by the savage hand of some strange sadistic child rapist after who knows how long and how much suffering.




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[neesaki]

On but Kate said it was Sea Bass and the fact that they had attended dead bodies as part of their jobs. That alone makes me so skeptical about their version of events.

Sort of like the rotten pizza in Casey A's car. :scared:

 

[neesaki]

Nobody says dogs are stupid. But you have to understand that dogs will point at something like in this case a coconut shell and it is up to the scientists to check what they are pointing at.
Same with McCanns case, dogs have pointed at something, the science researched it and found out not to be of Madeleine's origin

I am OK with using dogs but to be paying a dog handler 750 pounds a day, later to find it was a coconut shell, it is loss of money and loss of the police time

So I guess the man hours and taxpayer dollars over a period of 6 years, with no answers, no Madeleine, basically nothing to show for it, is an even larger waste than the expense of the dogs. Comparatively speaking, just a drop in the bucket.

Another point, if there is any lack of credibility or reliability on the part of the dogs, and I repeat if, it all goes back to the trainers and those handling the dogs, not the dogs.

 

[aa9511]

Did any of you see the video of Gerry and maddy on the bus the shuttle, and how pissed off he was?

Cherry, do you have a link you could post for that? TIA.

 

[aa9511]

Nobody says dogs are stupid. But you have to understand that dogs will point at something like in this case a coconut shell and it is up to the scientists to check what they are pointing at.
Same with McCanns case, dogs have pointed at something, the science researched it and found out not to be of Madeleine's origin

I am OK with using dogs but to be paying a dog handler 750 pounds a day, later to find it was a coconut shell, it is loss of money and loss of the police time

The dogs' job was to sniff cadaver scent or blood (depending on which dog) and alert for that scent. There is no background noise in their minds...such as, but where could they have put the body? How did they take her out of the room? Who took her if she was abducted? Why would they lie about this? What happened????

Do you see how infinitely simpler the dogs' job was and they were supposed to be very good at that job?

And for all we know there could have been microscopic amounts of some animal's blood or something on that coconut shell, how do we know?! You're telling me dogs can apparently detect cancer cells from within someone's body and yet they wouldn't be able to detect very faint traces of blood on something we normally wouldn't even know had blood on it?

 

[goldengirl57]

This is not true.
These Portuguese dogs are trained to follow the scent on the ground, meaning Madeleine was walking there.
And it is true that the scent they follow expires with time.
Back in 2007 I read every article, I listened to every news report.
I am sure also that the McCanns were the ones who wanted Keela and Eddie to come to Portugal.
Portuguese police was against this. Mostly because they were told these dogs can 'work' only after certain number of days and this timeline has passed.
I remember the McCanns and friends pushed for this and have made an online petition for the UK dogs to go to Portugal. I know because I signed this petition.
I remember a report of McCanns saying if she is dead, we need to know this too.. when they were calling for Keela and Eddie. Also there was a disbelief around whether Keela and Eddie can do anything because their 'time lapse' has passed.
I know very well what I am talking about!

WRONG, it was the BRITISH POLICE who recommended to the PJ to bring Eddie and Keela into the equation not the McCanns.

Your arguement is thrown out because they did indicate death and all the McCanns did was make fun of the dogs finding, even on an interview with Gerry and a reporter he said ASK THE DOGS......

Anyway not going to get into another pointless arguement about the dogs.

They are highly trained that is why they were worth 200,000 UK pound a visit.

They do not lie, they only indicate death or blood not who it belongs to or how old the scent is.

IF the McCanns did ask for the dogs then why did they ignore their findings.......:banghead:

 

[Robin Hood]

Cherry, do you have a link you could post for that? TIA.

IIRC it's on Youtube, I can't search there because my PC crashes, but if you search with similar phrases to what Cherry said (it happened on the bus to the plane) you'll find it. Again IIRC he swears, the version may now be edited. It's something like ''smile Gerry'' he replies 'I'm not flipping here to enjoy myself''

 

[Robin Hood]

Now, can somebody help me here ? When the dogs found Coconut shell it was with human teeth, IIRC, childs milk teeth, now that is source of DNA and maybe they would carry micro amounts of cadaver fluid wouldn't they ? Surely the tiny sinue roots would decomp.

 

[Linda7NJ]

Now, can somebody help me here ? When the dogs found Coconut shell it was with human teeth, IIRC, childs milk teeth, now that is source of DNA and maybe they would carry micro amounts of cadaver fluid wouldn't they ? Surely the tiny sinue roots would decomp.

Yep...if I kill someone and decide to get rid of the body by putting it on a burn pile that I usually use for ....let's say.... deer remains....and the cadaver dog hits on the burnt pile, and the person collecting the evidence also picks up and bags a deer bone fragment... That does not discount the dogs work. the dog did his job ....


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[Robin Hood]

Yep...if I kill someone and decide to get rid of the body by putting it on a burn pile that I usually use for ....let's say.... deer remains....and the cadaver dog hits on the burnt pile, and the person collecting the evidence also picks up and bags a deer bone fragment... That does not discount the dogs work. the dog did his job ....


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Agreed.

Also, it seems odd they hit on Coconut shell don't you think ? I honestly can't see Eddie saying to Keeler ''eh, mark that, it looks awfully like a human skullcap'' More likely a human set of eyes picked that up and said to itself 'that looks like part of a human skull' IYSWIM