Serious DNA discussion

[LI_Mom]

Listen carefully, follow my instructions, any deviation, proper burial, beheading, victory, safe and unharmed... goes a little past domineerig wife, dont you think?

Not at all....

as a matter of fact, I can picture a real bitchy wife using ALL those terms except "proper burial." I think she'd be more likely to threaten a really indecent burial... if any body parts were ever found.

 

[Holdontoyourhat]

Not at all....

as a matter of fact, I can picture a real bitchy wife using ALL those terms except "proper burial." I think she'd be more likely to threaten a really indecent burial... if any body parts were ever found.

Yuk.

Where do you get this stuff?

 

[LI_Mom]

Yuk.

Where do you get this stuff?

If I reveal my sources......

 

[Indianagirl]

Bump for DNA discussion!!!

 

[Chrishope]

Correct.

Only my belief has more factual support. Belief in RDI requires what I have been calling 'complex deduction'.

Case fact: JBR was found with a ligature embedded in her neck.

Simple deduction:

JBR was murdered by strangulation

Complex deduction:

It looks like strangulation, but really it was only staged following a rage accident.
It looks like strangulation, but really it was leftovers from EA.

Case fact: The RN has all these authortative, threatening, graphically violent, and commanding terms.

Simple deduction:

The RN author is an authoritative, threatening, and violent person.

Complex deduction:

The RN author isn't really authoritative, threatening, and violent because the RN is disregarded as 'bogus'.

RDI circumvents the obvious in almost all aspects. Why would I believe RDI?

I don't know any RDI's who don't think she died of strangulation. The coroner says so in his report. (Well, I think he uses asphyxiation). We know from the hemoraging around her neck that she died of strangulation.
Accepting the coroner's report doesn't preclude it being EA.

It still remains a fact that she suffered a blow to the head. Personally I've never been fond of the rage theory of the head injury. It's a possibility but I lean towards the idea that it was done very deliberately.

I disagree that the terms in the RN are authoritative or commanding, at least any more so than any run of the mill RN. All RNs make a "demand" for money and instructions for the victim's family to follow. You might as well say Bruno Hauptman was authoritative and commanding.

I do agree it's threatening and graphically violent. Threats aren't unusual, so there is no reason to suppose a military commander in the Ramsey case more so than in hundreds of other cases. It is graphic in it's description of what will happen. I'll give you that much.

 

[BBB167893]

You could at least represent RDI accurately, Holdon.

 

[Holdontoyourhat]

I don't know any RDI's who don't think she died of strangulation. The coroner says so in his report. (Well, I think he uses asphyxiation). We know from the hemoraging around her neck that she died of strangulation.
Accepting the coroner's report doesn't preclude it being EA.

It still remains a fact that she suffered a blow to the head. Personally I've never been fond of the rage theory of the head injury. It's a possibility but I lean towards the idea that it was done very deliberately.

I disagree that the terms in the RN are authoritative or commanding, at least any more so than any run of the mill RN. All RNs make a "demand" for money and instructions for the victim's family to follow. You might as well say Bruno Hauptman was authoritative and commanding.

I do agree it's threatening and graphically violent. Threats aren't unusual, so there is no reason to suppose a military commander in the Ramsey case more so than in hundreds of other cases. It is graphic in it's description of what will happen. I'll give you that much.

Did you have some examples of 'run of the mill RN's so we could test your theory a little? Or are we just generalizing? This was a 2 1/2 page RN filled with superfluous commands, advisories, instructions, and remarks. Superfluous yet handwritten would seem to go against the RDI theory, I think. Why add unnecessary words when you're writing it? Personally I would never have considered leaving handwriting in any form, even disguised, at a capital crime scene. Would you?? Let alone adding unnecessary commands, advice, instructions, and remarks.

Whoever wrote the RN didn't care about leaving their handwriting there. Why is that??

 

[Chrishope]

Did you have some examples of 'run of the mill RN's so we could test your theory a little? Or are we just generalizing? This was a 2 1/2 page RN filled with superfluous commands, advisories, instructions, and remarks. Superfluous yet handwritten would seem to go against the RDI theory, I think. Why add unnecessary words when you're writing it? Personally I would never have considered leaving handwriting in any form, even disguised, at a capital crime scene. Would you?? Let alone adding unnecessary commands, advice, instructions, and remarks.

Whoever wrote the RN didn't care about leaving their handwriting there. Why is that??

No I wouldn't leave handwriting. That makes me think the writer HAD to write the note. Now, give me a scenario where an intruder HAS to write a note. Why can't he just leave?

 

[BBB167893]

Why add unnecessary words? To you and me they're unnecessary. Who knows what a drama queen bar none might think?

 

[DeeDee249]

Why add unnecessary words? To you and me they're unnecessary. Who knows what a drama queen bar none might think?

The RN is a classic case of "the lady doth protest too much". In her urge to steer suspicion AWAY from the parents, she rambles on with senseless and useless comments (I adviSe you to be well rested...the two gentlemen watching over her don't particularly like you...bring an adequate size attache...) etc.

 

[LI_Mom]

The RN is a classic case of "the lady doth protest too much". In her urge to steer suspicion AWAY from the parents, she rambles on with senseless and useless comments (I adviSe you to be well rested...the two gentlemen watching over her don't particularly like you...bring an adequate size attache...) etc.

Someone who enjoys writing, that's for sure.

 

[angelwngs]

Why add unnecessary words? To you and me they're unnecessary. Who knows what a drama queen bar none might think?

Ah...the more words, the easier it is to remember me...

(as I place my pagent dress and crown across the foot of the bed)

 

[JMO8778]

Did you have some examples of 'run of the mill RN's so we could test your theory a little? Or are we just generalizing? This was a 2 1/2 page RN filled with superfluous commands, advisories, instructions, and remarks. Superfluous yet handwritten would seem to go against the RDI theory, I think. Why add unnecessary words when you're writing it? Personally I would never have considered leaving handwriting in any form, even disguised, at a capital crime scene. Would you?? Let alone adding unnecessary commands, advice, instructions, and remarks.

..and you realize that's something only a woman would do,right? Men get straight to the point.

Whoever wrote the RN didn't care about leaving their handwriting there. Why is that??

desperate times call for desperate measures.they don't call them old cliches for nothing.

 

[JMO8778]

Listen carefully, follow my instructions, any deviation, proper burial, beheading, victory, safe and unharmed...] goes a little past domineerig wife, dont you think?

..it jumps right over into 'journalism major'.
The so-called RN isn't a real RN at all..it's nothing more than a fabricated story to explain why the R's have a dead daughter in their basement.it's written in passive form,with no real threat there.
why would you think a woman couldn't write those words? (can you explain why gender genie says it was written by a female,BTW???) I could be more graphic than Patsy was.it's easy to write something like 'get off your *&^ and get the money you &&^%%.if you don't get it we will blow your *&^%#ing brains out you *$%&^%.
see how easy that was?
Listen carefully, follow my instructions, any deviation, proper burial, beheading, victory, safe and unharmed...I don't see any reason a woman wouldn't chose these words...it's nothing more than a story,after all.How many times has a female teacher said to her students 'follow my instructions',don't deviate from them','listen carefully,class','don't get lost b/c we want to keep you safe and unharmed'.(?)
It's all very feminine to me. You could easily throw in 'if your pet dies you should bury it properly','we find victory in Jesus',or 'they behead ppl in some countries'.hmm,not impossible.not even difficult to imagine a woman wouldn't or couldn't use those words.not at all.

 

[Holdontoyourhat]

..and you realize that's something only a woman would do,right? Men get straight to the point.

Between the easily shown commanding military vocabulary in the RN, and the sexual assault and strangulation murder of the 6 year old girl, I am about as far away as you can get from believing a woman was involved.

 

[Holdontoyourhat]

You or I or any would not leave any handwriting, let alone excess words, at a capital crime, if we lived there.

Its a fact that the farther you are away from the RN, the less risk involved in writing it. I believe the perp knew that when he wrote it.

RDI simply and calmly states that PR was a drama queen and 'needed' to write a long rambling note, but RDI offers nothing to support it. Its a claim because RDI 'needs' to have PR be guilty, and the only way PR would be guilty is to make sure she 'needed' to write the note.

If there was a rational reason why PR would 'need' to write not just a note but a 2 1/2 page note, please describe it. It would be fiction but go ahead anyway.

Its been argued by RDI that PR needed to write the note to 'explain the dead child in the basement'. Why? If the RN didn't exist, you would have JBR, a garrote, a 2nd ligature, unsourced cord and tape, and unknown male DNA on more than one article of clothing she was wearing at the time. Really, RDI, please explain HOW a 2 1/2 page ransom note could possibly help someone who lived there. Remember you or I wouldn't do it, right?

 

[JMO8778]

Between the easily shown commanding military vocabulary in the RN, and the sexual assault and strangulation murder of the 6 year old girl, I am about as far away as you can get from believing a woman was involved.

sure ya are.you know darn well the open bible connects Patsy to the RN,that's why you denied it and called it a coincidence.hardly.
you also know the RN itself is very damning,one of the most damning pieces of evidence against the R's.that's why you spin this military nonsense.you protest too much!
don't you think we see straight through that?

 

[Holdontoyourhat]

sure ya are.you know darn well the open bible connects Patsy to the RN,that's why you denied it and called it a coincidence.hardly.
you also know the RN itself is very damning,one of the most damning pieces of evidence against the R's.that's why you spin this military nonsense.you protest too much!
don't you think we see straight through that?

I'm sorry I think thats silly. It isn't a case fact that the bible, if open, was even connected to the murder.

Its your opinion.

 

[JMO8778]

You or I or any would not leave any handwriting, let alone excess words, at a capital crime, if we lived there.

um,how can you say what you would do? having all that adrenaline going,knowing you'd better have an explantion for your dead daughter in the house..and if it weren't YOU who actually wrote the note..you had a spouse do it..makes it a whole different story.I don't think JR held out much hope on getting away with it anyway.the evidence might as well point twds Patsy.I think he did a lot of hiding behind her,and directing things her way.

Its a fact that the farther you are away from the RN, the less risk involved in writing it. I believe the perp knew that when he wrote it.

sure,that's why JR had Patsy write it.no skin off his nose.

RDI simply and calmly states that PR was a drama queen and 'needed' to write a long rambling note, but RDI offers nothing to support it. Its a claim because RDI 'needs' to have PR be guilty, and the only way PR would be guilty is to make sure she 'needed' to write the ransom note.

why would we 'need' to have her guilty??? none of us knew her,we therefore don't have any personal interest in saying we believe she was invovled in JB's death and subsequent writing of the RN.we follow the evidence,and go where it leads,and it leads to the R's.
otoh,why do you have the need for the R's to be innocent..to the point of going overboard and creating ridiculous theories and denying and twisting the RN?
calm,yes,that's my style.I have no use in waging an intenet war.I usually ignore snippy posts,but since you're calm about it,I have no problem answering.

If there was a rational reason why PR would 'need' to write not just a note but a 2 1/2 page note, please describe it. It would be fiction but go ahead anyway.

if you were interested in a pausable explanation,you wouldn't be trying to beat me to the punch by insulting anything I have to say beforehand.

 

[JMO8778]

I'm sorry I think thats silly. It isn't a case fact that the bible, if open, was even connected to the murder.

Its your opinion.

it's my opinion you have some interest in making the R's appear innocent.

And I don't think you DO think it's silly,same way I don't think you really believe it's a fanatical religious connection on my part.going a bit overboard,don't you think? (I'm not even fanatically religious)