Sheri Coleman, sons Garett and Gavin murdered 5-5-09, Columbia, IL. Pt3

[SeriouslySearching]

I was just reading up on what the ME could use to determine the time of death. The eyes could be used to help make the TOD determination.:

Truth Lies In The Eyes
The eyes of a victim can also hold answers to the time of death, as a thin cloudy film is developed over the eye within 3 hours after death has occurred. The eyeballs become softer as a result of less fluid pressure behind the eye and the degree to which this has occurred can be used as a measure of the time since death. Again, a less common procedure for deaths that evidently occurred out of the limit of several days.

http://library.thinkquest.org/04oct/00206/text_ta_time_since_death.htm

 

[analytical]

You would have to admit that a man having an affair who ups his wife's life insurance, makes certain the wife's name is not on the home or the cars, and then the wife turns up murdered within 6 months does look very suspicious...Yes?

NO! and I know I'm in the minority but I cannot believe how a case is being made against Coleman based on circumstancial acts.

It does not look suspicious at all when you don't have a mind that immediately jumps to sinister conclusions.

And the search warrants that were sealed today ... likely to keep them out of the media.

 

[SeriouslySearching]

I know she doesn't have a typical church but she is on TV quite often. She didn't come right out and say why he resigned but you can pretty well put 2+2 together. I wonder if she thinks he is guilty or not. She will never say.

She doesn't say it outright, but reading her statements made on the day of the murders, her statement yesterday, and the released statements from JMM...the message is pretty clear to me. Yes, imo, I would say she suspects him.

 

[Fairy1]

Well, you are right. It goes along with the no POI/Suspect thing. Maybe we will see him cuffed n stuffed very soon.

I think it would be quite fitting to do the honors at church on Sunday, but hey...that is just me. I would arrange it so the congregation saw it firsthand and knew there was no doubt the charges were real. I am a B*tch that way when it comes to people who murder their wife and children.

Devious mind....LOVE IT!!!!

 

[Melanie]

In this case it wouldn't help him...it would hurt him since the body temperature needed to be warmer. The body temp after death decreases a degree per hour. Since he was only gone an hour plus a few...the body temps should have been at 97 degrees or above still.

Maybe I've watched too many crime shows, but doesn't the coroner use a body temp test at the crime scene? Since moving the body changes the variables. If this is the case, we should have a pretty accurate TOD by now.

If we are to believe CC's story that they were murdered between the time he left for the gym and LE's arrival -- the bodies should still be warm.

MOO

Mel


Police arriving at the scene of crime should be capable of estimating how long a person has been dead for, by judging from the body temperature and stiffness of the corpse. However, a more accurate evaluation of the time since death must be made by a forensic pathologist in the forensic laboratory. The pathologists/coroners record the temperature of the body, the temperature at the scene of crime, the weight of the victim and all other appropriate variables, which are then applied to a formula designed to predict the time since death. The core body temperature drops at an estimated rate of 0.8K each hour from the time of death, but is ever-changing dependant the surrounding temperature, humidity levels, air movement and fat levels in the body. Thus, the less time that has surpassed since the death, the less variables which will affect the prediction.

 

[SeriouslySearching]

NO! and I know I'm in the minority but I cannot believe how a case is being made against Coleman based on circumstancial acts.

It does not look suspicious at all when you don't have a mind that immediately jumps to sinister conclusions.

And the search warrants that were sealed today ... likely to keep them out of the media.

The only reason they sealed those SWs today was to keep the perp and the public from knowing for a fact the perp's name. This was the first time we have seen anything sealed in this case.

Well...LE jumps to sinister conclusions when they have a 31 year old mother along with her 11 year old and 9 year old sons brutally murdered as they were sleeping in their quiet suburban home. I happen to think along the same lines.

 

[Texas Mist]

Yes, such as gunshot or stabbing, at least to make the scene more horrendous when he would arrive home. Aside from the "Boston Strangler" the way Sheri and the boys were killed doesn't seem to be something a stranger would do about the time people would be waking up in the morning. :waitasec:

I think you're right there with us, panthera.

We've been trying to work with a vengeful perp scenario....you know, the one who wrote the threatening letters in the past 6-9 months....so the perp decides it's payback time, chooses to go to a quiet neighborhood during the time that many folks are beginning to start their day, waits for CC to leave (CC didn't work the nite before but heads to the gym), gets into the house & makes his way upstairs to strangle CC's loved ones (not the fastest method for murder, right?), finds & removes a hidden DVR for the security cams (unconfirmed rumor about the DVR), spray paints messages then exits the home...all within an available timeframe of 60-70 minutes or so.

Not many of us see this as likely (not impossible, just not likely).

 

[Fairy1]

NO! and I know I'm in the minority but I cannot believe how a case is being made against Coleman based on circumstancial acts.

It does not look suspicious at all when you don't have a mind that immediately jumps to sinister conclusions.

And the search warrants that were sealed today ... likely to keep them out of the media.

Again, your determination to defend CC is admirable. But when I read your posts, one phrase comes to mind over and over for me....

"There are none so blind as those who will not see."

It may seem circumstantial now, but in the end, I believe it will be a 100% airtight case.

 

[SuziQ]

Thanks for your observation. I don't attribute sinister motives to upping the life insurance nor having her name removed from the house. This could be a financial move suggested by the course. The timing coincides with the time they hosted Ramsey's course in their home.

For purposes of refinancing and debt load could be another reason her name was removed from the deed.

For most people it's not a sinister move, but you throw in a dead wife, two dead children and alleged girlfriend and it changes the entire picture.

In so many cases, with missing or murdered wives anyways, a discovery of a spouses financial dishonesty was a major factor in their murder. Sometimes wives are murdered to prevent the wife from making a discovery of that nature.

 

[Amster]

NO! and I know I'm in the minority but I cannot believe how a case is being made against Coleman based on circumstancial acts.

It does not look suspicious at all when you don't have a mind that immediately jumps to sinister conclusions.

And the search warrants that were sealed today ... likely to keep them out of the media.

Most cases are circumstantial.

 

[Stella5]

On stl comments some one posted since Sheri's name isn't on the house her family has no rights to it or its contents they heard that on fox 2.

That can be contested in the State of Illinois. Survivorship something or something... it's been 2 years, I can't remember now... but our atty was going to have us file to get my brothers stuff.

 

[Stella5]

There is a rumor a knife was used on Sheri (which makes sense to me with the searches they did). Another rumor is that Miss Motive (Fl mistress) will testify in front of a GJ review. :waitasec:

Outside of that, can't think of a thing new really besides my dog finally got a bath and he smells great.

I heard tonight that there was an additional weapon, but it wasn't revealed as to what that weapon was. With no noise, we all concluded knife as well.

I did hear Miss Motive is going to the GJ. I knew she'd turn on him when he denied he knew her (through artie & co).

Glad your doggie smells better ~ next time bathe mine too while you're at it ;-)

 

[impatientredhead]

LOL My husband thinks the same thing LMAOROTF he hates when I watch it in bed and he is trying to sleep says he gets nightmares

My husband gets so tired of hearing the forensics of different cases and doesn't get my interest at all. I told him about this case and how I do not get how these guys (generally men, some women too) plot these things in advance and then not only have unexpected issues arise, but the plan itself was horribly faulty. There is so much information out there on forensics and how LE proceeds, not to mention detailed accounts of how all the others before them got busted. I would expect a much better plan.

Messing with the furnace during the winter and killing the entire household with carbon monoxide would be much easier and less likely to be caught. Your fingerprints on the furnace would prove nothing. It is your house, you have touched it. It has been acting up, you tried to fix it. Of course your prints are there. Things that happen in real life, horrible tragedies..... not things that happen in bad movies like a phantom stalker who writes letters for months in advance and leaves messages on the wall. Is this stalker a frustrated writer? I mean really? That is about as plausible as the nanny who takes your kid and leaves you a script to follow.

It must be a narcissistic personality trait that would let someone believe they are that much smarter than the rest of the world.

The police are handling things quite well from what I can see. They need the tests to come back before arrested him. There are no witnesses, no excited utterances, etc.... they need real probable cause before taking that step. It is glaringly obvious doesn't count in court. If they arrest him too soon and a well funded defense attorney can argue that the arrest was made without cause it would be a disaster for the state. Lab tests take time to run. In our crime riddled society the labs are flooded with work and backlogged. This is hardly the only set of forensics LE is waiting to come back.

 

[impatientredhead]

That can be contested in the State of Illinois. Survivorship something or something... it's been 2 years, I can't remember now... but our atty was going to have us file to get my brothers stuff.

They can also sue for wrongful death (which they should do asap once charges are filed in hopes of freezing the assets). In that situation it would not matter what her name was or wasn't on, they will be going after any and all of his assets.

 

[SeriouslySearching]

Maybe I've watched too many crime shows, but doesn't the coroner use a body temp test at the crime scene? Since moving the body changes the variables. If this is the case, we should have a pretty accurate TOD by now.

If we are to believe CC's story that they were murdered between the time he left for the gym and LE's arrival -- the bodies should still be warm.

MOO

Mel


Police arriving at the scene of crime should be capable of estimating how long a person has been dead for, by judging from the body temperature and stiffness of the corpse. However, a more accurate evaluation of the time since death must be made by a forensic pathologist in the forensic laboratory. The pathologists/coroners record the temperature of the body, the temperature at the scene of crime, the weight of the victim and all other appropriate variables, which are then applied to a formula designed to predict the time since death. The core body temperature drops at an estimated rate of 0.8K each hour from the time of death, but is ever-changing dependant the surrounding temperature, humidity levels, air movement and fat levels in the body. Thus, the less time that has surpassed since the death, the less variables which will affect the prediction.

Correct. The bodies should still be very warm if Chris' timeline is true. Yes, they will do an evaluation at the crime scene to account for all the variables. I was looking for the ways of determining between less than an hour and more than an hour.

I would think they already have an accurate TOD.

 

[analytical]

Again, your determination to defend CC is admirable. But when I read your posts, one phrase comes to mind over and over for me....

"There are none so blind as those who will not see."

It may seem circumstantial now, but in the end, I believe it will be a 100% airtight case.

Could the same be true in reverse... past cases color posters' vision to see clearly?

I'd bet on it .....

 

[SuziQ]

Maybe the basement floor needed to be cleaned up? Also, an open basement window is not a good thing if it rains or the sprinklers come on.

 

[SuziQ]

Could the same be true in reverse... past cases color posters' vision to see clearly?

I'd bet on it .....

Actually past cases, many many many and many more of them cause posters to see more clearly. I'm pretty sure trained detectives experience this as well.

 

[Stella5]

Started looking over NG transcript from the 13th & this caught my eye:

Chris Coleman, the husband and father who lost his wife and two kids to reported strangulation in their own home, may have been having a relationship with another woman, according to “The St. Louis Post-Dispatch,” “The Post-Dispatch” alleging through law enforcement sources cops traveled to Florida to interview the alleged, woman who they report worked in a bar and as a hostess for a gentlemen`s club. An attorney for Coleman tells the newspaper he doesn`t think it`s appropriate to comment on the status of the investigation and says he has no knowledge of anyone by the alleged woman`s name.

Hmmmm...so if CC's attorney honestly didn't know the g/f's name, does this mean he was blindsided by a reporter's inquiry?

Does this mean that CC had not disclosed to his atty that he had some kind of relationship on the side??

An atty wouldn't lie about this would he (?) - so it doesn't look too good for CC to have withheld this info from his high-powered defense atty.

wow.

FWIW... Artie & Co will say anything to portray their client as innocent. Look up Dennis Bulloch and what he did to his wife and how Artie & Co tried to get him off.

Not defending POSCC at all because he is slime... but remember Artie & Co are in place to make him look innocent. Not sure how they can sleep at night.

 

[analytical]

For most people it's not a sinister move, but you throw in a dead wife, two dead children and alleged girlfriend and it changes the entire picture.

In so many cases, with missing or murdered wives anyways, a discovery of a spouses financial dishonesty was a major factor in their murder. Sometimes wives are murdered to prevent the wife from making a discovery of that nature.

You're assuming financial dishonesty.

You nor anyone else .. but you do .. take this case and others you have "sleuthed" and leap to illogical conclusions.

Perhaps I have a less than colored perspective as my head is not filled with citing "well.. in this case" .....

It would be helpful to view this case solely .. not in light of .. "oh.. Scott Peterson did those so it holds ABSOLUTELY that Coleman did too!"

The conclusions drawn here are sometimes extremely illogical .. and seem so charged with emotion rather than logic and reasoning.

Is that enough ... explanation?