Skyla Whitaker, 11, & Taylor Placker 13 - Found Murdered - #11

[GetSmart]

So this is a different bust than the one on the last page ?

Remember the one I posted awhile back about a lab that blew up across from the Police Station
Midtown Tulsa Meth Lab Bust

Hours after a massive meth bust Tuesday, investigators with the Tulsa County Drug Task Force were still on the scene gathering evidence. They cleaned up potentially deadly chemicals. The bust happened at an apartment complex near 41st and Harvard.

Three men and three women were taken into custody. Court records show all have prior drug convictions except for Ashton Mallory.



Investigators tell Fox 23’s Abbie Alford they found a deadly mix of chemicals such as iodine, thousands and dollars worth of glass and a bagful of matches, which investigators say meth makers use to scratch off the red phosphorus to make meth.

Neighbor Christian Woods says, "It's crazy. Right here in my own neighborhood."


And right where Woods walks everyday, he says he smelled something odd here recently but never imagined it was meth.



"Every time I walk to the Shell store I can smell the chlorine, I smell it every time," says Woods.



Deputies smelled it too. One undercover deputy with the Tulsa County Drug Task Force says, "When the occupants opened the door and saw that it was a police officer they slammed the door in our face. We had a pretty dangerous situation."......................................................

 

[FlowerChild]

I am from Tulsa - born and raised there - even went to college there.
I am aware of what goes on in rural OK, my 85 year old parents and almost ALL of my OK family live in rural Oklahoma. I also have family in rural MO and rural AZ and rural IN and rural NC. There is a problem, everywhere - however it's somewhat exaggerated by the media coverage. It's not like there is a meth lab on every rural road or that the gang-bangers and drug dealers are roaming the countryside like packs of wolves shooting random people and dumping dead bodies.

North Tulsa is hardly an example of how things are in rural Oklahoma - but even Tulsa is not exactly awash in murders - the murder rate is relatively low. Just because the meth problem has spread to rural areas does not mean that there are suddenly tons of murders - meth does not equal murder. Rise in crime (theft, robbery, burglary) yes, not necessarily a rise in murder, especially random, senseless, violent murder of kids.

Meth labs are everywhere - rural and urban - it's an epidemic. However, with necessary ingredients now somewhat restricted in the US, some of the mass production of meth has moved to Mexico - where ingredients are available and it's much less restricted by LE - oh, and plenty of isolated property available. Meth is a blight - it's horribly addictive, it's cheap and easy to produce - anyone can make it if they have the ingredients.

A lot of the people making meth these days are not doing it to SELL, but to supply themselves and their addict buddies - its not like every so called "meth lab" is a criminal enterprise churning out tons of the stuff or gang-related with heavily armed guards and visitors - often it's just Joe and Mary meth-head with their brother-in-law Tim tweaker and his buddy Brad buffoon. They don't have an arsenel, they're more likely to have Tonka trucks and Barbie dolls cuz they have a couple of kids - and they may be paranoid, but they aren't roaming the roads shooting kids - in fact, they already sold anything they had of value (including decent vehicles and guns) to feed their habit. They live in the country cause its CHEAP and no neighbors to bug them or report child neglect - and they get busted because they are stupid, stoned, paranoid and careless, not because they are shooting people.

I don't remember LE stating that they felt THIS murder was related to drugs (or meth labs) and they did search the entire area from ground and air to determine what (if anything) might have been going on - or what the girls might have stumbled onto to cause them to be gunned down on the road. NOTHING.

And whoever shot Taylor and Skyla did it from the road just a few feet away. This wasn't somebody shooting from a distance - some of the CASINGS WERE LYING IN THE ROAD less than 10 feet from Taylor - right there in plain sight a few feet away. That's why I say it was up close and personal - the killer knew exactly who he was shooting...two little girls.

My Opinion

 

[EnvoyDriver61]

If it is drug-related, I don't think the girls saw something they shouldn't have as much as picked it up. If the POI is involved, he's really close to the girls after the murder, either to cover it up or retrieve something.

However, that theory also means he shot a lot of shots with the girls holding something that he didn't mind shooting or was just that good of a shot. I suppose if they had money, it could fit in a small envelope. But, if they had drugs, wouldn't that be bigger and pose a problem from a target standpoint (i.e., you don't want to risk shooting them with it in their possession).

I wonder if LE did any type of swabbings from the girls' hands to see if they might have had any residue or anything.

 

[Trino]

If it is drug-related, I don't think the girls saw something they shouldn't have as much as picked it up. If the POI is involved, he's really close to the girls after the murder, either to cover it up or retrieve something.

However, that theory also means he shot a lot of shots with the girls holding something that he didn't mind shooting or was just that good of a shot. I suppose if they had money, it could fit in a small envelope. But, if they had drugs, wouldn't that be bigger and pose a problem from a target standpoint (i.e., you don't want to risk shooting them with it in their possession).

I wonder if LE did any type of swabbings from the girls' hands to see if they might have had any residue or anything.

He could have retrieved it first, using a gun as a threat. Once he had it in his possession, he could have shot the girls - no evidence.

 

[SeriouslySearching]

So this is a different bust than the one on the last page ?

Remember the one I posted awhile back about a lab that blew up across from the Police Station
Midtown Tulsa Meth Lab Bust

Hours after a massive meth bust Tuesday, investigators with the Tulsa County Drug Task Force were still on the scene gathering evidence. They cleaned up potentially deadly chemicals. The bust happened at an apartment complex near 41st and Harvard.

Three men and three women were taken into custody. Court records show all have prior drug convictions except for Ashton Mallory.



Investigators tell Fox 23’s Abbie Alford they found a deadly mix of chemicals such as iodine, thousands and dollars worth of glass and a bagful of matches, which investigators say meth makers use to scratch off the red phosphorus to make meth.

Neighbor Christian Woods says, "It's crazy. Right here in my own neighborhood."


And right where Woods walks everyday, he says he smelled something odd here recently but never imagined it was meth.



"Every time I walk to the Shell store I can smell the chlorine, I smell it every time," says Woods.



Deputies smelled it too. One undercover deputy with the Tulsa County Drug Task Force says, "When the occupants opened the door and saw that it was a police officer they slammed the door in our face. We had a pretty dangerous situation."......................................................

This meth lab wasn't the same one. This was busted the night before and the other one was in Sapulpa which is outside of Tulsa. At the Tulsa lab, the people had literally taken out walls between apartments to create one huge lab. The rest of the apts. were empty so I am thinking it could have been the owner of the small complex.

 

[SeriouslySearching]

I didn't hear anyone say anything to dispute the girls were shot from close range. Of course, they were. We know the shell casings were found basically a short distance from the girls' bodies.

When they are across the street from police stations, schools, and daycare centers...I would say that it qualifies as roughly being on "every" street corner. My mother at her age doesn't keep up with the druggies in her vicinity and may not know one if he knocked on her door.

I see them everyday in my business and they cut across every class here. Money or status no longer separate the addicts. People I grew up with became entangled with meth and lost everything they had. Being from rural OK and having a brother working for the Sheriff's Dept., I can tell you that it is affecting the murder rates in many counties that never saw a murder. It is affecting crime across the board. Not just burglaries and robberies. It has spilled over into the rural areas because LE has become more effective in the cities to combat the meth labs.

Let me see if I can find one of the latest caught with a meth lab and the arsenal they found! They showed it on the local news. I believe there were over 100 weapons they confiscated along with the ammo for them. I didn't see one Tonka truck or Barbie doll among them curiously enough!

 

[FlowerChild]

If it is drug-related, I don't think the girls saw something they shouldn't have as much as picked it up. If the POI is involved, he's really close to the girls after the murder, either to cover it up or retrieve something.

However, that theory also means he shot a lot of shots with the girls holding something that he didn't mind shooting or was just that good of a shot. I suppose if they had money, it could fit in a small envelope. But, if they had drugs, wouldn't that be bigger and pose a problem from a target standpoint (i.e., you don't want to risk shooting them with it in their possession).

I wonder if LE did any type of swabbings from the girls' hands to see if they might have had any residue or anything.

This would mean that the POI/Killer was watching the girls or the item from a hiding place or a distance away (to know they picked up whatever it was). If the killer was right there, he would have prevented the girls from picking up the item in the 1st place or killed them on the spot - so he had to be watching from somewhere else the girls couldn't see him. If he was sitting on the road where the girls were killed (and the item was there) the girls would have walked around his vehicle on the road, not gone toward the woods (where they were found). The item must have been located somewhere near the bridge and maybe the killer(s) were somewhere on the OTHER side of the bridge watching. That would explain the length of time it took him/them to reach the girls after they had started back home from the bridge.

The positioning of the bodies says to me that the killer drove up on the girls while they were walking and they moved to the ditch to be off the road while he passed. Having them pinned between the road (with his vehicle) and the woods he then shot them where they stopped beside the road. So, if they had something with them they had picked up - the killer(s) were watching from somewhere and then got in a vehicle to go retrieve it from the girls, trapping them along the road and killing them before they could reach home. If the killer(s) were already parked (where the girls were killed) the girls would have walked OUTSIDE the vehicle on the road to get around, not inside the vehicle (and into the brush/ditch). The killer(s) trapped them with the vehicle - and to do that, had to drive up on them as they were walking.

My Opinion

 

[EnvoyDriver61]

I agree, but for a different and simpler reason: the dog went BACK to the bridge and not home. Something was in it's way to go home to safety.

Edit: Addtionally, I think the girls made the bridge fairly close to 5:00 p.m., a perfect "set" time for a drop off, IMO.

 

[GetSmart]

Ok I went searching & I can not find the interview with the Uncle, I know it is under my nose.. anyway I think he is the one that mentioned Drugs.
LE keeps saying ..interrupted something links below

http://edition.cnn.com/2008/CRIME/06/11/ok.girls.deaths/
Rosser said investigators were considering a variety of motives as they searched for suspects, including the possibility of a "random thrill kill."
Because of the girls' ages, Rosser said investigators were looking at computer evidence and questioning young people in the area to develop possible leads.
Authorities said Tuesday that they believed the shooters were most likely from the area, considering the remote location where the bodies were found
http://newsok.com/investigation-no-suspects-officials-say/article/3255855/?tm=1213162539

Rosser said shell casings were found at the scene, as well as tire tracks and footprints. Rosser would not release the caliber of gun thought to have been used in the shooting. The girls had walked along the dirt road to the bridge over Bad Creek."We're not sure whether it was somebody passing by,” Rosser said. "It's an active area for people to throw things from the bridge or shoot things from the bridge.”
Rosser said the road, while remote, gets a fair amount of local traffic. The investigation so far has been focused on people who may live in the area or who would be familiar with the country roads. "It's not likely someone pulled off the interstate or the highway and just stopped there,” Rosser said. "It's possible they went to meet somebody, or interrupted something, or maybe it was a personal attack.”
http://newsok.com/investigation-no-suspects-officials-say/article/3255855/?tm=1213162539
Investigators today were screening a computer that Taylor used at the Placker home, which is common in this type of investigations, Brown said.
Officials believe people connected to the slayings may be from the local area or are familiar with the rural county roads in Okfuskee County.
"That's my gut feeling. It's an isolated area. We don't know if this is some kind of random thrill killing or an attempted abduction or a case of mistaken identity," OSBI Agent Ben Rosser said during the afternoon press conference. "It's possible they may have interrupted something at the bridge."
The bridge along County Line Road is a popular place for teens to gather and shoot guns, Rosser said.
Agents looked into a tip this morning that someone reported a pickup full of boys were in the area around the time of the killings.
"We contacted those individuals, and yes, they had a shotgun," Rosser said. "They told us they were down there shooting, just like they would have been on any Sunday. There's nothing to indicate that they are suspects."
http://www.newsok.com/clues-sought-in-slaying-of-girls-in-weleetka/article/3255420/undefined?pg=1
Ross said shell casings were found at the scene, as well as tire tracks and footprints. Ross would not release the caliber of the gun believed to have been used in the shooting. The girls had walked to a bridge along the dirt road, which is a popular gathering place for residents in the rural county, which is about 90 miles east of Oklahoma City.
"We're not sure whether it was somebody passing by," Ross said. "It's an active area for people to throw from the bridge, shoot from the bridge."
Ross said the road, while remote, the road gets a fair amount of local traffic. The investigation so far has been focused on people who may live in the area or be familiar with the country roads.
"It's not likely someone pulled of the interstate or the highway and just stopped there," Ross said. "It's possible they went to meet somebody, or interrupted something or maybe it was a personal attack."
---------
http://www.newsok.com/article/3255279
It's very difficult,” Choate said. "This was an 11- and a 13-year-old girl. What possible motive could there be? You have to wonder if they saw something they were not supposed to see. Were they just in the wrong place at the wrong time?”
http://edition.cnn.com/2008/CRIME/06/11/ok.girls.deaths/

Rosser said investigators were considering a variety of motives as they searched for suspects, including the possibility of a "random thrill kill."
Because of the girls' ages, Rosser said investigators were looking at computer evidence and questioning young people in the area to develop possible leads.
Authorities said Tuesday that they believed the shooters were most likely from the area, considering the remote location where the bodies were found
http://newsok.com/investigation-no-suspects-officials-say/article/3255855/?tm=1213162539

Rosser said shell casings were found at the scene, as well as tire tracks and footprints. Rosser would not release the caliber of gun thought to have been used in the shooting. The girls had walked along the dirt road to the bridge over Bad Creek."We're not sure whether it was somebody passing by,” Rosser said. "It's an active area for people to throw things from the bridge or shoot things from the bridge.”
Rosser said the road, while remote, gets a fair amount of local traffic. The investigation so far has been focused on people who may live in the area or who would be familiar with the country roads. "It's not likely someone pulled off the interstate or the highway and just stopped there,” Rosser said. "It's possible they went to meet somebody, or interrupted something, or maybe it was a personal attack.”
http://newsok.com/investigation-no-suspects-officials-say/article/3255855/?tm=1213162539
Investigators today were screening a computer that Taylor used at the Placker home, which is common in this type of investigations, Brown said.
Officials believe people connected to the slayings may be from the local area or are familiar with the rural county roads in Okfuskee County.
"That's my gut feeling. It's an isolated area. We don't know if this is some kind of random thrill killing or an attempted abduction or a case of mistaken identity," OSBI Agent Ben Rosser said during the afternoon press conference. "It's possible they may have interrupted something at the bridge."
The bridge along County Line Road is a popular place for teens to gather and shoot guns, Rosser said.
Agents looked into a tip this morning that someone reported a pickup full of boys were in the area around the time of the killings.
"We contacted those individuals, and yes, they had a shotgun," Rosser said. "They told us they were down there shooting, just like they would have been on any Sunday. There's nothing to indicate that they are suspects."
http://www.newsok.com/clues-sought-in-slaying-of-girls-in-weleetka/article/3255420/undefined?pg=1
Ross said shell casings were found at the scene, as well as tire tracks and footprints. Ross would not release the caliber of the gun believed to have been used in the shooting. The girls had walked to a bridge along the dirt road, which is a popular gathering place for residents in the rural county, which is about 90 miles east of Oklahoma City.
"We're not sure whether it was somebody passing by," Ross said. "It's an active area for people to throw from the bridge, shoot from the bridge."
Ross said the road, while remote, the road gets a fair amount of local traffic. The investigation so far has been focused on people who may live in the area or be familiar with the country roads.
"It's not likely someone pulled of the interstate or the highway and just stopped there," Ross said. "It's possible they went to meet somebody, or interrupted something or maybe it was a personal attack."
---------
http://www.newsok.com/article/3255279
It's very difficult,” Choate said. "This was an 11- and a 13-year-old girl. What possible motive could there be? You have to wonder if they saw something they were not supposed to see. Were they just in the wrong place at the wrong time?”
-*

 

[FlowerChild]

I agree, but for a different and simpler reason: the dog went BACK to the bridge and not home. Something was in it's way to go home to safety.

Edit: Addtionally, I think the girls made the bridge fairly close to 5:00 p.m., a perfect "set" time for a drop off, IMO.

Now the question is were they killed by whoever was dropping off the item OR the person(s) who were there to PICK UP the item?

Maybe it was the pick-up person - they pass the girls and go to the bridge - item is not there - they call the drop-off person who describes the item and where it was left - the pick-up person realizes (or thinks) the girls have his item (or at least MIGHT have it) and turns around to go to get the item from the girls. He gets to the girls and does a u-turn to trap/stop the girls progress. He gets out and asks them for the item, they give him the item OR they argue or don't cooperate or say they don't have the item. He shoots them. If he didn't get the item 1st, he checks the bodies for the item. Maybe he calls the drop off person again to verify what the item is wrapped in, looks like etc. The killer looks AGAIN for the item around the girls. Maybe he shoots them in the head, with another gun just to be sure they are dead. He leaves - maybe he has his item, maybe he doesn't - but now a 2nd person knows about the girls and who killed them. It becomes even MORE important for everyone to keep quiet.

Is the killer even still alive? Maybe the drop off person(s) got rid of the killer to stop him from talking and implicating him/them in a different crime? Maybe now only one person knows and he didn't do the killing and knows nothing about it except who did it - and he may not even know exactly who that person is/was. Even if he was arrested or questioned, he has an alibi and knows none of the details - he wasn't there. He might even pass a lie detector test - he didn't kill the girls - he might even have killed the killer -but LE isn't asking about THAT.

Just more food for thought

My Opinion

 

[Lola]

They must have known one or the other, wouldn't you think? Little girls could give a description -- even adults aren't necessarily reliable, but if they knew the person --

 

[FlowerChild]

They must have known one or the other, wouldn't you think? Little girls could give a description -- even adults aren't necessarily reliable, but if they knew the person --

Or maybe he was just ticked off because they didn't hand over his "whatever" when he asked/demanded. Maybe he thought they were lying to him and it made him mad. Maybe he shot one by accident while he was threatening them with the gun and thought he was in trouble for sure and might as well just kill both of them. These were tweenaged girls - they probably were taught NOT to be friendly to strangers and when he approached they yelled or got out a cell phone or made a rude gesture or something. I know girls this age can be pretty rude - they do feel rather invincible and can be a bit smart-azz too. They could see the HOUSE from where they were and they probably felt pretty safe - maybe safe enough to rudely blow off a stranger who asked them for his envelope or whatever he thought they had - especially if they had no clue what he was talking about.

My Opinion

 

[Mysterylover]

If it is drug-related, I don't think the girls saw something they shouldn't have as much as picked it up. If the POI is involved, he's really close to the girls after the murder, either to cover it up or retrieve something.

However, that theory also means he shot a lot of shots with the girls holding something that he didn't mind shooting or was just that good of a shot. I suppose if they had money, it could fit in a small envelope. But, if they had drugs, wouldn't that be bigger and pose a problem from a target standpoint (i.e., you don't want to risk shooting them with it in their possession).

I wonder if LE did any type of swabbings from the girls' hands to see if they might have had any residue or anything.

Don't forget the little dog...Taylor would have been carrying the Chihuahua, while walking home, IF everything was normal/OK...imo

1. Why didn't the dog get shot? If the shooter was so close to shoot her in the chest, the dog should have been shot, too.....unless she had already dropped the dog..for some reason.
2. Why didn't GP see the dog near the girls when he found them? Dogs know when something is wrong with their master and usually tries to stay with the master or barks to get help..
3. Why didn't the little dog see GP or GM or just run home, the dog knew the way?
4. WHY was the DOG waiting for Taylor at the bridge the next day? Why at the bridge and not at home near her playhouse?....jmi

 

[ArizonaGiGi]

I agree, but for a different and simpler reason: the dog went BACK to the bridge and not home. Something was in it's way to go home to safety.

Envoy, what/who are you agreeing with? Some of the posts are so long that I loose my train of thought while reading them. :crazy:
I do agree with you that the dog ran back to the bridge (to seek safety) because something was blocking it's route home. IMO a big dog may have gone thru the woods to get back home but a teeny chihuahua most likely would have huddled in fear under the bridge.

 

[Morag]

Don't forget the little dog...Taylor would have been carrying the Chihuahua, while walking home, IF everything was normal/OK...imo

1. Why didn't the dog get shot? If the shooter was so close to shoot her in the chest, the dog should have been shot, too.....unless she had already dropped the dog..for some reason.
2. Why didn't GP see the dog near the girls when he found them? Dogs know when something is wrong with their master and usually tries to stay with the master or barks to get help..
3. Why didn't the little dog see GP or GM or just run home, the dog knew the way?
4. WHY was the DOG waiting for Taylor at the bridge the next day? Why at the bridge and not at home near her playhouse?....jmi

Letsthink, I believe the dog to be an important clue, also. I think that the girls were separated from the dog before they died- maybe at the bridge. I think the dog was with the shooter(s). I think the dog was dropped off at the bridge after the shooter(s) left the crime scene. Although few dogs act like Lassie when a crisis arises, it's hard to imagine that that little ole dog left his bleeding mistress and trotted all the way back to the bridge. Surely he would have stayed there or at least gone home.

Btw, do we know if he was a standard chihuahua (tiny) or a teacup (extra tiny)? I've recently become acquainted with a teacup, and that dog couldn't walk to the other side of the room in less than five minutes, much less to a bridge a half mile away.

 

[GetSmart]

FlowerChild "The killer(s) trapped them with the vehicle - and to do that, had to drive up on them as they were walking."

That sounds logical.
I keep looking for crimes in the area & new people arrested..nothing that goes hand in hand. I am on the fence about alot of this. We know They were shooting to kill.

 

[frogjustfrog]

Hi ladies. I jsut wanted you to know that this is becomming emotionally difficult for me. I really AM a weenie, although I seem to be able to buck up against a few. lol I've just had to take a break a couple of days. May need a couple more. I dont know. BUt I didnt want anyone to worry about me.

 

[frogjustfrog]

This is what I am thinking also. In fact it is the only explanation that makes sense to me.

If this is true though, then what kind of a community is this?

This has been the problem for a long as I can remember. and that is about 50 years. I am just scared to talk about it where LE could read it. It really is THAT scary. Blotched stuff, covered up, and probably more.
I am not feeling good about talkling about it. That is why I havent been in topix

 

[Fairy1]

This has been the problem for a long as I can remember. and that is about 50 years. I am just scared to talk about it where LE could read it. It really is THAT scary. Blotched stuff, covered up, and probably more.
I am not feeling good about talkling about it. That is why I havent been in topix

Oh dear. I'm sorry I don't recall - but how close are you to where this occurred?

 

[SeriouslySearching]

I don't believe they are "covering up" anything here. While I do understand that things have happened in OK Law Enforcement over the years, things have come a long way since the "good ole' boy" days of politics and them being in bed with LE.

This case is being done by the book. OSBI is top notch and the best we have to offer. From the bombing in OKC to working the most mundane cases...I believe they have the expertise to solve this one eventually. I do wish they would be more forthcoming with information and use the public's help tho.