Toth
Inactive
You seem to have an unjustly low opinion of Attorney Lin Wood.
Spade/FFJ info
- Thread starter Tricia
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CANADA Canada - Saskatoon, WhtFem 498UFSK, early 1900s murder victim, Jun'06
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candy
Inactive
Right Toth. Lin Wood whipped all those BDI people, every last one of them.
Ivy
Inactive
Toth, I have a very low opinion of Lin Wood, but it is not an unjust opinion. It's based on his words and his actions.
Candy, your buddy Wood "whipped all those BDI people" by using as a weapon an affidavit that merely stated that LE had not developed any evidence against Burke. Pretty slick.
Candy, your buddy Wood "whipped all those BDI people" by using as a weapon an affidavit that merely stated that LE had not developed any evidence against Burke. Pretty slick.
candy
Inactive
Toth, you'll understand this:
To show how Spade sees what he wants to see and only that, when The Globe ran an interview with Mike Kane, Spade wrote to me about my post that the focus of the grand jury was Patsy Ramsey. Numerous people had told me this. He screamed at me in no uncertain terms that I was wrong, that Burke was the focus of the grand jury. To mollify him, I posted his opinion of who the focus of the grand jury was.
candy
Member
Member # 311
posted 08-02-2002 02:35 PM
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I received an email from a person with great knowledge of this case. He strongly took issue with my post that Mike Kane believes Patsy did it. He believes, through his own sources, that Kane believes Patsy was involved in the staging aspects, but not the crime. I wanted to post that, because of his strong belief in this issue.
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About a year later, Mike Kane was on Dan Abrams he made it clear that BURKE WAS NOT EVEN A SUSPECT IN THIS CASE, let alone the focus of the grand jury. Spade just makes things up.
To show how Spade sees what he wants to see and only that, when The Globe ran an interview with Mike Kane, Spade wrote to me about my post that the focus of the grand jury was Patsy Ramsey. Numerous people had told me this. He screamed at me in no uncertain terms that I was wrong, that Burke was the focus of the grand jury. To mollify him, I posted his opinion of who the focus of the grand jury was.
candy
Member
Member # 311
posted 08-02-2002 02:35 PM
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
I received an email from a person with great knowledge of this case. He strongly took issue with my post that Mike Kane believes Patsy did it. He believes, through his own sources, that Kane believes Patsy was involved in the staging aspects, but not the crime. I wanted to post that, because of his strong belief in this issue.
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Posts: 2714 | Registered: A Long Time Ago! | IP: Logged
About a year later, Mike Kane was on Dan Abrams he made it clear that BURKE WAS NOT EVEN A SUSPECT IN THIS CASE, let alone the focus of the grand jury. Spade just makes things up.
Britt
New Member
More from Spade at FFJ:
Bonita's write-up of this section of 12/26/96 cross-checks with many facts from Linda Arndt's deposition. Bonita had access to all the BPD reports.
Finding the Body:
It was approaching 1:00 p.m. and still no word had come in from the kidnappers. In order to give John something to do to keep him from pacing the floor, Det. Arndt told Fleet, I need your help in keeping Johns mind occupied. Could you ask him to recheck the house top to bottom to see if anything belonging to JonBenet had been taken or left behind?" Fleet, hesitating, responded, I think it would be better coming from you. Arndt located John and asked him to assist Fleet on this search.
John went to the basement door with Fleet following. Fleet first took John to the train room to show him the unlatched broken window that he had discovered on his first excursion into the basement. John explained to Fleet, "I broke that window last summer when I misplaced my house key and had to break in." They searched for broken glass on the floor and found one small splinter. John and Fleet then looked in a broom closet and another small room. While Fleet was still checking other closets, John walked to the wine cellar and tried to pull open the door. Because the top latch was secured, the door would not open. John reached up, undid the latch, and opened the door. Fleet, who was about 20 feet away, heard John exclaim, "Oh my God, oh my God," and went running to the room where John was standing. As Fleet approached the door, John flipped on the wine cellar light switch. Fleet saw the body of JonBenet laying on the floor.
John said he saw the white blanket on the floor as soon as he opened the door, and when the lights came on he saw his daughter laying on the blanket. The sides of the blanket were wrapped over her legs, her head was pointing toward the inside of the room and her feet pointing towards the doorway. Her hands were tied together and laying above her head, and tape covered her mouth. John knelt beside JonBenet and felt her pale white cheeks. He ripped the tape from his daughter's mouth and flung it aside.
John then tried to untie the rope binding her hands and discovered that her arms were stiff. 'Fearing that she was dead, John let out a scream of despair. Fleet ran up the basement stairs to the main floor. Appearing extremely distraught, he grabbed a phone, dialed two or three numbers, but then hung up. He turned to go back to the basement door, but then stopped and yelled for someone to call for an ambulance. All eyes were riveted on the basement stairwell door as John's scream was heard by everyone else still in the house.
John slowly climbed up the stairs carrying JonBenet with his arms around her waist. Her motionless arms reached above her head and her lips were blue. Responding to Arndt's instructions to lay her down, John placed his daughter on a rug inside the doorway at the top of the stairs. Arndt immediately reached out to the child to feel for a pulse in her neck. The skin as cold to the touch and an odor of decay had already started to set in. JonBenet appeared to have been dead for some time. Rigor mortis had begun and the lower part of her neck and right side of her face showed signs of liver mortis - a condition caused from the settling of block in the lower part of the body after the heart stops pumping blood. A bright red mark, about the size of a quarter, was visible on the front of her neck. A white cord was attached to her right wrist. John asked Det. Arnt if JonBenet was alive, and when she replied negatively, John moaned.
Arndt instructed John to go back to the den with Patsy and call 911 and ask that the detectives return and a coroner respond. Arndt then picked up JonBenet and carried her to the rug located inside the living room. After Arndt laid the lifeless body on the floor, a load guttural moan and wail was heard coming from the den apparently made by Patsy. John reentered the room where his daughter lay. He grabbed a lap robe that was laying on a nearby chair and asked Det. Arndt if it was all right to cover her. Not waiting for a response, he laid the blanket over JonBenets body. Arndt told John that he could say goodbye to his daughter, but not to touch her hands, move her body or lower the blanket that Arndt had readjusted to cover JonBenets clothing.
John first knelt down next to his child and stroked her hair, softly calling out, "my little angel." Then he laid next to her body with his arm around her. Crying sounds appeared coming from him, but no tears were visible. John rolled away and came back up to a kneeling position, looking briefly towards the hallway. John turned to Arndt and said, It has to be an inside job. It has to be somebody that knows the family. Nobody knows about the wine cellar in the basement.
Patsy was coming towards the body Of JonBenet, walking with the Assistance of Rev. Hoverstock, and her friends, the Whites and the Fernies. When she entered the hallway where JonBenet lay, she rushed to her and laid down on top of her dead child.
Barbara picked up a gray sweatshirt lying on a chair and placed
it over the childs exposed bare feet. Arndt told the family and
friends to gather in a circle around JonBenet while Rev.
Hoverstock lead them in a prayer. In spite of the numbing shock
and grief felt by everyone in the room, they joined Rev. Hoverstock in reciting "The Lord's Prayer" as Patsy lay on top of JonBenet crying and moaning. Suddenly, Patsy raised herself onto her knees, lifted her arms into the air and prayed, "Jesus you raised Lazarus from the dead, raise my baby from the dead'''
Arndt realized that there had been no response to the 911 call she had asked John to make. She grabbed a cell phone and called the 911 dispatch. She told the dispatcher that she needed a detective and the coroner at her location. Within a few minutes an ambulance was seen slowly driving past the Ramsey house, but did not stop. After another five minutes had gone by, she called dispatch a second time and requested a supervisor, again stating she needed a detective and a coroner at her location at 755 15th Street and that she was on scene at a homicide. Within five minutes of this second call, Officer Weiss appeared at the door, and soon he was joined by other officers and detectives returning, along with the ambulance and paramedics. The paramedics, aware that it was too late JonBenet, focused their attention on Patsy, who appeared to be swooning. Although obviously distraught, Patsy did not need any medical treatment and the paramedics left the house.
Arndt later learned that the delay to her 911 call occurred because the call that been received by Weld County, not Boulder County, and Weld County dispatch had been confused by the address given in the request for assistance.
Now that the mystery of the whereabouts of JonBenet had been solved by the horror of the discovery of her body, it was no longer necessary for anyone to await contact by kidnappers. Arrangements were being made for John and Patsy to go to the home of the Fernies. The Ramseys then left their Boulder home, vowing never to return.
Bonita's write-up of this section of 12/26/96 cross-checks with many facts from Linda Arndt's deposition. Bonita had access to all the BPD reports.
Finding the Body:
It was approaching 1:00 p.m. and still no word had come in from the kidnappers. In order to give John something to do to keep him from pacing the floor, Det. Arndt told Fleet, I need your help in keeping Johns mind occupied. Could you ask him to recheck the house top to bottom to see if anything belonging to JonBenet had been taken or left behind?" Fleet, hesitating, responded, I think it would be better coming from you. Arndt located John and asked him to assist Fleet on this search.
John went to the basement door with Fleet following. Fleet first took John to the train room to show him the unlatched broken window that he had discovered on his first excursion into the basement. John explained to Fleet, "I broke that window last summer when I misplaced my house key and had to break in." They searched for broken glass on the floor and found one small splinter. John and Fleet then looked in a broom closet and another small room. While Fleet was still checking other closets, John walked to the wine cellar and tried to pull open the door. Because the top latch was secured, the door would not open. John reached up, undid the latch, and opened the door. Fleet, who was about 20 feet away, heard John exclaim, "Oh my God, oh my God," and went running to the room where John was standing. As Fleet approached the door, John flipped on the wine cellar light switch. Fleet saw the body of JonBenet laying on the floor.
John said he saw the white blanket on the floor as soon as he opened the door, and when the lights came on he saw his daughter laying on the blanket. The sides of the blanket were wrapped over her legs, her head was pointing toward the inside of the room and her feet pointing towards the doorway. Her hands were tied together and laying above her head, and tape covered her mouth. John knelt beside JonBenet and felt her pale white cheeks. He ripped the tape from his daughter's mouth and flung it aside.
John then tried to untie the rope binding her hands and discovered that her arms were stiff. 'Fearing that she was dead, John let out a scream of despair. Fleet ran up the basement stairs to the main floor. Appearing extremely distraught, he grabbed a phone, dialed two or three numbers, but then hung up. He turned to go back to the basement door, but then stopped and yelled for someone to call for an ambulance. All eyes were riveted on the basement stairwell door as John's scream was heard by everyone else still in the house.
John slowly climbed up the stairs carrying JonBenet with his arms around her waist. Her motionless arms reached above her head and her lips were blue. Responding to Arndt's instructions to lay her down, John placed his daughter on a rug inside the doorway at the top of the stairs. Arndt immediately reached out to the child to feel for a pulse in her neck. The skin as cold to the touch and an odor of decay had already started to set in. JonBenet appeared to have been dead for some time. Rigor mortis had begun and the lower part of her neck and right side of her face showed signs of liver mortis - a condition caused from the settling of block in the lower part of the body after the heart stops pumping blood. A bright red mark, about the size of a quarter, was visible on the front of her neck. A white cord was attached to her right wrist. John asked Det. Arnt if JonBenet was alive, and when she replied negatively, John moaned.
Arndt instructed John to go back to the den with Patsy and call 911 and ask that the detectives return and a coroner respond. Arndt then picked up JonBenet and carried her to the rug located inside the living room. After Arndt laid the lifeless body on the floor, a load guttural moan and wail was heard coming from the den apparently made by Patsy. John reentered the room where his daughter lay. He grabbed a lap robe that was laying on a nearby chair and asked Det. Arndt if it was all right to cover her. Not waiting for a response, he laid the blanket over JonBenets body. Arndt told John that he could say goodbye to his daughter, but not to touch her hands, move her body or lower the blanket that Arndt had readjusted to cover JonBenets clothing.
John first knelt down next to his child and stroked her hair, softly calling out, "my little angel." Then he laid next to her body with his arm around her. Crying sounds appeared coming from him, but no tears were visible. John rolled away and came back up to a kneeling position, looking briefly towards the hallway. John turned to Arndt and said, It has to be an inside job. It has to be somebody that knows the family. Nobody knows about the wine cellar in the basement.
Patsy was coming towards the body Of JonBenet, walking with the Assistance of Rev. Hoverstock, and her friends, the Whites and the Fernies. When she entered the hallway where JonBenet lay, she rushed to her and laid down on top of her dead child.
Barbara picked up a gray sweatshirt lying on a chair and placed
it over the childs exposed bare feet. Arndt told the family and
friends to gather in a circle around JonBenet while Rev.
Hoverstock lead them in a prayer. In spite of the numbing shock
and grief felt by everyone in the room, they joined Rev. Hoverstock in reciting "The Lord's Prayer" as Patsy lay on top of JonBenet crying and moaning. Suddenly, Patsy raised herself onto her knees, lifted her arms into the air and prayed, "Jesus you raised Lazarus from the dead, raise my baby from the dead'''
Arndt realized that there had been no response to the 911 call she had asked John to make. She grabbed a cell phone and called the 911 dispatch. She told the dispatcher that she needed a detective and the coroner at her location. Within a few minutes an ambulance was seen slowly driving past the Ramsey house, but did not stop. After another five minutes had gone by, she called dispatch a second time and requested a supervisor, again stating she needed a detective and a coroner at her location at 755 15th Street and that she was on scene at a homicide. Within five minutes of this second call, Officer Weiss appeared at the door, and soon he was joined by other officers and detectives returning, along with the ambulance and paramedics. The paramedics, aware that it was too late JonBenet, focused their attention on Patsy, who appeared to be swooning. Although obviously distraught, Patsy did not need any medical treatment and the paramedics left the house.
Arndt later learned that the delay to her 911 call occurred because the call that been received by Weld County, not Boulder County, and Weld County dispatch had been confused by the address given in the request for assistance.
Now that the mystery of the whereabouts of JonBenet had been solved by the horror of the discovery of her body, it was no longer necessary for anyone to await contact by kidnappers. Arrangements were being made for John and Patsy to go to the home of the Fernies. The Ramseys then left their Boulder home, vowing never to return.
Britt
New Member
From Spade re the spider web:
Here is the information from "The Bonita Papers" [Bonita is the 1st name of the legal secretary who wrote up the Boulder Police reports] about the spider web. It is the final nail in Looney Lou's intruder theory:
John Ramsey had presented his own theory on the murder of his daughter to all who would listen. He pointed to the location of a blue suitcase under the basement window and told of finding the window open when he searched the basement on the morning of the alleged kidnapping. He theorized that the murderer had made his entrance and escape through the window. However, as noted by detectives arriving early on the morning of December 26, an intact spider web covered the grate which blocked off the window. In order to enter or exit the window, the grate would have had to have been removed.
This grate was photographed and collected for evidence. Interior dusting of the window for fingerprints was done by crime scene investigators and no latent prints were found. In May, the photos were submitted to Brent Opell, Professor of Biology at the Virginia Polytechnic Institute and State University in Blacksbury, Virginia. Prof. Opell reported that the web was that of the Agelenidae, known as a funnel-web spider. The web was reasonably intact and extending through the grating, suggesting that the
grating had not been disturbed since the spider constructed its web.
According to Prof. Opell, these types of spiders would cease constructing webs no later than early November, thus indicating that no one had entered that window well past this early November deadline. The theory that anyone could have entered the Ramsey residence through this broken window was totally discounted by this simple evidence of nature.
Here is the information from "The Bonita Papers" [Bonita is the 1st name of the legal secretary who wrote up the Boulder Police reports] about the spider web. It is the final nail in Looney Lou's intruder theory:
John Ramsey had presented his own theory on the murder of his daughter to all who would listen. He pointed to the location of a blue suitcase under the basement window and told of finding the window open when he searched the basement on the morning of the alleged kidnapping. He theorized that the murderer had made his entrance and escape through the window. However, as noted by detectives arriving early on the morning of December 26, an intact spider web covered the grate which blocked off the window. In order to enter or exit the window, the grate would have had to have been removed.
This grate was photographed and collected for evidence. Interior dusting of the window for fingerprints was done by crime scene investigators and no latent prints were found. In May, the photos were submitted to Brent Opell, Professor of Biology at the Virginia Polytechnic Institute and State University in Blacksbury, Virginia. Prof. Opell reported that the web was that of the Agelenidae, known as a funnel-web spider. The web was reasonably intact and extending through the grating, suggesting that the
grating had not been disturbed since the spider constructed its web.
According to Prof. Opell, these types of spiders would cease constructing webs no later than early November, thus indicating that no one had entered that window well past this early November deadline. The theory that anyone could have entered the Ramsey residence through this broken window was totally discounted by this simple evidence of nature.
Britt
New Member
From Spade:
PINEAPPLE
Coroner Meyer had noted in his autopsy examination that the food found in JonBenet's intestine would have been consumed approximately two hours prior death. However, both John and Patsy stated that no one had eaten anything at the house when they returned from the Whites dinner party, and that JonBenet was asleep when they arrived home and remained asleep.
In February, 1998, detectives from the Boulder police department asked their assistance in conducting an analysis of the contents from the intestine obtained during the autopsy. At the initial examination, Coroner Meyer had suspected that the retrieved substance was pineapple fragments. The bowl of pineapple detectives found on the dining room table at the Ramsey residence the morning of December 26 had been taken into evidence that morning and frozen for future comparison studies. After examining the two samples, the biology professors confirmed that the intestinal substance were pineapple, ant that both this specimen and the pineapple found in the bowl contained portions of the outer rind of the fruit.
The study also identified both samples as being fresh pineapple not canned. The conclusion of the two professors was that there were no distinctive differences between that found in the bowl and that removed from the intestines.
Prior fingerprint testing on the bowl that contained the pineapple had picked up prints from both Patsy and Burke.
PINEAPPLE
Coroner Meyer had noted in his autopsy examination that the food found in JonBenet's intestine would have been consumed approximately two hours prior death. However, both John and Patsy stated that no one had eaten anything at the house when they returned from the Whites dinner party, and that JonBenet was asleep when they arrived home and remained asleep.
In February, 1998, detectives from the Boulder police department asked their assistance in conducting an analysis of the contents from the intestine obtained during the autopsy. At the initial examination, Coroner Meyer had suspected that the retrieved substance was pineapple fragments. The bowl of pineapple detectives found on the dining room table at the Ramsey residence the morning of December 26 had been taken into evidence that morning and frozen for future comparison studies. After examining the two samples, the biology professors confirmed that the intestinal substance were pineapple, ant that both this specimen and the pineapple found in the bowl contained portions of the outer rind of the fruit.
The study also identified both samples as being fresh pineapple not canned. The conclusion of the two professors was that there were no distinctive differences between that found in the bowl and that removed from the intestines.
Prior fingerprint testing on the bowl that contained the pineapple had picked up prints from both Patsy and Burke.
Britt
New Member
From Spade re the Ramseys' clothing:
Keep in mind that Bonita wrote-up her info in 1999. The 2000 Atlanta interviews verify much of what she says about clothing, but are more up-to-date.
One of the problems in the investigation was delayed gathering of evidence. It was not until almost a year after the murder that the Boulder police through D.A. Hofstrom finally asked for the clothing worn by Ramsey family members to Whites dinner party on the night of December 25. Fleet had taken photos during the holiday gathering which were turned over to the police department, and police request the clothing that was depicted in these photos. Another month would go by before the Ramseys, through their legal counsel and private investigators, would comply with this request.
At that time, two black shirts from John and black pants and a red and black checked sweater from Patsy were provided. Two months later additional clothing, a red short sleeved shirt and a red turtleneck shirt, were also turned over by Patsy through the private investigator. The police department was informed that since John owned several pairs of khaki pants matching those in the photograph, John had not been able to determine which pair were worn on December 25. Not only had all of this clothing probably been reworn and been through many cleaning or laundering processes, the move from the Ramsey home had been done by a professional moving company. once again, contamination of evidence obtained from these articles of clothing could very likely present problems in any prosecution.
Considering the delayed cooperation from the Ramseys in turning over the clothing, it was significant what items of clothing requested by the police department were not turned over. Patsy had told the officers that she had worn black short boots, to the Whites dinner party. The boots had never beaver been given to police officials in spite of repeated requests. At a subsequent session with the police department to give handwriting samples, Patsy had been wearing short black fur boots, and the detectives wondered if these were the boots that the Ramseys were saying they could not locate. The detectives were anxious to locate the fur boots to test for beaver hair.
Keep in mind that Bonita wrote-up her info in 1999. The 2000 Atlanta interviews verify much of what she says about clothing, but are more up-to-date.
One of the problems in the investigation was delayed gathering of evidence. It was not until almost a year after the murder that the Boulder police through D.A. Hofstrom finally asked for the clothing worn by Ramsey family members to Whites dinner party on the night of December 25. Fleet had taken photos during the holiday gathering which were turned over to the police department, and police request the clothing that was depicted in these photos. Another month would go by before the Ramseys, through their legal counsel and private investigators, would comply with this request.
At that time, two black shirts from John and black pants and a red and black checked sweater from Patsy were provided. Two months later additional clothing, a red short sleeved shirt and a red turtleneck shirt, were also turned over by Patsy through the private investigator. The police department was informed that since John owned several pairs of khaki pants matching those in the photograph, John had not been able to determine which pair were worn on December 25. Not only had all of this clothing probably been reworn and been through many cleaning or laundering processes, the move from the Ramsey home had been done by a professional moving company. once again, contamination of evidence obtained from these articles of clothing could very likely present problems in any prosecution.
Considering the delayed cooperation from the Ramseys in turning over the clothing, it was significant what items of clothing requested by the police department were not turned over. Patsy had told the officers that she had worn black short boots, to the Whites dinner party. The boots had never beaver been given to police officials in spite of repeated requests. At a subsequent session with the police department to give handwriting samples, Patsy had been wearing short black fur boots, and the detectives wondered if these were the boots that the Ramseys were saying they could not locate. The detectives were anxious to locate the fur boots to test for beaver hair.
candy
Inactive
Keep in mind what this is. This is STOLEN information Bonita obtained from her Dream Team lawyer employers who obtained direct BPD reports. Bonita apparently was planning to write a book with police reports UNAUTHORIZED, WITH REAL ISSUES OF PRIVILEGE AND CONFIDENTIALITY HERE, but then sold her stuff to, you guessed it, the tabs, where tab source Spade heard about it, and is posting things from the police files for the Ramseys to read about, evidence against them directly from these files in a case that has not been to court yet..
Ivy
Inactive
So what? The DA promised Lin Wood she would communicate with him throughout the investigation. Don't you think Wood and the Ramseys probably already have access to all the information they want on the case, including the police files?
candy
Inactive
Absolutely not. This is the people's evidence, PAID FOR BY THE PEOPLE, IN THE MILLIONS OF DOLLARS against the Ramseys.
This is the case you would see against them in court.
This is why they are the prime suspects. There is NO WAY Keenan or any DA gave this to the Ramseys, or any suspect this type of evidence.
This is the case you would see against them in court.
This is why they are the prime suspects. There is NO WAY Keenan or any DA gave this to the Ramseys, or any suspect this type of evidence.
Ivy
Inactive
Keenan, a.k.a. The People, doesn't believe for a second the Rs were involved in JonBenet's death. Keenan told Wood she was conducting the investigation because a vicious child murderer was still out there. What does that tell you?
Keenan corresponds with Wood about the investigation. How do you know she doesn't share privileged information with him, including the police files? She wouldn't be the first person of authority he's intimidated. Wood threatened to sue Boulder if the DA didn't reinvestigate the case, so what makes you so sure Wood isn't pulling the strings and making his puppets dance?
Keenan corresponds with Wood about the investigation. How do you know she doesn't share privileged information with him, including the police files? She wouldn't be the first person of authority he's intimidated. Wood threatened to sue Boulder if the DA didn't reinvestigate the case, so what makes you so sure Wood isn't pulling the strings and making his puppets dance?
tipper
Former Member
Delayed cooperation from the Ramseys?
"9 MR. WOOD: I think the request
10 for the clothing was made in December of
11 '97, a year after the murder.
12 THE WITNESS: Oh, yes, December
13 of '97, yeah, yeah.
14 MR. WOOD: And you turned it over
15 in January of '98.
16 MR. LEVIN: I believe that is
17 correct, sir."
candy
Inactive
This is an excerpt from an interview on Hardball with Alex Hunter on 4/26/00 about ST's book using case file evidence, nothing like the wholesale looting that Bonita did either:
MATTHEWS: Let's talk about a thing that's bothering you, and I--it would bother me probably, too. One of your detectives out there, Steve Thomas, who was working on the case, has written a book where says this about the investigation and why he says it hasn't been solved. Quote, "When the police botched the crime scene, they damaged the Ramsey case. When the district attorney's office started making deals, they lost it. It was institutional idiocy. And, in my opinion, there are several people in Boulder who are going to have to beg their way into heaven after this one."
We can skip the heaven and hell part there, but let's go back to the--the world we live on. What do you think of that guy's book?
Mr. HUNTER: Well, I think it stinks, and I guess he'll have a bag of gold to buy his way into heaven. You know, he's put a butcher knife into this investigation. You're a former police officer. And...
MATTHEWS: Well, briefly, at least.
Mr. HUNTER: Well, briefly. But you...
MATTHEWS: Yeah.
Mr. HUNTER: ...you know, you gained some insights like we all do...
MATTHEWS: Right.
Mr. HUNTER: ...little--little pieces here and there. I mean, he--he ha--he is peddling the case file.
MATTHEWS: Right.
Mr. HUNTER: The citizens of Boulder have spent $ 2 million plus on this case. It's not his case.
MATTHEWS: If he had written an adulatory book saying you're the best thing since sliced bread, would you have a problem with this book?
Mr. HUNTER: No, because he wouldn't be divulging confidential information. What--you--you know, when you start talking about what a witness said, what a wit--you know, there's one place in the book--and I don't even want to get into it in detail--where a witness--critical witness in the case begs him not to make a disclosure of some very personal information. He--he lays it out in the book. He criticizes his colleagues; he talks about the fact they, you know, botched the early hours, which I think y--you know, I can make another argument. You know, you don't change evidence. There may be a technical contamination when the body's brought upstairs. But you know, I get--first of all, you pick up in this book his investigative techniques, because the way he writes the book reflects that technique. This is a homicide detective who's never had a homicide case, and his supervisor had never had a homicide case.
MATTHEWS: Right.
Mr. HUNTER: Fortunately, believe it or not, there are some excellent officers--he was not the lead detective--that have worked this case, have busted their gut, have, you know, put in the sweat, have dropped the tears who he, you know, puts the knife to in the book.
MATTHEWS: Yeah.
Mr. HUNTER: And you can see this man sitting down with this guy, Davis, who's the writer, and I can hear Davis saying to him, 'You know, you have to add color here; you have to add color there.' And what...
MATTHEWS: And this has hurt your--and this--this is getting--I know it hurts your feelings and it hurts your image.
Mr. HUNTER: Well...
MATTHEWS: Certainly it would--I would fight it, too.
Mr. HUNTER: Yeah, but...
MATTHEWS: But has it--how has it hurt the investigation?
Mr. HUNTER: Yeah, but let me say something. You know, I'm on this show, not because my butt feels raw or my feelings are hurt. I'm on this show because this detective is getting, you know, kissed by ABC.
MATTHEWS: Yeah.
Mr. HUNTER: He goes on four mornings. They have a little chat with him. And the...
MATTHEWS: On "GMA," right.
Mr. HUNTER: A--and the--the fact is that what has happened here, I mean, it's done. The book is done. He'll make $ 1 million, and I--I h--I'm hoping that the orphans and widows of slain police officers at the Boulder Police Department are not going to be out on the front stoop with a cup waiting for his contribution.
But I'm here because I want us to learn a l--another lesson from this case. There's some wonderful lessons, some hard lessons in this case. And one of them is we cannot have a detective breach the public trust that I think he or she has when they are compiling confidential information, interviewing witnesses, you know, building the file...
MATTHEWS: Right.
Mr. HUNTER: ...on behalf of the people. That's why I'm here. I'm not here to say he's a bad guy because he doesn't like me. That--that--you know, this guy is not relevant to this case. He's been gone for 18 months. He had nothing to do with the grand jury investigation. He's a cop that, you know, was basically a patrol officer and did a little narcotics work.
MATTHEWS: Yeah, but, you know, he exploited a ready market out there.
Mr. HUNTER: He exploited...
MATTHEWS: The reason he will make any money he makes is there are a lot of people in this country--I won't buy the book because I wouldn't know if it was true or not. And you make it sound like it probably isn't. But let me tell you, there's a lot of people who are watching this case for four years, they see this wealthy couple that seems to be treated with kid gloves and they wonder how long can the case go on. You, on the other side, have been in the DA's job for all these years, and you probably know that some cases aren't going to be solved, that the law isn't perfect. What should we know from your point of view, without giving away the case, that we should know about this case, that--that makes us wrong when we say, 'Where the hell's this thing going?'
Mr. HUNTER: You know, i--it really is interesting. In the early days of this case, 30 days out, 60, 90 days out, the public and the media were crying about how come this case isn't solved.
MATTHEWS: Yeah.
Mr. HUNTER: And, you know, we would all shake our heads. And you know as a former police officer and commentator that cases don't get solved in an hour like they do, you know, on some of the shows people watch. And--and I don't mean to talk down, because I like those shows...
MATTHEWS: Sure.
Mr. HUNTER: ...and I'm always amazed how they can get--pack it in in an hour.
MATTHEWS: Let's talk about a thing that's bothering you, and I--it would bother me probably, too. One of your detectives out there, Steve Thomas, who was working on the case, has written a book where says this about the investigation and why he says it hasn't been solved. Quote, "When the police botched the crime scene, they damaged the Ramsey case. When the district attorney's office started making deals, they lost it. It was institutional idiocy. And, in my opinion, there are several people in Boulder who are going to have to beg their way into heaven after this one."
We can skip the heaven and hell part there, but let's go back to the--the world we live on. What do you think of that guy's book?
Mr. HUNTER: Well, I think it stinks, and I guess he'll have a bag of gold to buy his way into heaven. You know, he's put a butcher knife into this investigation. You're a former police officer. And...
MATTHEWS: Well, briefly, at least.
Mr. HUNTER: Well, briefly. But you...
MATTHEWS: Yeah.
Mr. HUNTER: ...you know, you gained some insights like we all do...
MATTHEWS: Right.
Mr. HUNTER: ...little--little pieces here and there. I mean, he--he ha--he is peddling the case file.
MATTHEWS: Right.
Mr. HUNTER: The citizens of Boulder have spent $ 2 million plus on this case. It's not his case.
MATTHEWS: If he had written an adulatory book saying you're the best thing since sliced bread, would you have a problem with this book?
Mr. HUNTER: No, because he wouldn't be divulging confidential information. What--you--you know, when you start talking about what a witness said, what a wit--you know, there's one place in the book--and I don't even want to get into it in detail--where a witness--critical witness in the case begs him not to make a disclosure of some very personal information. He--he lays it out in the book. He criticizes his colleagues; he talks about the fact they, you know, botched the early hours, which I think y--you know, I can make another argument. You know, you don't change evidence. There may be a technical contamination when the body's brought upstairs. But you know, I get--first of all, you pick up in this book his investigative techniques, because the way he writes the book reflects that technique. This is a homicide detective who's never had a homicide case, and his supervisor had never had a homicide case.
MATTHEWS: Right.
Mr. HUNTER: Fortunately, believe it or not, there are some excellent officers--he was not the lead detective--that have worked this case, have busted their gut, have, you know, put in the sweat, have dropped the tears who he, you know, puts the knife to in the book.
MATTHEWS: Yeah.
Mr. HUNTER: And you can see this man sitting down with this guy, Davis, who's the writer, and I can hear Davis saying to him, 'You know, you have to add color here; you have to add color there.' And what...
MATTHEWS: And this has hurt your--and this--this is getting--I know it hurts your feelings and it hurts your image.
Mr. HUNTER: Well...
MATTHEWS: Certainly it would--I would fight it, too.
Mr. HUNTER: Yeah, but...
MATTHEWS: But has it--how has it hurt the investigation?
Mr. HUNTER: Yeah, but let me say something. You know, I'm on this show, not because my butt feels raw or my feelings are hurt. I'm on this show because this detective is getting, you know, kissed by ABC.
MATTHEWS: Yeah.
Mr. HUNTER: He goes on four mornings. They have a little chat with him. And the...
MATTHEWS: On "GMA," right.
Mr. HUNTER: A--and the--the fact is that what has happened here, I mean, it's done. The book is done. He'll make $ 1 million, and I--I h--I'm hoping that the orphans and widows of slain police officers at the Boulder Police Department are not going to be out on the front stoop with a cup waiting for his contribution.
But I'm here because I want us to learn a l--another lesson from this case. There's some wonderful lessons, some hard lessons in this case. And one of them is we cannot have a detective breach the public trust that I think he or she has when they are compiling confidential information, interviewing witnesses, you know, building the file...
MATTHEWS: Right.
Mr. HUNTER: ...on behalf of the people. That's why I'm here. I'm not here to say he's a bad guy because he doesn't like me. That--that--you know, this guy is not relevant to this case. He's been gone for 18 months. He had nothing to do with the grand jury investigation. He's a cop that, you know, was basically a patrol officer and did a little narcotics work.
MATTHEWS: Yeah, but, you know, he exploited a ready market out there.
Mr. HUNTER: He exploited...
MATTHEWS: The reason he will make any money he makes is there are a lot of people in this country--I won't buy the book because I wouldn't know if it was true or not. And you make it sound like it probably isn't. But let me tell you, there's a lot of people who are watching this case for four years, they see this wealthy couple that seems to be treated with kid gloves and they wonder how long can the case go on. You, on the other side, have been in the DA's job for all these years, and you probably know that some cases aren't going to be solved, that the law isn't perfect. What should we know from your point of view, without giving away the case, that we should know about this case, that--that makes us wrong when we say, 'Where the hell's this thing going?'
Mr. HUNTER: You know, i--it really is interesting. In the early days of this case, 30 days out, 60, 90 days out, the public and the media were crying about how come this case isn't solved.
MATTHEWS: Yeah.
Mr. HUNTER: And, you know, we would all shake our heads. And you know as a former police officer and commentator that cases don't get solved in an hour like they do, you know, on some of the shows people watch. And--and I don't mean to talk down, because I like those shows...
MATTHEWS: Sure.
Mr. HUNTER: ...and I'm always amazed how they can get--pack it in in an hour.
Blazeboy3
Inactive
http://www.eonline.com/Interact/Backtalk/Posts/1,14,644959-23,00.html
The enhanced version contains John's and Burke's voices as well as Patsy mumbling over and over, "Help me, Jesus." After hearing the tape, Lin Wood contacted DA Mary Keenan and threatened to sue the BPD and the City of Boulder if Keenan did not pull the case from the BPD. Keenan met with 3 area attorneys who strongly advised her to ignore Wood's threats. Keenan did not, and pulled the case from the BPD.
Here is another new-to-me URL FYI:
http://www.angelfire.com/celeb2/ramseyurbanlegends/
HOW IMHO SO SAD THAT JONBENET"S MOTHER PATSY COULD GET AWAY W/MURDERING HER ONLY girlchild JonBenet...is beyond me...
IMHO...SO SAD TO THIS DAY!!! IMHO
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If the Boulder D.A., The BPD, The F.B.I., the C.I.A., CHiPS, the US Marines, the Navy, Diana Ross and the Supremes, OR ANYONE, had a problem with what is being posted at FFJ.....Don't you think I would have been contacted? Don't you think Spade would have been contacted?
The way Candy talks Spade and I are about to be captured by the SWAT team and hogtied...come to think of it.....some of the local SWAT guys around here are pretty cute....BRING IT ON...
The way Candy talks Spade and I are about to be captured by the SWAT team and hogtied...come to think of it.....some of the local SWAT guys around here are pretty cute....BRING IT ON...
Cherokee
Well-Known Member
LOL, Diana Ross and the Supremes ... ah Tricia, I love your sense of humor.
Yeah, I hear Diana is PLENTY mad at you, girlfriend ... "there ain't no mountain high enough, to keep her from gettin' to you, babe!"
My opinion.
sissi
Former Member
Even Whecht,who
believes Jonbenet was abused at least three days before her death ,has unequivocally stated there is only chronic inflammation to suggest this,there are NO healed or healing areas present to suggest prior abuse.
I do not believe this garbage concerning healing areas on the hymen.
JMO IMO
JMO IMO
believes Jonbenet was abused at least three days before her death ,has unequivocally stated there is only chronic inflammation to suggest this,there are NO healed or healing areas present to suggest prior abuse.
I do not believe this garbage concerning healing areas on the hymen.
JMO IMO
JMO IMO
Imon128
Former Member
I believe "chronic" means ongoing previous abuse, not just 2 or 3 days prior, but I might be wrong. 'Only' would be a tragic word, IMO, to describe chronic sexual contact with a 6 year old.
M
Maxi
Guest
Wecht never saw all the photos nor did he have any info other than the autopsy report. ST says that the panel of experts saw a slide show, including pictures of JBR's genital injuries.
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