The Eikelenbooms and Touch DNA

[strawberry]

They are hoping and will probably find unsourced DNA so they can say - see there is an intruder of some sort here and that leaves you (the jury) with reasonable doubt. Baez probably thought of this gem since he has absolutely nothing else and his client is going to be convicted. MY opinion

It will be interesting to see exactly whose DNA they compare it to. They never got a DNA sample from Kronk did they? Unless Mort followed him around and picked up cigarette buts or soda cans..

They want some dna so they can yell contamination or mystery SODDI.

 

[strawberry]

I posted this yesterday on another thread:

Websleuths Crime Sleuthing Community - View Single Post - JB Wants ICA Present at Depositions of Jail Inmates and Personnel

But why would they need touch dna from skin cell testing? Sexual molestation would have good old fashioned semen DNA.:waitasec:

 

[strawberry]

"Though world-renowned in their fields, the couple have registered as grad students at the University of Denver, where he'll research touch DNA and she'll study ways to determine the time of death. Having the letters "P," "H" and "D" after their names, they say, should help disarm their naysayers."

Read more: Greene: In death, pair found a calling - The Denver Post http://www.denverpost.com/news/ci_12102408#ixzz10qHexIh5

Then why are they referred to as "Dr." in articles on the defense witness list? Did the media get it wrong or did the defense list them that way?

http://www.myfoxorlando.com/dpp/news/web_links/071310-Anthony-defense-brings-in-the-all-stars

ETA: The article does say she trained as an MD (and a flight attendant) but I don't know how he is a Dr.

 

[chefmom]

"Though world-renowned in their fields, the couple have registered as grad students at the University of Denver, where he'll research touch DNA and she'll study ways to determine the time of death. Having the letters "P," "H" and "D" after their names, they say, should help disarm their naysayers."

Read more: Greene: In death, pair found a calling - The Denver Post http://www.denverpost.com/news/ci_12102408#ixzz10qHexIh5

Lol! I was referencing their knowing where CO was in response to her snapping at people who don't share her socialist views.

 

[Paintr]

Hi Prudence. According to this article it is not true (unless one of them was working for Bode at the time):

"Then, late last year, prosecutors turned over long underwear JonBenet was wearing to the Bode Technology Group near Washington, which looked for "touch DNA," contained in skin cells left behind where someone has touched something. The lab has used this technology for at least three years."

http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,379041,00.html

Oh! So there are labs in the USA that have experience in testing 'touch' DNA. Guess someone should inform Mr Baez that it is not necessary to ship the evidence out of the country. He can have it tested by an American labratory, even if they are associated with LE or the FBI. (roll eyes)

 

[ExpectingUnicorns]

Here's another interesting article. A cold case that the victim's mother wants the Eikelenbooms to do the testing but the health dept won't release the evidence to the Eikelenbooms because they don't have the certification required by state rules. "'At this time we are still awaiting their application,' department spokesperson Jeffery Hammond said. Another New York laboratory, Bode Technology Group, is certified to do the work, he said." (This was written Aug 13, 2009. BBM)

http://www.startribune.com/local/53083902.html

 

[Dear Prudence]

Hi Prudence. According to this article it is not true (unless one of them was working for Bode at the time):

"Then, late last year, prosecutors turned over long underwear JonBenet was wearing to the Bode Technology Group near Washington, which looked for "touch DNA," contained in skin cells left behind where someone has touched something. The lab has used this technology for at least three years."

http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,379041,00.html

Here's a similar article about it from 2008 that states the Bode Technology Group "has done thousands of touch DNA recoveries over at least three years." http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,379226,00.html

So I was thinking why can't Jose just use this company that's in Virginia and has great experience with touch DNA. Well, according to Bode's website they serve the law enforcement and identification markets. Jose probably thinks they'd take part in the giant LE conspiracy that's out to get his client.
http://www.bodetech.com/

 

[Dear Prudence]

But why would they need touch dna from skin cell testing? Sexual molestation would have good old fashioned semen DNA.:waitasec:

I don't believe this really happened, but they could possibly say the semen washed away during the 6 months in the elements, but the skin cells stayed on the waistband of the shorts where the perp pulled them down.

 

[bogeygal]

Here's another interesting article. A cold case that the victim's mother wants the Eikelenbooms to do the testing but the health dept won't release the evidence to the Eikelenbooms because they don't have the certification required by state rules. "'At this time we are still awaiting their application,' department spokesperson Jeffery Hammond said. Another New York laboratory, Bode Technology Group, is certified to do the work, he said." (This was written Aug 13, 2009. BBM)

http://www.startribune.com/local/53083902.html

Wow, between JB's slow motion defense, and the Eikelenbooms certification problems...I won't be worried about further DNA testing. Thanks!

 

[RubyB]

I'm not JVM, but here's my issue...

The FBI lab says that there was no DNA found on the laundry bag. None, Nada, Zilch. Caylee's body decomposed on that bag and her DNA didn't survive the elements! I feel secure in stating MHO that no touch DNA could possibly be found on that bag, or the shorts for that matter. What a waste. HUGE WASTE!

 

[LambChop]

Is this their family run business or are they incorporated as a company and have a full functioning lab with staff? Their article gives the impression that they do this at their home???

 

[whiteangora]

I'm not JVM, but here's my issue...

The FBI lab says that there was no DNA found on the laundry bag. None, Nada, Zilch. Caylee's body decomposed on that bag and her DNA didn't survive the elements! I feel secure in stating MHO that no touch DNA could possibly be found on that bag, or the shorts for that matter. What a waste. HUGE WASTE!

So true. Yet another disguised stall tactic from the defense.
How long will it take to equip a lab, get it certified, get the E's the necessary licenses to do this testing? This sort of thing will not happen overnight and JB knows it.

 

[Dear Prudence]

I'm not JVM, but here's my issue...

The FBI lab says that there was no DNA found on the laundry bag. None, Nada, Zilch. Caylee's body decomposed on that bag and her DNA didn't survive the elements! I feel secure in stating MHO that no touch DNA could possibly be found on that bag, or the shorts for that matter. What a waste. HUGE WASTE!

I so get what you're saying, but there's a method of collecting DNA called Low Copy Number (LCN) where the amplification cycles are increased to produce a profile from the DNA. From what I understand this is not a standard method that the FBI would use. Valhall has written an excellent and informative article here: http://www.thehinkymeter.com/2010/09/27/caylee-anthony-case-contact-dna-testing/. Val thinks this is the method Richard Eikelenboom will use if he examines the evidence and says Jose even mentioned it in the hearing yesterday. (I'm going to watch again so I can hear it and will post when I find it)

Now, according to Bode Technology's website "Touch DNA" does not necessarily mean LCN is used. From their website http://www.bodetech.com/technologies/touch-dna/touch-dna-overview:
"Touch DNA is not Low Copy Number (LCN) DNA. LCN DNA profiling allows a very small amount of DNA to be analyzed, from as little as 5 to 20 cells. Because of the small amount of starting DNA in LCN samples, many more cycles of amplification are necessary.

Touch DNA samples at Bode are processed/amplified exactly the same way as blood, semen, saliva etc, and are therefore admissible in court."

So, if Eikelenboom uses LCN profiling and finds something, would it even be admitted in court? If not, we're back to it being a waste, a huge waste like you say. :waitasec:

 

[nums24]

But why would they need touch dna from skin cell testing? Sexual molestation would have good old fashioned semen DNA.:waitasec:

That's what I would like to know.

 

[Paintr]

I do not understand why there must be so much drama about every item the defense brings up. :banghead: If KC's law team honestly believe that there is a chance that 'touch' DNA testing could help their client, then send the items to an accredited lab and have them tested, for Pete's sake.

If they are searching for so called 'experts' that will follow the defense 'theory' regardless of test results, then they are just wasting the courts time and the taxpayers' money.

 

[21merc7]

Is this their family run business or are they incorporated as a company and have a full functioning lab with staff? Their article gives the impression that they do this at their home???

I have no idea how they have progressed, but when I watched the television show a few years ago, the lab was in their home, and did not look like a state lab at all. Been trying to find a video of it, but cannot remember what show it was.

 

[Intermezzo]

Then why are they referred to as "Dr." in articles on the defense witness list? Did the media get it wrong or did the defense list them that way?

http://www.myfoxorlando.com/dpp/news/web_links/071310-Anthony-defense-brings-in-the-all-stars

ETA: The article does say she trained as an MD (and a flight attendant) but I don't know how he is a Dr.

I do find their work very interesting,
I have not found where they refer to themselves as MD or Dr on their website, if you go to the Contact Us link there is not Dr designation
http://www.forensic-services.nl/

Only these recent news articles refer to them as Dr. Older news articles(the Masters case for 1) do not refer to them as Dr. but as Forensic Scientists.

 

[nums24]

Here are R. Hornsby's thoughts on Touch DNA:

[ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SMkDTl_Ndok&feature=player_embedded[/ame]

 

[Dear Prudence]

I do not understand why there must be so much drama about every item the defense brings up. :banghead: If KC's law team honestly believe that there is a chance that 'touch' DNA testing could help their client, then send the items to an accredited lab and have them tested, for Pete's sake.

If they are searching for so called 'experts' that will follow the defense 'theory' regardless of test results, then they are just wasting the courts time and the taxpayers' money.

bbm

I am not saying the Eikelenbooms would falsify their testing at all, but from reading all the articles linked here and from their website, they are very pro-defense. They state they only take high-profile murder cases where they feel a great injustice is being done. I think Jose wants them for that very reason.

 

[strawberry]

I don't believe this really happened, but they could possibly say the semen washed away during the 6 months in the elements, but the skin cells stayed on the waistband of the shorts where the perp pulled them down.

That's what I was thinking too, that it is a more sensitive test they are hoping might work.