The elusive "other" cell phone - the Blackjack - REVISITED

[Spangle]

I don't think we have proof that Rev. Grund said he didn't give Casey a Blackjack. I haven't seen anything and I searched all over the internet to try to find some comment on this. I think if he posted it on his MySpace there would have been a lot of comment on it by bloggers, but there seems to be nothing that I can find. If you find Rev. Grund's comment on this, please let me know.

How does one prove that someone didn't say something, ever? :waitasec:

The only way to prove it, is to find where he said he gave her one. You haven't found that yet.

If LP is your source, then you can't use it as fact, until it's been verified. Nothing against LP. But what he or anyone else says is just hearsay. Such things are only used to help track down info. It just lets us know it's a possibility. It's cool he said it. But it means nothing, really, until verified. What your looking for is that verification. What your looking for is where GRUND says he gave her one.

 

[tweety933]

How does Casey having a blackjack or not, have anything to do with the evidence in this case, either inculpatory or exculpatory?

I could see it being false exculpatory evidence if the Blackjack had it's own plan, but not if it was just used with the same sim card as her Nokia. (ie.....it would be exculpatory if the records of Imaginanny contacts were on the blackjack (with it's own plan & sim card), verses the nokia (with a seperate sim card and plan). But that was not the case, as Casey stated she used the same sim card in both. OK, maybe she saved contact info on imaginanny on the blackjack phone memory, that she NEVER utilized with the blackjack, or any other phone, but why would she save that info that she hadn't ever used?

I just don't see the relevance this discussion has, except to show how casey lies when the truth would better suit her.

 

[Brini]

How does one prove that someone didn't say something, ever? :waitasec:

The only way to prove it, is to find where he said he gave her one. You haven't found that yet.

If LP is your source, then you can't use it as fact, until it's been verified. Nothing against LP. But what he or anyone else says is just hearsay. Such things are only used to help track down info. It just lets us know it's a possibility. It's cool he said it. But it means nothing, really, until verified. What your looking for is that verification. What your looking for is where GRUND says he gave her one.

Plus, LP is a bit of a tale-spinner.

Like those rumors of Caylee's paternity that he started. That weren't true.

 

[Balthazar]

If KC did have a Blackjack from May to July of 2008 (and I'm completely open to that possibility), what could we conclude from that? KC said the Blackjack was under her same AT&T account, with the same phone number, and we have all the records for that phone number. If she had a phone on a DIFFERENT account, she would certainly have said so, because it would be much easier that way to say "oh, all these calls to and from Zani were on that other phone/account, but I forgot the number and the carrier...."

The are only two things of interest about the Blackjack, if Casey had one, would be whether or not there were different phone numbers on it than those numbers on Casey's SIM card and the phone she gave police, specifically a phone number for ZFG. Secondarily, if it could be proven that Casey did have a Blackjack, then we would also know she wasn't lying about having one.

 

[Woe.be.gone]

Throwing in my two cents - I thought that maybe KC had stollen JPC's phone (a Blackjack?) and had been using it - a possibility because he said that KC and TL were not allowed in the bedrooms if they came over which suggests that JPC suspected KC had stollen from him. Then, immediately upon returning from PR on July 15, JP went up to the mall to buy a new phone. We know this because AH went with him and CA picked her up from there to go find KC.

On New Years Day, I was with my brother. He put his phone on the table. I asked, "Is that a Blackjack?" A bit surprised by my technical observation he answered, "Yes". I impressed him further and asked, "Does it hold a charge?" He said, "No, not great. I have to remember to charge it every night." I proudly said, "I learned that at Websleuths."

 

[Balthazar]

Plus, LP is a bit of a tale-spinner.

Like those rumors of Caylee's paternity that he started. That weren't true.

My impression was that was to attempt to force the Anthony's to reveal Caylee's paternity by offering up a paternal source which would be so offensive to most people that they would immediately say who the real father was to defend themselves AND offer up their DNA for testing to prove it. It is also entirely possible that LP was specifically asked to make the allegation on national TV for these purposes. I believe he may well have been assisting the FBI, with whom he is known to have a good relationship, with their investigation in this case.

 

[Balthazar]

No,I believe KC was a very social person who encountered a lot of people out and about.Not a big stretch for me to believe she overheard someone complaining about their Blackjack not holding a charge.She seemed to use other peoples experiences as her own,at times.All of her lies had some truth.She wasn't capable of making everything up from scratch IMO.

It could be.

 

[Balthazar]

Blackjack's aren't prepaid.

Who else's c.p. did CA have, over the long term, and what evidence is there?

I can't even IMAGINE her being able to make more calls/texts than she has already racked up.

Princess, if you are trying to prove that there IS a Zanny by trying to prove there IS another c.p..... it's take a little more than that, I'm afraid.

OCSD and the FBI have already concluded that those folks don't exist, and they have tracking resources that we can't even imagine. Especially the feds.

Yes, you can get Blackjacks prepaid. Look on the internet, you will find them.

And no, I'm not trying to prove there was a ZFG. I merely believe Casey did have a Blackjack.

 

[AZlawyer]

Throwing in my two cents - I thought that maybe KC had stollen JPC's phone (a Blackjack?) and had been using it - a possibility because he said that KC and TL were not allowed in the bedrooms if they came over which suggests that JPC suspected KC had stollen from him. Then, immediately upon returning from PR on July 15, JP went up to the mall to buy a new phone. We know this because AH went with him and CA picked her up from there to go find KC.

On New Years Day, I was with my brother. He put his phone on the table. I asked, "Is that a Blackjack?" A bit surprised by my technical observation he answered, "Yes". I impressed him further and asked, "Does it hold a charge?" He said, "No, not great. I have to remember to charge it every night." I proudly said, "I learned that at Websleuths."

JP's comment came within a day or two after Amy reported her money was missing and after KC asked Amy "did you find JP's keys?"--so I think he was worried about KC being a money-and-keys thief, not a phone thief.

Also, JP's phone was used while he was in Puerto Rico and the bills show that they were "roaming" calls, so I don't think KC had his phone.

 

[Balthazar]

Throwing in my two cents - I thought that maybe KC had stollen JPC's phone (a Blackjack?) and had been using it - a possibility because he said that KC and TL were not allowed in the bedrooms if they came over which suggests that JPC suspected KC had stollen from him. Then, immediately upon returning from PR on July 15, JP went up to the mall to buy a new phone. We know this because AH went with him and CA picked her up from there to go find KC.

On New Years Day, I was with my brother. He put his phone on the table. I asked, "Is that a Blackjack?" A bit surprised by my technical observation he answered, "Yes". I impressed him further and asked, "Does it hold a charge?" He said, "No, not great. I have to remember to charge it every night." I proudly said, "I learned that at Websleuths."

Wow, every night?! That is the worst cellphone charging problem I've ever heard of! Anyone else heard of having to charge a phone nightly? I've personally had 15 cellphones and not one of them needed to be charged more often than once a week - even back in the 1990's!

 

[AZlawyer]

Not if the phone was on someone elses cellphone account or a prepaid.

But again, if the phone was on a different account and would really show phone calls to and from ZFG, KC would have said this! Instead she said it was on the SAME account as her other phone--which means any calls to and from ZFG would show up on her regular bill. I know she's a liar, but I don't think she takes facts that are helpful to her and lies about them to harm her own interests.

If the other phone just shows a number for ZFG but is on the same account (and therefore we know no calls were made to or from that number), that wouldn't be much help to the defense. That would just show that KC had a purported phone number for ZFG but never called it--totally inconsistent with the ZFG as close friend/nanny/kidnapper theory. Plus then some Websleuther would call it and Papa John's Pizza would answer and KC would just be even more screwed.

 

[MissJames]

KC may have had a BJ.I just haven't seen any evidence of one.IIRC it was noted that KC used her known phone to call and text so much there was a question about how much sleep she was getting.
At this point I see so many of KC's lies being so similar to saying "I have a BJ" that it's logical for me assume it was just another lie.Like I'm an event planner.I have a nanny.I pay her more than most nannys make.I'm getting my parents house.I'm getting a promotion and then I'll be able to set my own hours.
Always a notch better than the average 21 year old.
I think she was lying about the blackjack ,but that's just me.

 

[MissJames]

Wow, every night?! That is the worst cellphone charging problem I've ever heard of! Anyone else heard of having to charge a phone nightly? I've personally had 15 cellphones and not one of them needed to be charged more often than once a week - even back in the 1990's!

My daughter has to charge her phone every day.She usually does it on the car charger.Mine is about every third day.Never had one that could make it a week.

 

[Woe.be.gone]

JP's comment came within a day or two after Amy reported her money was missing and after KC asked Amy "did you find JP's keys?"--so I think he was worried about KC being a money-and-keys thief, not a phone thief.

Also, JP's phone was used while he was in Puerto Rico and the bills show that they were "roaming" calls, so I don't think KC had his phone.

Really? JP's phone was used while he was in PR? How do you know that? I hadn't heard that (but very well may have missed it). I didn't think we knew anything about JPC other than he owned the unit that RM and him lived in (later AH) and that he went to PR where his family lived and was kind enough to take his friends along. I did notice someone with the name Baez is associated with his family company. But that's another topic.

 

[Brini]

Wow, every night?! That is the worst cellphone charging problem I've ever heard of! Anyone else heard of having to charge a phone nightly? I've personally had 15 cellphones and not one of them needed to be charged more often than once a week - even back in the 1990's!

Every three days.

 

[Woe.be.gone]

Wow, every night?! That is the worst cellphone charging problem I've ever heard of! Anyone else heard of having to charge a phone nightly? I've personally had 15 cellphones and not one of them needed to be charged more often than once a week - even back in the 1990's!

That's what he said. He uses it a lot!

 

[AZlawyer]

Really? JP's phone was used while he was in PR? How do you know that? I hadn't heard that (but very well may have missed it). I didn't think we knew anything about JPC other than he owned the unit that RM and him lived in (later AH) and that he went to PR where his family lived and was kind enough to take his friends along. I did notice someone with the name Baez is associated with his family company. But that's another topic.

His phone records were released. I believe they are available on docstoc.

 

[Woe.be.gone]

His phone records were released. I believe they are available on docstoc.

Did we ever discuss them here that you know of? If not, I wonder why.

 

[AZlawyer]

Did we ever discuss them here that you know of? If not, I wonder why.

No, other than that I mentioned on the June 25 date-specific thread that Cindy called JP's number that day. Cindy said in her FBI interview that Lee had found out a number KC gave her for her co-worker "Juliet L." 's mother was really JP's number. At the time Cindy made the call, she believed KC was staying at the hospital with "Zani" and Caylee was staying at a hotel with "Juliet" and her daughter "Annabelle," so it makes sense that Cindy would call this number to find Caylee. My question is, when Cindy (presumably) got JP's voicemail message, which (presumably) didn't say "Hi, you've reached the L***ses," why didn't she see this as a red flag? And why did she mention to the FBI that Lee figured out that the number was wrong but never mention that she ALREADY KNEW the number was wrong because she had called it?

Anyway....OT...probably you should go to the June 25 thread if you want to talk about it.

 

[tweety933]

Wow, every night?! That is the worst cellphone charging problem I've ever heard of! Anyone else heard of having to charge a phone nightly? I've personally had 15 cellphones and not one of them needed to be charged more often than once a week - even back in the 1990's!

I'm sure your battery use was based on "stand-by", not "talk/text time"....most phones that I'm familiar with really eat up the juice when talking or texting obsessively, and we know how much Casey did THAT. LOL

I think the problem with the Blackjack (real or imagined) was probably related to that, but I'm just guessing based on my own experience.