The Ramseys are Cleared

[Silmarion]

I never believed the family had anything to do with Jon Benet's murder. Never did. There was no history of any sort of crime in that family. But there are always going to be people who believed the parents were guilty, and I think even if the real killer is ever caught, they'll still try to think of a way the parents did it.

The note. Yeah. The perp got in while the Ramseys were at a party. He waited until they came home and went to sleep, and while he was waiting, he took a note page from the kitchen pad and wrote the note. Crazy people do crazy things. He never had any intention of kidnapping her. He only wrote that to throw the police off. It was so obvious from the beginning.

After he killed her, he left the house. The police were totally inadequate, and never handled a murder case before, and did everything wrong. But hey, killers get away with murder all the time. Sometimes one after another for years. Some eventually get caught, and some don't. Apparently this guy hasn't got caught. Yet. But maybe one day he will make a mistake, and they'll get him. I hope so. I am so sorry that Patsy died. I felt so bad for her, and everything she went through.

 

[T-Rex]

News is reporting the results from the lab prove it is the same DNA in all 3 samples.

They're reporting that Mary Lacy says that. But, going by the John Mark Karr thing, her threshold for proof is pretty low.

 

[RiverRat]

Hi evelyn

How does leaving your daughters body in the basement throw off the cops?

It doesn't....it just buys time.

 

[Toltec]

Interesting thread...great posts.

One CSI episode had a scene in which technicians lifted skin cells from a rope used in a murder. If these experts in the JBR case could lift cells from the long underwear, than I hope they tried the technique on the cord used to strangle her. If the dna matches, than I can be convinced a Ramsey was not involved.

Was it certain that the dna was lifted from her long underwear and not the tights JonBenet wore with her Gap outfit?

John claims he carried JonBenet to bed, took her shoes and coat off...then left Patsy to do the rest. Patsy claims she slipped the velvet pants, tights, and velvet vest....left her white shirt on....looked for pajamas, instead using long underwear on JonBenet.

If an intruder was in the home, than his dna would be on the long underwear and panties....not the tights.

 

[RiverRat]

I never believed the family had anything to do with Jon Benet's murder. Never did. There was no history of any sort of crime in that family. But there are always going to be people who believed the parents were guilty, and I think even if the real killer is ever caught, they'll still try to think of a way the parents did it.

The note. Yeah. The perp got in while the Ramseys were at a party. He waited until they came home and went to sleep, and while he was waiting, he took a note page from the kitchen pad and wrote the note. Crazy people do crazy things. He never had any intention of kidnapping her. He only wrote that to throw the police off. It was so obvious from the beginning.

After he killed her, he left the house. The police were totally inadequate, and never handled a murder case before, and did everything wrong. But hey, killers get away with murder all the time. Sometimes one after another for years. Some eventually get caught, and some don't. Apparently this guy hasn't got caught. Yet. But maybe one day he will make a mistake, and they'll get him. I hope so. I am so sorry that Patsy died. I felt so bad for her, and everything she went through.

No history? What about the evidence of prior sexual abuse as stated in the autopsy?

Chronic Erosion......

Not a One Night Intruder.

 

[SailorMoon]

You know..this is a mystery that may never be solved. I've always found the ransom note odd, unless someone was waiting and waiting for them to get home that night and had lots of time to kill. It's a case whose investigation was screwed from the get go. I've always thought the Ramseys did it, maybe Patsy thought John did it and she wrote the note to cover it up and then finds out that neither did.

But one thought that stays in my mind, if the Ramseys are innocent, then more than likely mommy and daughter are hanging out catching up on lost time way above us.

 

[reefshadow]

Yes, but I seem to remember they DID have a rough time getting ready for the party.

I never believed Patsy snapped either.... I always felt if there was no intruder (and that's how I lean)..... the key to all this is Burke.

I believe the TWO kids were up that night... maybe JB wet the bed & she went to Burke or he was already up. Snacks in the kitchen & then maybe roaming around the house because they were too charged up to sleep between Xmas AND their upcoming trip(s).

I think a snack.... some very normal sibling teasing, fighting & then some innocent horseplay..... resulted in a tragic accident later than night.

To me, it makes good sense that Patsy would want to protect Burke after her daughter is mortally hurt & BOTH parents would do anything to fix things so he was not destroyed.

"some very normal sibling teasing, fighting & then some innocent horseplay..... resulted in a tragic accident later than night."

I guess it is technically possible, but have you seen the photos of her skull? It has a *huge* hole and something like an 8 inch crack in it. I just have a hard time believing this was the result of an accident, it had to have been an incredibly intense blow that caused that kind of extensive damage. IMO that kind of injury was caused by either A.- someone who was intensely enraged, or B. someone who intended to kill her with that blow.

 

[Adalena935]

I know this is a serious topic, and I'm awfully sorry that happened to you (though good for you coming out on top!) -- but this made me literally LOL.

Truthfully my husband and I never uttered a word about it to each other for about 42 years. When we did our hands shook. I've been lucky and so were they.

 

[trixie]

I never believed the family had anything to do with Jon Benet's murder. Never did. There was no history of any sort of crime in that family. But there are always going to be people who believed the parents were guilty, and I think even if the real killer is ever caught, they'll still try to think of a way the parents did it.

The note. Yeah. The perp got in while the Ramseys were at a party. He waited until they came home and went to sleep, and while he was waiting, he took a note page from the kitchen pad and wrote the note. Crazy people do crazy things. He never had any intention of kidnapping her. He only wrote that to throw the police off. It was so obvious from the beginning.

After he killed her, he left the house. The police were totally inadequate, and never handled a murder case before, and did everything wrong. But hey, killers get away with murder all the time. Sometimes one after another for years. Some eventually get caught, and some don't. Apparently this guy hasn't got caught. Yet. But maybe one day he will make a mistake, and they'll get him. I hope so. I am so sorry that Patsy died. I felt so bad for her, and everything she went through.

You are conveniently leaving out a mountain of evidence. Pineapple for example. Eaten within 2 hours of her death.

 

[Adalena935]

They're reporting that Mary Lacy says that. But, going by the John Mark Karr thing, her threshold for proof is pretty low.

test by Bode Technology Group outside of Washington, D.C., found new evidence on long johns and underwear worn by JonBenet.

Fox News dot com

 

[BBB167893]

WHOA everybody!

Now let's all pull back a minute here.

Like I always say, keep and open mind, but not so open that your brains fall out.

Nancy Grace on now. Wendy Murphy is blowing Mary Lacy out of the water. Mary Lacy is not there of course, but Wendy knws this case. She's not buyin' it!

SHE'S CALLING MARY LACY OUT!! She wants her to release ALL of the evidence to the public!

I saw that, trixie!

I wonder if the family can sue?

Maybe, but since the police acted in good faith, I don't see much happening.

Sue who?! The BPD? LOL - I wish they would so that all of the info is out on the table, but I betcha that will not happen. How would the cronic erosion of JonBenet's hymen be pinned on a One Time Only Intruder?!

That's what Wendy said! And Dr. Joshua Perper agreed!

Everyone should realize that so many people doubted the parents because many didn't believe someone could just come in their house in the middle of the night, undetected.

But since then, we've seen two high profile case, no three, where this very thing happened. Elizabeth Smart, Danielle VanDam, and the one in Florida, I believe.

Comparing this case to those is apples and hand grenades. None of those killers camped out inside the house or killed their victims in the same house.

Okay, I'll give it to you folks in a nutshell: Mary Lacy has burned us too many times in her quest to find ANY reason to exonerate the Ramseys, and since she's going to be leaving office soon, she has nothing to lose on this. Remember, it's her opinion that this is important evidence, and since that viewpoint led her headlong into Mr. Karr, I see that as good reason to doubt her.

But in all honesty, it's one thing to say, "this is good evidence and reason enough to cast a wider net." I agree. But it's another thing to say that it clears them, with all of the evidence that has to be overlooked to do that.

BTW MrsMush99, you have excellent taste. That's my favorite Marilyn picture.

 

[wenchie]

John claims he carried JonBenet to bed, took her shoes and coat off...then left Patsy to do the rest. Patsy claims she slipped the velvet pants, tights, and velvet vest....left her white shirt on....looked for pajamas, instead using long underwear on JonBenet.

If an intruder was in the home, than his dna would be on the long underwear and panties....not the tights.

I can't believe I let that slip by me!..........but I especially can't believe the DA would let that slip by her!

 

[RiverRat]

You are conveniently leaving out a mountain of evidence. Pineapple for example. Eaten within 2 hours of her death.

From a bowl containing Patsy and Burke's fingerprints! Yet denied to the death.....

 

[LI_Mom]

"some very normal sibling teasing, fighting & then some innocent horseplay..... resulted in a tragic accident later than night."

I guess it is technically possible, but have you seen the photos of her skull? It has a *huge* hole and something like an 8 inch crack in it. I just have a hard time believing this was the result of an accident, it had to have been an incredibly intense blow that caused that kind of extensive damage. IMO that kind of injury was caused by either A.- someone who was intensely enraged, or B. someone who intended to kill her with that blow.

Or someone who was messing around with a golf club & hit her by accident?

I also wondered if they ever tested to see what kind of velocity they would get if they dropped that heavy Maglite from the top of the stairs & it landed on a skull?


I just have SO MUCH trouble believing the intruder theory.

 

[TexMex]

:clap: You said it Tex.

Howdy MrsMush

I hope one day this "man" is caught and punished.

 

[TexMex]

Yes, but I seem to remember they DID have a rough time getting ready for the party.

I never believed Patsy snapped either.... I always felt if there was no intruder (and that's how I lean)..... the key to all this is Burke.

I believe the TWO kids were up that night... maybe JB wet the bed & she went to Burke or he was already up. Snacks in the kitchen & then maybe roaming around the house because they were too charged up to sleep between Xmas AND their upcoming trip(s).

I think a snack.... some very normal sibling teasing, fighting & then some innocent horseplay..... resulted in a tragic accident later than night.

To me, it makes good sense that Patsy would want to protect Burke after her daughter is mortally hurt & BOTH parents would do anything to fix things so he was not destroyed.

But Burke's DNA isn't in his sister's panties and long-johns.

It does not suprise me his prints are on a bowl in his house.

 

[Skigwy]

I completely disagree. I don't think he said anything KIND I just think he wasn't calling for his death and people didn't like that.

ETA: I also think he was being cautious because he KNOWS what it's like to be falsely accused.

J. RAMSEY: Well, I had actually seen some pictures of him. They had taken some surveillance pictures and sent them to me before he was arrested and said do you recognize him?

And I said no, I don't. In fact, he, you know, if this is a guy, he's a pretty clean cut looking guy.



Karr was never falsely accused of anything. He was sharing his fantasies about molesting and killing children with his & John Ramsey's mutual friend Michael Tracey.

And as you say, John Ramsey identified with him.

 

[LI_Mom]

WHOA everybody!

But in all honesty, it's one thing to say, "this is good evidence and reason enough to cast a wider net." I agree. But it's another thing to say that it clears them, with all of the evidence that has to be overlooked to do that.

SuperDave, did anyone question why they only found THREE matches?

How can there not be the same matching touch dna found on the rope, tape, the shirt, etc????

 

[Adalena935]

You are conveniently leaving out a mountain of evidence. Pineapple for example. Eaten within 2 hours of her death.

Children often eat in their own homes. DNA in 3 places on the dead victim trumps food eaten by a child in their own home.

I had a stalker for 12 years who came into my home whenever he pleased and left notes inside my closets and drawers after stealing whatever he wanted. It was a cop. It happens. Criminals do whatever they want whenever they want. Don't rule out the possibility that the killer may have led the little girl down to eat pineapple.

Don't rule out he brought pineapple with him. Nutty people do nutty things. Anyone bold enough to commit this crime or my cop/stalker for 12 yrs no less has easy access to anyone at will in the community. You know, like BTK did for decades undetected.

10's of thousands of people in the US process data from your medical records, bank records, places of employment, loans, applications and what sweatshirt you bought on sale in the year 2000 at wal mart. Cops and utility company workers have access to your personal information. Bank employees. Vehicle registration forms, auto dealers. Many people you would never think of know everything about your life, your identity, your bank acct. numbers, when you had your last medical exam and the results of it. It is ALL data processing. People order new checks regularly, but never give a thought to who has access to that intimate details of their lives. They believe it's somehow secret. It's not. a lot of people have access to those things. Some take documents home with them even though they're not supposed to. Some take stacks of info and pitch it into dumpsters so they won't have to do the work required to process it. There for any bum on the street to have. Phone company workers, the man at the hardware store who made your new keys. It's all computerized and logged in. All he has to do is make as many duplicates as he wants.

When I had my stalker we wracked our brains trying to think who could have such free access to our lives. Calling us up periodically catching us off guard. Telling us everything about our lives and what he was going to do with it. He knew everything about us while we knew nothing about him.

If you don't think that can happen, thank your lucky stars. It happens to many people. It happened to me. We hear of ID theft regularly, yet you refuse to accept the reality that it's possible someone could have gained access to these people's finances and written that note.

You seem to be conveniently leaving out life and what possibilities exist to plague anyone anytime anywhere.

the very best thing in all this world that can befall a man is
to be born lucky - Mark Twain

 

[LI_Mom]

But Burke's DNA isn't in his sister's panties and long-johns.

It does not suprise me his prints are on a bowl in his house.

That assumes that the DNA must be from the killer.