The ransom note & Patsy Ramsey, letter by letter.

[joeskidbeck]

Cina Wong is 90-95% sure this is the handwriting of the author of the ransom note, so for me, the only question is how Hoffman obtained the samples and who do they belong to?

 

[BBB167893]

Can you then not see PR writes and spells differently, and know it was not her?

No, I can't see that. Because it's not there, or hadn't you noticed that was the whole point? This woman was described as having more handwriting styles than a class of sixth-graders.

Can you then not see the petechiae, and know it was not staged?

I see the petechiae just fine. That does not prove it was not staged. Far from it. It proves she was alive, but that doesn't matter if the person thought she was dead.

Re Werner Spitz: "someone took a long time to stage sexual assault and strangulation after she was unconscious."

Can you then not see the lab DNA reports on three samples on two separate sexual assault-related locations, and know it was not innocent?

No, I can't. Number one, because I can't view it in a vacuum. I have to view it within the holistic framework. Number two, it assumes a true sexual assault took place. Only in IDI's mind did that happen.

Whoever says what you want to hear?

I refer you to the case of Pot v. Kettle. And that's one of the printable replies.

 

[BBB167893]

Gee if its a ringer like you seem to claim, where are the cops? Where is the DA? Where is the FBI? Where is the CBI? Asleep?

We've answered that question a million times:

because proving she wrote it doesn't prove she KILLED JB.

 

[Holdontoyourhat]

We've answered that question a million times:

because proving she wrote it doesn't prove she KILLED JB.

Save your time, SD. I already found out the a-z exemplars shown on this thread aren't known to belong to PR.

Thanks for the disinfo.

 

[joeskidbeck]

What, exactly, would Hoffman have achieved by giving Wong exemplars from anyone but Patsy? They're no good if they belong to anyone else. I don't believe he was a stupid man, just one that didn't want to give up his source. That's too bad, he should have let the source worry about the outcome and gave up the info.

 

[BBB167893]

Your hyperlink doesn't seem to be working. Can you source your alphabet comparison as belonging to Cina Wong, or is it junk? Can you then go from Cina Wong to affidavit of PR's exemplars direct from BPD? How do you know PR wrote those letters? Because they came from a NY attorney? Where did HE get them?

Now, we're getting somewhere! If my understanding is correct, he got them from Tom Miller.

 

[BBB167893]

However, the pair (Leibman and Wong) said they do not know whether the unrehearsed samples were actually written by Patsy Ramsey.

That article is quite a few years old. Since it was written, Wong, Liebman and the others had time to examine other materials. Namely, the captions from the Ramsey photo album. Whoever wrote those wrote the RN. That narrows it down considerably.

 

[joeskidbeck]

Thanks, Dave. I'm going to go look further. Seems I read the old article as well as HOTYH.

 

[BBB167893]

My problem is I cant see either John or Patsy murdering Jonbonet in such a brutal way.

I'm sure a lot of people can't, Peepers. To my way of thinking, that's the problem. More specifically, not being able to see them doing it is not evidence.

 

[BBB167893]

Save your time, SD.

It's a bit late for that, HOTYH!

I already found out the a-z exemplars shown on this thread aren't known to belong to PR.

Weren't , not aren't. Good try, though.

Thanks for the disinfo.

I'll let that one pass because I'm in a festive holiday mood.

 

[Holdontoyourhat]

Weren't , not aren't. Good try, though.

Its going to take more than you simply saying that. You know that, right?

The a-z list is a sham, and its shameful that so many chimed in on this disinformation.

 

[Holdontoyourhat]

That article is quite a few years old. Since it was written, Wong, Liebman and the others had time to examine other materials. Namely, the captions from the Ramsey photo album. Whoever wrote those wrote the RN. That narrows it down considerably.

Source please, or is that asking too much? (LOL)

 

[cynic]

Lin Wood confirmed the authenticity of the documents that Cina Wong used in her analysis.

Q. (By Mr. Hoffman) Now, Mrs. Ramsey, I am going to tell you that that
document, along with reports, handwriting reports, were prepared by
document examiners Cina Wong and David Leadman. And other handwriting
was prepared -- other handwriting was used in the form of the police exemplars
that were given to my office by Mr. Wood pursuant to discovery requests.
And those documents are, without a doubt, your handwriting because they were identified
by Mr. Wood as being the handwriting exemplars that you personally gave to law
enforcement in Colorado at their request during that five-day period.

Now, the problem for Mr. Wolf in this case is the fact that not one of the
experts -- Cina Wong, David Leadman, an expert known as Gideon Epstein,
Larry F. Siegler, and an expert known as Don Lacey have all identified you
as the ransom note writer. It is not a close call, as far as they are concerned.
They have identified you. One of them, in fact, said, without doubt you are
the author of the ransom note. So in order to be certain that they are, in
fact, correct in what they are looking at as examples of your handwriting,
I wanted you to look at some of the documents that I gave you. Now I want
you to look at the document there and see why, in fact this, the issue of your
authorship, is such a problem.

Deposition of Patricia P. Ramsey
December 11, 2001

 

[cynic]

Your hyperlink doesn't seem to be working. Can you source your alphabet comparison as belonging to Cina Wong, or is it junk?

Had you read through the thread, you would have seen this:
http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?t=121568&page=2
Post 29
I credit Cina Wong, because she deserves the credit.
Michelle Dresbold used her work in her book, without Cina’s permission.
Cina sued and, consequently, in later editions of Dresbold’s book the material was removed, but there are plenty of older editions available.
The material I posted is from Dresbold’s book.
The link which I posted explains the situation, as well as the reference to the 243 similarities that Cina found between exemplars that she examined from PR and the RN.
I didn’t realize the link wasn’t working. This should work:
http://www.cinawongforgeryexpert.com/mediaroom_dailypress.asp

 

[cynic]

No it isn't. You're calling a letter cursive that isn't a cursive. Plain and simple wrong.

Gee if its a ringer like you seem to claim, where are the cops? Where is the DA? Where is the FBI? Where is the CBI? Asleep?

Nah your claims are unfounded. The overlay shows different stroke, and the 'a' you're calling cursive has a flat top. An erroneous report.

Did or did not the original 'a' that you called cursive in fact have a flat top?

And if so, why is there a flat top there? Is it because it is really a sloppy manuscript? Thats right, isnt' it. Why are you claiming that is a cursive 'a' when it clearly has a flat top?

You clearly don't wish to see what is obvious, that's fine, I'm happy to let other posters decide for themselves.

 

[joeskidbeck]

All I can say is....wow. All this after Patsy admitted to Steve Thomas that she believed whoever wrote the note, killed JonBenet. And John agreed. Oh, that was from the famous LKL where the three of them faced off.

 

[cynic]

However, the pair (Leibman and Wong) said they do not know whether the unrehearsed samples were actually written by Patsy Ramsey.

What?!? Cynic what are you DOING? This is all JUNK! LOLOLOL

Your celebration is somewhat premature.

 

[Holdontoyourhat]

You clearly don't wish to see what is obvious, that's fine, I'm happy to let other posters decide for themselves.

They now know that you are not able to source the a-z list as belonging to PR. The whole thread has been debunked. You have my sympathy.

 

[cynic]

They now know that you are not able to source the a-z list as belonging to PR. The whole thread has been debunked. You have my sympathy.

See post #113 above.

 

[BBB167893]

Its going to take more than you simply saying that. You know that, right?

Oh, yeah. I know. It'll help if you check out the other links.

The a-z list is a sham,

YOU say.

and its shameful that so many chimed in on this disinformation.

I imagine you'd rather not know what I think is shameful about this.