The Rest of the Story...

[Ciara]

I know what you mean Details. I have seen these sickos online arguing that its NOT harmful to the kids and calling it "love", even saying that they love the kids more than the parents do. I have seen them say that they are in a "relationship" with this child and that child and how the child chose THEM. I believe they even have their own political party in Holland now to campaign for the right to have sex with children under the age of 12 AND animals too, arguing that just like homosexuality, paedophilia is a "sexual orientation".
Ugh...even the thought sickens me. You wouldnt believe how "normal" these freaks think they are.

 

[Truly]

Excellent Post Truly. Just brilliant:clap:

Thanks, Ciara. :blowkiss: I know you have also tried to ask the same thing. Maybe if you tried again to ask the question in your own words, you'd get a response? I doubt it, but hey, it's worth a try. I think there is some deeper reason why Glow evades the question.

 

[Truly]

I would love to hear your answer to Truly's post above because you make so many excuses for the FLDS and try to show us that other organizations are as bad or worse. That's not the point...do you condone what the FLDS do as far as underage girls and assigning husbands for them?

Glow, I think we would all love to hear your answer to Deb's question.
No evasion.
No changing the subject.
Focus.
Respond.
It's easy as pie. You can do it. Just take the first step...

 

[Glow]

I snipped your post Glow..hope I did it right.
The problem I have with this arguement is that I have seen paedophiles online using it....saying that homosexuality was illegal and now its not etc so they think its only a matter of time if they campaign for it...that paedophilia will be legal. So where do we draw the line? Polygamy should stay illegal in my opinion.
Ugh..I just read back what I wrote here and I think I have explained badly but its late here and I can't be bothered rewriting it so hopefully you'll understand my point:waitasec:

You did it right Ciara!


Here is why that argument does not have substance to me.

The major difference in pedophilia and homosexuality is that pedophilia involves children in a sexual situation. That is not ever ok. It doesn't matter what the pedophile says. People are enormously talented at justifying their behavior but that doesn't legitimize the behavior.

There are many factors (biologically) that go into arousing sexual interest in humans. Cues so to speak. None of those are displayed by children - ever. Therefore the person who is sexually aroused by a child is working off of an alternate drive in behavior that is not inherently sexual. They are deviants and aberrations. IT doesn't matter if they are acting out because they were abused,or they are on drugs or they have whetted an inappropriate appetite by what they feed their mind on the Internet. It is still deviant behavior. Of course they are going to try to "claim" any and all words and persuasive arguments that others have used before them - they dont have any of their own so they try to work off the shirttails of others.

As far as homosexuality, some feel that the Bible and other holy writings condemn it and use that as their basis for doing so - they have nothing against the individuals so much as they do the behavior. Still other people think that the Bible is interpretive on this topic and they feel that anything that is loving between ADULTS is fine with them.

There are debates still going on as to nature VS nurture in this arena. The bottom line is as long as it is 2 adults (which means they would be biologically mature sexual beings) there is still a basis for the behaving sexually. That just simply is not ever true with children.

The young of every species is as close as nature takes us to knowing the true meaning of "asexual" which means the absence of sexual. To see sexuality when it just isnt there is pathological.

Regardless, once we opened the Pandora's box and said that marriage can be defined various ways we now have all the resultant confusion that comes with that. Since we are the ones who lifted the lid we have to make ourselves the custodians of what happens as a result.

 

[Ciara]

I enjoyed reading that last post of yours Glow. I think you are right about the Pandora's Box.....I cant remember that story anymore so did anything good ever come out of that box?

 

[Truly]

The bottom line is as long as it is 2 adults (which means they would be biologically mature sexual beings) there is still a basis for the behaving sexually. That just simply is not ever true with children.

And you have already stated (numerous times) that in your opinion, as soon as a girl starts her period, she is no longer a child, but rather a 'biologically mature sexual being'. Therefore, (in your opinion), her father or uncle has the right to 'behave sexually' with her, and she does not have the right to actually mature and make those decisions for herself? That an older male can swoop in and molest her as soon as she begins to emerge from childhood? Do you really believe that?

 

[Ciara]

And you have already stated (numerous times) that in your opinion, as soon as a girl starts her period, she is no longer a child, but rather a 'biologically mature sexual being'. Therefore, (in your opinion), her father or uncle has the right to 'behave sexually' with her, and she does not have the right to actually mature and make those decisions for herself? That an older male can swoop in and molest her as soon as she begins to emerge from childhood? Do you really believe that?

Oh I hope she does not believe that. There is no way thats right if its true

 

[LinasK]

HOWEVER - I do think your point on comparing circumcision to polygamy is a great one... for Jewish people it's in their Law .. it's a great comparison.

No, not a great comparison. I am a Jew. I am in an interfaith marriage. When I was pregnant, I definitely wanted to know the sex of my child to know whether or not I would have to deal with this issue if I had a male child. You see, my husband didn't want circumcision, and I would have respected his right not to have it done over that of my religion.

 

[LinasK]

Move to another country or stay very, very quiet...lol.

I don't think homosexuality has anything to do with polygamy or the FLDS.

Very true. I don't see why certain posters insist on making this comparison. I think the idea of gay marriage makes them feel insecure in their own marriages.

 

[Ciara]

Very true. I don't see why certain posters insist on making this comparison. I think the idea of gay marriage makes them feel insecure in their own marriages.

Not me..I'm not married I only mentioned homosexuality in the context that they were once marginalised and many paedophiles base their arguement on that arguement....if that makes sense:waitasec:
But I agree that there is not a comparison to the FLDS.

 

[Truly]

Oh I hope she does not believe that. There is no way thats right if its true

Well, Glow? We can all see that you are here now and reading. You have stated this over and over in the earlier threads. Defend your theory that a girl of 9, or 10, or 11 is a 'biologically mature sexual being'. And then defend your idea that an adult male has the right to assault her.

(...waiting for Glow to change the subject...)

 

[Glow]

I enjoyed reading that last post of yours Glow. I think you are right about the Pandora's Box.....I cant remember that story anymore so did anything good ever come out of that box?

I think so...I believe in addition to all the woes there was one good thing

hope

 

[Glow]

Pedophiles claiming an argument applies to them doesn't mean that it does, nor that it ever will. Like any sicko, like any criminal, they'll try to take any valid cause they can, and link themselves to it. That doesn't denigrate the real issue they claim to relate to - it's just more evidence of how far they are from reality.
There's a clear, bright line. Anything not harmful to others, that two consentual adults wish to do, should be legal. A marriage is between two consentual adults, any time it is not harmful to others. It's a pretty simple line - and doesn't apply to pedophiles, incest, etc.

good differences between the two Details.

 

[pamlet]

No, not a great comparison. I am a Jew. I am in an interfaith marriage. When I was pregnant, I definitely wanted to know the sex of my child to know whether or not I would have to deal with this issue if I had a male child. You see, my husband didn't want circumcision, and I would have respected his right not to have it done over that of my religion.

The fact that you knew it was an you would have to face shows how deeply it's ingrained in you .. Just as religions that have polygamy as part of their doctrine has that ingrained in their followers. That's the point I was making...

 

[LinasK]

The fact that you knew it was an you would have to face shows how deeply it's ingrained in you .. Just as religions that have polygamy as part of their doctrine has that ingrained in their followers. That's the point I was making...

No, it's that I would have had pressure from my parents to do it.

 

[Glow]

No, not a great comparison. I am a Jew. I am in an interfaith marriage. When I was pregnant, I definitely wanted to know the sex of my child to know whether or not I would have to deal with this issue if I had a male child. You see, my husband didn't want circumcision, and I would have respected his right not to have it done over that of my religion.

I can appreciate what you are saying in that this did not apply to you in a personal family way.

I was addressing how this would play out on a legislative level on one side and with the more fundamental Jews (Orthodox and Hasidic) on the other.

I'm sure you are right that interfaith marriages would use a different measure. By being interfaith they already are using a different measure.

My illustration relied on two opposing extremes to make its point.

 

[Glow]

religions that have polygamy as part of their doctrine has that ingrained in their followers. That's the point I was making...

That is a HUGE point to be made on this topic. If the goal is to change the behavoir, it begins by reaching the heart and mind since that is where "ingrained" things reside.

 

[Truly]

Oh I hope she does not believe that. There is no way thats right if its true

S/He does believe that. I don't know if I have the stomach to go back through the earlier threads and revisit his/her posts. I was sexually assaulted as a child, as were many others here. Not by my parents, though, thankfully, and definitely not under the pressure from my parents church that God wanted me to be assaulted. The FLDS are a bunch of sick twisted paedophiles. They brainwash their children from birth to accept that God wants preteen girls to submit to sex with their old nasty uncles. I think that the only ones who can defend it are under the spell of the cult.

 

[Ciara]

You can have things ingrained in you as part of your religion but still have choice to do them or not. To me, the women and children in the FLDS dont have that kind of choice....their choices are made for them by the men

 

[Ciara]

S/He does believe that. I don't know if I have the stomach to go back through the earlier threads and revisit his/her posts. I was sexually assaulted as a child, as were many others here. Not by my parents, though, thankfully, and definitely not under the pressure from my parents church that God wanted me to be assaulted. The FLDS are a bunch of sick twisted paedophiles. They brainwash their children from birth to accept that God wants preteen girls to submit to sex with their old nasty uncles. I think that the only ones who can defend it are under the spell of the cult.

I find the marriages between them old men and some are REALLY old, and those young innocent girls totally disgusting. I saw one pic online but I cant remember his name, however he was truly an old age pensioner and had married THREE young sisters....that is just revolting