The wait for closing arguments discussion thread

[flipflop]

Who was that?

Really not worth mentioning....

 

[CarrieBean]

WS is being difficult tonight. See you all on Friday.

 

[OhSoCurious]

It also shows that the girl was a female teenager and my child would have skipped and smile to go see a dog too! Jmo

My child would not have given this "teenager" the time of day if she was excited to race home and get ready for her movie night with her friends. JMO

 

[Ardy]

Come on Christie..........you can do better than this.

http://fullcomment.nationalpost.com...-takes-last-shot-at-raising-reasonable-doubt/

While there was a connection between McClintic and Tori’s parents — they occasionally bought painkillers from her mother Carol, as both Tori’s mother and McClintic acknowledged — McClintic has maintained she first spotted the little girl while standing against a telephone pole on the street.

Occasionally bought painkillers?

Makes it sound like they slipped over for a couple of aspirins.

Occasionally? The neighbors used the words "frequently".

Maybe both words mean another word............"often".

So.......McClintic spotted VS while standing by a telephone pole, and in her statement, she said she took VS because she was the first child who came towards her.

But how does that happen...........with TLM coming from the school?

It doesn't.........but it puts one more hole in TLM's testimony, that is now starting to resemble Swiss Cheese.

JMO

 

[daisy.faithfull]

My child would not have given this "teenager" the time of day if she was excited to race home and get ready for her movie night with her friends. JMO

I had the most incredible dog ever. Children would come up to talk to us, want to walk her etc. And these are children that are brought up knowing who stranger danger is. I think the know who stranger danger is, but when they see a dog they don't think stranger danger, more than likely they have been told stranger dangers lure them away with candy, dogs etc, but they just get tunnel vision when it comes to that kinda thing. Plus I'm a woman.

It's very scary. I don't think a parent can ever take for granted that their children will make the right decision in these circumstances. I'm not a parent, but I think it's something you have to talk about a lot with them.

It's sad because children shouldn't have to worry about horrible things like that. But it's just like parents that yell after their children to look both ways when they cross the street or watch for cars when they are bike riding. The kids know they need to be careful when it comes to riding their bike, but sometimes they just don't think about that stuff.

 

[flipflop]

Im still very baffled from this last witness. A grandfather was right there, the teacher was right there, another mother was just up the street....not one of them stated that they saw anyone in a white coat enter the school. Dirk pointed out that the school had 326 students in school that day, how many of those parents were there, no one else to our knowledge has come forward to state that they saw someone in a white coat enter the school. A 60 yr old grandmother sitting in a van 2 bus lengths away witnesses a white coat entering the school and fails to mention it when first interviewed. This just does not add up for me. MOO

 

[Tahorn]

For me grandmama testimony was the most truthful and honest from this entire case. She was the only one without an ulterior motive.

 

[flipflop]

Come on Christie..........you can do better than this.

http://fullcomment.nationalpost.com...-takes-last-shot-at-raising-reasonable-doubt/

While there was a connection between McClintic and Tori’s parents — they occasionally bought painkillers from her mother Carol, as both Tori’s mother and McClintic acknowledged — McClintic has maintained she first spotted the little girl while standing against a telephone pole on the street.

Occasionally bought painkillers?

Makes it sound like they slipped over for a couple of aspirins.

Occasionally? The neighbors used the words "frequently".

Maybe both words mean another word............"often".

So.......McClintic spotted VS while standing by a telephone pole, and in her statement, she said she took VS because she was the first child who came towards her.

But how does that happen...........with TLM coming from the school?

It doesn't.........but it puts one more hole in TLM's testimony, that is now starting to resemble Swiss Cheese.

JMO

With only one witness to this at the busiest time of the school day, with the street filled with buses, cars, parents, kids, teachers....only one person witnesses a person with a white coat enter the school. She doesn't mention this to LE because they didn't ask.... Im not so sure that this witness is very credible. I am glad that the defence gave up the chance of having the last word for this.

 

[daisy.faithfull]

Im still very baffled from this last witness. A grandfather was right there, the teacher was right there, another mother was just up the street....not one of them stated that they saw anyone in a white coat enter the school. Dirk pointed out that the school had 326 students in school that day, how many of those parents were there, no one else to our knowledge has come forward to state that they saw someone in a white coat enter the school. A 60 yr old grandmother sitting in a van 2 bus lengths away witnesses a white coat entering the school and fails to mention it when first interviewed. This just does not add up for me. MOO

It really is difficult to believe, and I'm sure all the people that were there wonder about how they could have been there and done something? But I understand, there wasn't anything out of the ordinary going on. I think TLM looked like any other mom picking up her child and Tori didn't protest so no one noticed.

One thing I've been thinking about lately. At first I thought that MTR did a drive by when TLM was going to get a child because he wanted to make sure she did it. Now I wonder if he did that so he could see if she had been caught so he could decrease the likelihood they would connect him to TLM, YKWIM?

Driving buy like that doesn't make sense if he was an innocent dupe.

 

[Alison]

IMO it started out just as that...a babysitting job, whether sent there by someone other than MR or a plan TLM worked out for herself for whatever reason she had in mind...drug debt owed to her Mother..revenge for something that didn't go to plan etc..I fully believe TS knew TLM..

So your opinion is that TM got on stand and lied at her own daughters murder trial? Or do you feel JG introduced the two and he has been dishonest during the whole investigation? Since these are the only two ways TLM and VS would have known eachother.

 

[roseofsharon]

For me grandmama testimony was the most truthful and honest from this entire case. She was the only one without an ulterior motive.

What about the fact that Grandma says she saw white coated TLM enter the school, sees video surveillance (released day after TS is abducted) has interview with LE April 11, but doesn't mention she saw white coated woman that police are looking for because LE DIDN'T ASK HER!!! Yeah, she's a really dilly of a witness she is!!! MOO

 

[Ardy]

I doubt the jury is going to question the grandmother's testimony.

JMO.........

 

[OhSoCurious]

What about the fact that Grandma says she saw white coated TLM enter the school, sees video surveillance (released day after TS is abducted) has interview with LE April 11, but doesn't mention she saw white coated woman that police are looking for because LE DIDN'T ASK HER!!! Yeah, she's a really dilly of a witness she is!!! MOO

Yes ... she is a dilly of a witness. I say good for her. She did not want to testify. She understood what her testimony would do. She did the right thing. JMO

 

[flipflop]

I doubt the jury is going to question the grandmother's testimony.

JMO.........

I think they will question her testimony JMO

 

[roseofsharon]

IMO, the jury will totally disregard Grandma's testimony. moo

 

[Alison]

Yes ... she is a dilly of a witness. I say good for her. She did not want to testify. She understood what her testimony would do. She did the right thing. JMO

Which is absoloutly nothing? This testimony was anything but another red herring fallacy thrown out there by the defence. MOO

 

[roseofsharon]

Yes ... she is a dilly of a witness. I say good for her. She did not want to testify. She understood what her testimony would do. She did the right thing. JMO

What did her testimony do? Apparently, Grandma thought it was too warm that day for a white puffy coat, which makes me wonder if she was not a tad confused. I shopped in Woodstock and area that day, it was brisk!!!

Oh I agree, she did her civil duty, however, it makes absolutely no sense whatsoever, that she would not tell LE about seeing a woman in a white coat enter the school. MOO

 

[otto]

I don't think there would be a ban on writing a book after the trial is over by someone other than the convicted...they (the convicted) cannot profit from their crime..A well known reporter was interviewing friends etc. of RW long before his court case..the book was published within months after RW was sentenced...JMO

Canadian jurors are sworn to secrecy after a trial, so there won't be any book writing by the jurors. There's nothing to prevent others from writing books based on their own research.

 

[daisy.faithfull]

So your opinion is that TM got on stand and lied at her own daughters murder trial? Or do you feel JG introduced the two and he has been dishonest during the whole investigation? Since these are the only two ways TLM and VS would have known eachother.

But even if TLM had at some point met Tori, what does that have to do with anything? It doesn't make it anymore or less probable that this was an abduction/rape/murder that MTR was in on.

So maybe it was related to drugs. But seeing as how we know MTR does drugs he is just as likely to have drug connects with someone that Tara owed money too. He knew TLM's mom to, he was friendly enough with her to help her out when TLM went to Juvie. He didn't have a job, who knows where his supply of cash was coming from, it looks like he was getting some from pimping and maybe drug dealing. But addictions are expensive and maybe he was kidnapping Tori to even a score with a supplier.

MTR was also dating someone who knew Tori before the abduction.

Regardless, if it was revenge for a bad drug deal, why didn't the defence call that drug dealer to the stand. I know a drug dealer isn't the type to step up to help LE, but since I think it's pretty safe to say LE investigated any and all connections to Tara they would have found that dealer and LE possibly offered them a deal to talk. I doubt that LE was protecting Tara, she was probably LE's first suspect.

I still do think that TLM took Tori because she was there. If this was a planned abduction they would have planned for Tori to not be walking home alone because it was the first time Tori had ever done that.

 

[flipflop]

If this 60 year old grandmother was 100% sure that she witnessed, the same woman in the CASS video, enter the school around dismissal time on April the 8th 2009...I am sure it would have been a freshly important piece of information on her mind that she would have passed on to LE whether they asked her or not.....but she chose NOT to tell them.