Theories discussion: What could have happened to Haleigh? #3

[Dr.Fessel]

The light had to be on for her to see the back door open I bet. I think the whole story evolved as the night went on.

 

[debs]

But it doesn't explain why Misty panicked when seeing the door open if it was so close to the time when Ronald typically comes home. It could have been nothing more than Ron had gone out to take out the garbage when he got home. Why was there immediate panic that it was something more than that?

Also, the Jr crawling over her as she falls asleep....why no panic then? That would freak me out if a child decides to get up as I'm going to bed. It would frustrate me if I were tired and was just trying to get to sleep but I would also set that aside to discover what he was up to.

The focus on the pee blankets sounds to me like Misty's justification about something she'd been yelled at...like, perhaps Haleigh had wet sometime over the time she was gone and since it was Misty's job to take care of the household, she wanted to make sure everyonew as aware she was doing her "wifely duties" by washing those stinky blankets. In short, making herself look good in the eyes of someone who made it clear she'd failed their expectations of her by taking off. A way for her to say "I'm back and I'm not leaving again and I take my responsibilities seriously so please don't keep hating me."

That brick was staged. Period. Ronald's explanation for it was hogwash.

 

[Blaise]

I am still trying to understand why we are expected to believe this 3 day binder BS story.

I don't know about the rest of the 'we's', but I believe because:

* Neves has stated Misty was gone for 3 days.
* Both Neves and Misty have stated that she was exhausted.
* The friends she was hanging with have drug records, and one is currently in jail for drug offenses.
* Earlier, Neves did her damnedest to portray Misty as someone who was fit to babysit Haleigh, and if there was *no* bender, I think Neves would have been trumpeting the fact.
* The recent mugging where one of the parties stated they went there to buy drugs.

That's five data points. Unless we were hangin' with Misty or have access to all that LE has access to, we can't know with any certainty, but to think otherwise seems to be . . . strange.

Blaise

 

[Malesherbes]

I don't think we can really say that Ron didn't go to court to try and get child support from Crystal. It is possible he didn't initially, since he knew that she didn't have any income and would not have the ability to pay. I doubt he wanted to take action that could land her in jail. Buit once she was living with and had a child with a boyfriend who was supporting her and had a job, then I would expect that Ron would have asked for payments to start.

This is all a moot point, however, as the friend of the court in FL (not sure what it's actually called there), controls this and not the individual who is supposed to get the payments. The court system tracks non-payment and takes action on delinquent payers. There is usually a tremendous lag time on this, unfortunately - several years is not incommon. (I've been there, done that!)

I agree that the 3 day bender may not have been directly involved in what happened to Haleigh. But, it demonstrates that Misty was using. As does her recent adventure in the Ragsdale complex. It's the strong evidence of Misty's drug use that's worrisome, because she is associating with people that use drugs and with drug dealers. This high risk activity and is what raises the red flags.

Again, if Haleigh was hurt before Ron went to work, how could Jr been oblivious all night long? He and Haleigh were joined at the hip...!

There is no record of Ron going to court asking for money from Crystal, there would be records, there is not, he never tried-

 

[Crosby87]

Wasn't Jr asleep all day?

Snipped from Misty’s hypnosis tape:

Then we took her to school and I walked to her into school, walked her all the way to her classroom, then walked out back to, got in the car with Ronald and Jr. We went home and went back to sleep until about twelve. Got up,Ronald got up, got ready for work and got ready I don’t know what we did around the house, just laid around until Ronald had to go to work. Jr. played and then he took a nap. And it was time for Haleigh to pick up at the bus, so Ronald picked Haleigh up at the bus, I stayed at the house because Jr. was sleeping so Ronald couldn’t take him to the bus, so I stayed there.

Hypnosis transcription - Websleuths Crime Sleuthing Community

 

[kiki the parrot]

For the reasons mentioned, I think that either A) the bricked door was a coverup, or B) there was an intruder or intruders, they were sure that Misty was dead to the world, they bricked it just to make it easier to carry Haleigh out, and they weren't worried about noise too much. They apparently weren't too worried about turning the light on either...

ETA - C) If Misty was awake & involved when Haleigh was carried out (or carried her out herself), then the door could have been bricked to make it easier to carry her out also.

Had they themselves bricked the door strictly for ease of carrying Haleigh or anything else (plants or other evidence outside as has been suggested), I believe the brick would have been removed upon completion of that task before LE arrived. If left in place beyond that point, it was still for staging purposes no way around it IMO.

arrot:

 

[kiki the parrot]

But it doesn't explain why Misty panicked when seeing the door open if it was so close to the time when Ronald typically comes home. It could have been nothing more than Ron had gone out to take out the garbage when he got home. Why was there immediate panic that it was something more than that?

Also, the Jr crawling over her as she falls asleep....why no panic then? That would freak me out if a child decides to get up as I'm going to bed. It would frustrate me if I were tired and was just trying to get to sleep but I would also set that aside to discover what he was up to.

The focus on the pee blankets sounds to me like Misty's justification about something she'd been yelled at...like, perhaps Haleigh had wet sometime over the time she was gone and since it was Misty's job to take care of the household, she wanted to make sure everyonew as aware she was doing her "wifely duties" by washing those stinky blankets. In short, making herself look good in the eyes of someone who made it clear she'd failed their expectations of her by taking off. A way for her to say "I'm back and I'm not leaving again and I take my responsibilities seriously so please don't keep hating me."

(snip) Yes many self-serving statements by MC. And if she'd not gotten enough rest over previous three days to sufficiently sleep off her long weekend, I can easily see her being beyond frustrated, or this itself being the catalyst or trigger causing a flaring of Misty's now confirmed short temper.

arrot:

 

[kamky]

There is no record of Ron going to court asking for money from Crystal, there would be records, there is not, he never tried-

He wouldn't have had to. The court system does this for him! If he just called and asked about it, this would not be shown in any records.

- If Ron called and asked about it, the system would have tracked non-payment and handled it.

- If Ron never called and asked about getting payments, the system would have tracked non-payment and handled it.

In other words, non-payment is out of the hands of the individual. Someone can fuss about it, but the system handles it regardless.

 

[kamky]

Had they themselves bricked the door strictly for ease of carrying Haleigh or anything else (plants or other evidence outside as has been suggested), I believe the brick would have been removed upon completion of that task before LE arrived. If left in place beyond that point, it was still for staging purposes no way around it IMO.

arrot:

It's possible, Kiki. It's also possible that once whoever carried out Haleigh was gone, they wanted to make a hasty getaway and didn't really care about removing the brick or turning out the light, etc.

 

[debs]

It's possible, Kiki. It's also possible that once whoever carried out Haleigh was gone, they wanted to make a hasty getaway and didn't really care about removing the brick or turning out the light, etc.

Why this child, this night, this way? So many things have to fall into place to plan it enough to know you have to brick the back screen door so it doesn't slam. Plus, why take her out that door, so exposed to the wide open? The front door with the screened porch offers a natural shield for ingress/egress. Why this backdoor? Navigating down the ramp with a child isn't easy, even when heightened stress is applied.

No, I don't think that backdoor plays anything into the events surrounding Haleigh's disappearance.

 

[kiki the parrot]

It's possible, Kiki. It's also possible that once whoever carried out Haleigh was gone, they wanted to make a hasty getaway and didn't really care about removing the brick or turning out the light, etc.

Yes I realize that. This was your Scenario A, I believe, to which I specified "HAD they themselves" been responsible. HTH

arrot:

 

[Malesherbes]

He wouldn't have had to. The court system does this for him! If he just called and asked about it, this would not be shown in any records.

- If Ron called and asked about it, the system would have tracked non-payment and handled it.

- If Ron never called and asked about getting payments, the system would have tracked non-payment and handled it.

In other words, non-payment is out of the hands of the individual. Someone can fuss about it, but the system handles it regardless.

Ok, but he still has no known job for 3 years- And he could have went and asked for action against her- he didn't, so somehow without a job he was supporting the kids somehow, and I think what he was doing is important, especially if it was illegal, which I think it was, I never heard of him winning the lotto or anything-

 

[kamky]

Why this child, this night, this way? So many things have to fall into place to plan it enough to know you have to brick the back screen door so it doesn't slam. Plus, why take her out that door, so exposed to the wide open? The front door with the screened porch offers a natural shield for ingress/egress. Why this backdoor? Navigating down the ramp with a child isn't easy, even when heightened stress is applied.

No, I don't think that backdoor plays anything into the events surrounding Haleigh's disappearance.

What if somebody was smoking/doing dope out on the ramp to the back door? I think Misty said (somebody said) that they used the back door to go out and smoke and also to take the garbage bags out.

Haleigh was so light, I don't think navigating the ramp would be a problem.

True that the front screened-in porch offers a natural shield. But if someone wanted to toss some left-over drug materials into the trash, they would need to be near where the trash is kept.

I don't know why this child, this night, this way. Poor little baby. I sure wish we knew what LE knows! We are pretty much left shooting in the dark. Do we know how much Jr weighed compared to Haleigh? Even though he is younger, I think he's bigger. IF Jr was sleeping with Misty, Haleigh would have been easier to take. (A big IF, I know.) If this was a revenge thing, maybe someone knew that Haleigh was Ron's special child.

This makes me wonder something...We know that Misty & Ron had a fight about her babysitting a relative's kids and Ron said no. Misty was very angry at Ron. Misty would have known that Haleigh was special to Ron. What if her drug-friends came over, they did drugs, and they decided to stage this as a way for Misty to get back at Ron. This is why Misty did not call 911. She thought it would be easy to bring Haleigh back, but things got out of control when Ron said to call 911 and LE arrived. Misty may not have realized that once Haleigh was in the hands of druggies, whe was at risk and who knows where she might have ended up.

You have a good logical head, debs, what do you think of this angle?

 

[kamky]

Ok, but he still has no known job for 3 years- And he could have went and asked for action against her- he didn't, so somehow without a job he was supporting the kids somehow, and I think what he was doing is important, especially if it was illegal, which I think it was, I never heard of him winning the lotto or anything-

I think we heard that he did odd jobs and helped with landscaping. Probably not enough to support a family. My assumption would e that he got some help from his mother and grandmother, supplemented by periodic jobs.

Could have been something more, but I don't think we have any evidence.

 

[Pondering Mind]

What is Shaken Baby Syndrome?
Shaken baby syndrome is a type of inflicted traumatic brain injury that happens when a baby is violently shaken. A baby has weak neck muscles and a large, heavy head. Shaking makes the fragile brain bounce back and forth inside the skull and causes bruising, swelling, and bleeding, which can lead to permanent, severe brain damage or death. The characteristic injuries of shaken baby syndrome are subdural hemorrhages (bleeding in the brain), retinal hemorrhages (bleeding in the retina), damage to the spinal cord and neck, and fractures of the ribs and bones. These injuries may not be immediately noticeable. Symptoms of shaken baby syndrome include extreme irritability, lethargy, poor feeding, breathing problems, convulsions, vomiting, and pale or bluish skin. Shaken baby injuries usually occur in children younger than 2 years old, but may be seen in children up to the age of 5.

http://www.ninds.nih.gov/disorders/shakenbaby/shakenbaby.htm

Combine that with the Turners syndrome and I think that could be a real possibility of what happened to Haleigh.

Dr. Fessel I think that you make some excellent points!

re: Turners Syndrome~
snipped from the turner-syndrome website~

Many girls with Turner's have specific learning disabilities caused by their condition. A nonverbal learning disability, for example, may cause difficulties with math but can mean special abilities in writing and vocabulary development.

The same NLD may make it hard for you to read body language, learn visual cues from teachers, and adapt to new situations
http://www.turner-syndrome.com/articles/challenges-of-turner-syndrome/index.php

This is important imho and was discussed early on, because HaLeigh would most likely not be able to 'read' someone correctly if they were angry or upset and that may very likely make her much more prone to physical abuse because of it. Although all children may push parents to their limits at times, she wouldn't 'know' that she was. Very dangerous for her under the right set of circumstances.

re: Shaken Baby Syndrome or simply being hit or tossed~

From my own experience, I have mentioned before that my oldest son died of SIDS 1 week shy of 11 mths. old. Without writing a small book on the subject, let me just say that my ex and I both worked 2nd shift at the time and an older grandmotherly woman watched him. When we picked him up after work that night, she told us that he had been very fussy, wouldn't eat, etc. and that since she cared for her disabled husband at the time too, that is was just more than she could handle and would not be able to care for him anymore. Long story short, to this day I wonder if maybe she was aggravated that night and did shake him, but I will never know because the hospital did not have funds for an autopsy and we had no money, so being distraught at the time and not having any reason to think otherwise, we took the ER Drs at their word. Keep in mind that this was in 1974, so much is different now. But IF that were the case there would have been no signs, no blood, no outward signs of abuse. Although when one passes there are bodily fluids, which really make me question Misty's 'peed the blanket' story. I wonder if HaLeigh was in the habit of wetting the bed and if LE found evidence of that happening. I also wonder if they did and if something happened to HaLeigh in the MH that night and was immediately wrapped in a 'blanket' if LE would be able to tell if the urine was from an alive child or not. I don't guess it would matter though if they did not have the blanket though would it? It's mo that something like the blanket could very well be all the evidence that was ever in the MH and without that.....

 

[Flossie JMO]

I am still trying to understand why we are expected to believe this 3 day binder BS story. PCSO has not confirmed these events as facts have they? They have not connected any of the individuals that where drug out into the spot light by Cobra, Kim and AH ( Nay Nay, WBG) to the abduction of HaLeigh yet have they? Misty did make a statement as she was being followed in the airport that "that weekend was a lie". Why should we take everyone word on all that has been revealed by anyone other than PCSO?

ITA, I have raised that point, we don't know what happened on the weekend she was away.

 

[Pondering Mind]

(snip) Yes many self-serving statements by MC. And if she'd not gotten enough rest over previous three days to sufficiently sleep off her long weekend, I can easily see her being beyond frustrated, or this itself being the catalyst or trigger causing a flaring of Misty's now confirmed short temper.

arrot:

See, I even find the 'lack of sleep' thing odd. Misty herself has said (if she is to be believed :banghead that after taking HaLeigh to school that she and Ron (don't know if Jr was there) went back to sleep until almost time for Ron to go to work. THEN, when Ron (as they report anyway) went to pick HaLeigh up from the bus stop, Jr was napping AGAIN, so Misty stayed at home with him. Even if she did party hardy, according to her anyway, she had slept. IDK, each story she tells contradicts the next but that still raises NO red flag with some. :waitasec:

 

[Skully]

Dr. Fessel I think that you make some excellent points!

re: Turners Syndrome~
snipped from the turner-syndrome website~

Many girls with Turner's have specific learning disabilities caused by their condition. A nonverbal learning disability, for example, may cause difficulties with math but can mean special abilities in writing and vocabulary development.

The same NLD may make it hard for you to read body language, learn visual cues from teachers, and adapt to new situations
http://www.turner-syndrome.com/articles/challenges-of-turner-syndrome/index.php

This is important imho and was discussed early on, because HaLeigh would most likely not be able to 'read' someone correctly if that were angry or upset and may very likely make her much more prone to physical abuse because of it. Although all children may push parents to their limits at times, she wouldn't 'know' that she was. Very dangerous for her under the right set of circumstances.

re: Shaken Baby Syndrome or simply being hit or tossed~

From my own experience, I have mentioned before that my oldest son died of SIDS 1 week shy of 11 mths. old. Without writing a small book on the subject, let me just say that my ex and I both worked 2nd shift at the time and an older grandmotherly woman watched him. When we picked him up after work that night, she told us that he had been very fussy, wouldn't eat, etc. and that since she cared for her disabled husband at the time too, that is was just more than she could handle and would not be able to care for him anymore. Long story short, to this day I wonder if maybe she was aggravated that night and did shake him, but I will never know because the hospital did not have funds for an autopsy and we had no money, so being distraught at the time and not having any reason to think otherwise, we took the ER Drs at their word. Keep in mind that this was in 1974, so much is different now. But IF that were the case there would have been no signs, no blood, no outward signs of abuse. Although when one passes there are bodily fluids, which really make me question Misty's 'peed the blanket' story. I wonder if HaLeigh was in the habit of wetting the bed and if LE found evidence of that happening. I also wonder if they did and if something happened to HaLeigh in the MH that night and was immediately wrapped in a 'blanket' if LE would be able to tell if the urine was from an alive child or not. I don't guess it would matter though if they did not have the blanket though would it? It's mo that something like the blanket could very well be all the evidence that was ever in the MH and without that.....

I am so sorry for your loss, I can't even imagine what you and your hubby went though. So many of us here write our theories or opinions from our persona experiences and I am so glad that you shared that with us.

I think Haleigh died and she wet the blanket and that is why Misty talks about washing them so much. She doesn't go into detail about other things as she does about the blankets. Like I said before, if there were a blanket missing or sheets LE wouldn't know unless someone pointed it out to them. I will always think the MH was staged to make us believe she was taken, but I don't know who helped her or who else was involved. Many of the things Ron said or didn't say, or did or didn't do has made him a target. I would want at least my employer or an employee to come forward and say they saw him or confirm his hours or his duties that night. Even that would be a help.

 

[kamky]

Dr. Fessel I think that you make some excellent points!
~SNIP~
re: Shaken Baby Syndrome or simply being hit or tossed~

From my own experience, I have mentioned before that my oldest son died of SIDS 1 week shy of 11 mths. old. Without writing a small book on the subject, let me just say that my ex and I both worked 2nd shift at the time and an older grandmotherly woman watched him. When we picked him up after work that night, she told us that he had been very fussy, wouldn't eat, etc. and that since she cared for her disabled husband at the time too, that is was just more than she could handle and would not be able to care for him anymore. Long story short, to this day I wonder if maybe she was aggravated that night and did shake him, but I will never know because the hospital did not have funds for an autopsy and we had no money, so being distraught at the time and not having any reason to think otherwise, we took the ER Drs at their word. Keep in mind that this was in 1974, so much is different now. But IF that were the case there would have been no signs, no blood, no outward signs of abuse. Although when one passes there are bodily fluids, which really make me question Misty's 'peed the blanket' story. I wonder if HaLeigh was in the habit of wetting the bed and if LE found evidence of that happening. I also wonder if they did and if something happened to HaLeigh in the MH that night and was immediately wrapped in a 'blanket' if LE would be able to tell if the urine was from an alive child or not. I don't guess it would matter though if they did not have the blanket though would it? It's mo that something like the blanket could very well be all the evidence that was ever in the MH and without that.....

I'm so sorry, Pondering. I know this is a devastating experience. It happened to my husband's first child (in his first marriage) and this child has never been forgotten. They had similar suspicions of a caregiver and it was also many years ago.

We really don't know if LE ever recovered this blanket, though, do we? They haven't said.

 

[kamky]

See, I even find the 'lack of sleep' thing odd. Misty herself has said (if she is to be believed :banghead that after taking HaLeigh to school that she and Ron (don't know if Jr was there) went back to sleep until almost time for Ron to go to work. THEN, when Ron (as they report anyway) went to pick HaLeigh up from the bus stop, Jr was napping AGAIN, so Misty stayed at home with him. Even if she did party hardy, according to her anyway, she had slept. IDK, each story she tells contradicts the next but that still raises NO red flag with some. :waitasec:

She is defintely changing and contradicting her own story. I think that soime (including me, I admit it!) gave her the benefit of the doubt for some time because she was young, uneducated, likely confused, possibly drug-addled, etc., etc. I think that I personally am getting much more skeptical of Misty over time, based on her continuing behavior. (you may be glad to know!)