Titanic tourist sub goes missing in Atlantic Ocean, June 2023 #2

[Helechawagirl]

Sadly, I don’t believe there is any way to rescue them. Open the submersible and instant death; raise too quickly and the bends will get you. The bangs seemed intentional to me. The only thing I can imagine is if there was a vehicle large enough to enclose the craft where it could then be safely opened and then slowly ascend. I fear this is a recovery operation at this point.

 

[cuffem]

Sadly, I don’t believe there is any way to rescue them. Open the submersible and instant death; raise too quickly and the bends will get you. The bangs seemed intentional to me. The only thing I can imagine is if there was a vehicle large enough to enclose the craft where it could then be safely opened and then slowly ascend. I fear this is a recovery operation at this point.

Agreed, even if they reach them there is little chance to bring up Titan and no chance of extraction. IMO.

 

[LadyL]

I agree with this, it's been discovered, filmed and documented that should be the end of it, imo. Does everyone just have the right to visit and tour it? I just don't agree with that.

I am sure there are attorney's now lining up with OceanGate in their crosshairs, regardless of any disclaimers. What about the minor that went? That seems terribly risky. I am also considering the great expense this is costing the rescue companies and risk to the searchers. Who will foot that bill? I foresee some deep investigations into these high risk adventures. JMO

he's 19 - not a minor

 

[PrairieWind]

Sadly, I don’t believe there is any way to rescue them. Open the submersible and instant death; raise too quickly and the bends will get you. The bangs seemed intentional to me. The only thing I can imagine is if there was a vehicle large enough to enclose the craft where it could then be safely opened and then slowly ascend. I fear this is a recovery operation at this point.

To a large degree I agree. Even if the bangs are them, there really is just no way to rescue them. I hope I am wrong. Whatever went wrong happened on the way down, not already on the bottom. So I don't think they are "hung up" on something.

 

[Rolypolyoly]

You follow your dad’s lead at that age. I know I would have.

I would have run in the opposite direction just to be contrary at that age, but I would have 100% trusted my Dad's judgement on my safety. I think I would also have felt a sense of security knowing the CEO was coming too.

Still wouldn't have got me in that tin can though, not a chance, even on dry land, nope.

 

[Cedars]

https://twitter.com/x/status/1671596083770712084

"Arthur Loibl, who was a passenger on the Titan submersible in 2021, says that at the time he was confident of its safety, but he has revised this view in light of recent events.".

Just like the Titanic, IMO, overconfidence in new technology.

 

[wary]

Are French Navy taught morse code? US Navy sailors are not.

What are the odds that one of the five knows the code for SOS, at least? I do, without ever having studied it.

 

[10ofRods]

Right = a hatch.
Separate from the -Bolted- seal on this thing. An inside hatch. So if you surfaced.. you could open a sky light, get some air.
Just sayin . God speed ! IMO

No openable hatch could have withstood the pressure at 2.5km under water. At least, that's what was said about why they did that.

When I saw them screwing in those bolts, I was shocked and had to read more about it. But everywhere I read, the answer is the same: only way to keep the thing from imploding. Same type of bolt that was used to screw the big viewing port to the front of the vessel.

@Warwick7 and others have also pointed out that the seams in the various parts of the Titan were vulnerable (and not subject to the dynamic stress sensors that Rush had invented for the carbon fiber portion). So seams in general are (I guess) bad and the hatch was vulnerable, needed bolts.

IMO.

 

[Arkay]

Of course I hope for a successful outcome.

I know the Coast Guard Chief said it is still absolutely a search and rescue mission and not a recovery.

Still, I can’t help wondering what happens if they aren’t found tomorrow by the time the oxygen has definitively expired.

Naturally families would want the bodies recovered, but is that wise? I think there’s quite a danger for rescuers and the costs of this are enormous for taxpayers.

Or am I being ghoulish?

 

[10ofRods]

To a large degree I agree. Even if the bangs are them, there really is just no way to rescue them. I hope I am wrong. Whatever went wrong happened on the way down, not already on the bottom. So I don't think they are "hung up" on something.

They could have surfaced, though. Supposedly, there's some kind of "dead man" mechanism that causes the submersible to jettison weight and start back up should the vessel become unresponsive.

That being said, it's not being talked about much at these press conferences. And its existence has been asserted here on WS (and on other forums) but I don't see any official confirmation that such a thing exists. It should exist, certainly (since there's no way for them to get back up without dumping weight - and they sure didn't do it manually).

If someone had to be alive to flick a switch to come back up, though, that's a complication. Supposedly, submersibles have this kind of failsafe - but it's hard to say with this one.

IMO. You are absolutely right that they were almost on the bottom at the 1:45 mark (but if that distress ping came at 2:00 hours in, it's possible they were at or near bottom and did strike a hill or part of the wreckage - esp. if they had lost power in that interval). I assume the lights worked off the same power as everything else.

I think you are probably right and I'm just cycling through my final phase of optimism here.

 

[PrairieWind]

OceanGate claimed there were 7 ways to surface in an emergency. I think it was posted in the 1st thread. One was a deadman, or automatic release of weight after a certain time period, by the use of rope (bonds) that would somehow dissolve in a fixed amount of time. Another was the release of the submersible's legs. See: Seven ways missing Titanic crew could bring vessel to surface - as hope fades

This is what leads me to believe that there really isn't anything left to surface. If it imploded on the way down, small debris would have floated to the surface, but tiny pieces would not likely be seen.

 

[wary]

Very poor taste. Manners and kindness still count for something. I’m still probably gonna watch it though.

I’ll read Thomas Hardy’s The Convergence of the Twain, instead.

“Dim moon-eyed fishes near
Gaze at the gilded gear
And query: "What does this vaingloriousness down here?" ...”

 

[CrimeDawg123]

Of course I hope for a successful outcome.

I know the Coast Guard Chief said it is still absolutely a search and rescue mission and not a recovery.

Still, I can’t help wondering what happens if they aren’t found tomorrow by the time the oxygen has definitively expired.

Naturally families would want the bodies recovered, but is that wise? I think there’s quite a danger for rescuers and the costs of this are enormous for taxpayers.

Or am I being ghoulish?

I've wondered the same thing.

 

[wnk]

Military submarines don't go anywhere near these depths. Did Alvin, the submersible that Robert Ballard used to first look at Titanic, have a hatch that could be opened from inside?

The Alvin has a plug hatch (what's used on spacecraft), which keeps it from being opened while underwater due to the water pressure pushing inward but allows it to open when pressure on both sides of the door is the same (such as when it's at the surface)

 

[mickey2942]

It's a floating coffin.

$1,250,000 for an excursion, no food, no bathrooms, no cell service.

Not my idea of something to do...just saying.

 

[MassGuy]

I would have run in the opposite direction just to be contrary at that age, but I would have 100% trusted my Dad's judgement on my safety. I think I would also have felt a sense of security knowing the CEO was coming too.

Still wouldn't have got me in that tin can though, not a chance, even on dry land, nope.

Couldn’t agree more.

 

[cuffem]

They claim research.
With Robert Ballard research on using unmanned submersibles and high def cameras there is no need to make the trip nor bring up artifacts. Anyone can observe these items on camera from anywhere. Just as we can view Mars.

No link but I am a Ballard fan and read his books.

If anyone is interested you can see Nat Geo shows, videos and books with great photos of Ballards discoveries of the Bismarck, Ships from Guadalcanal (WW2), Kennedy's PT 109 boat and USS Yorktown.

Beautiful and haunting photos and history without exploitation. imo.

 

[gitana1]

This is what leads me to believe that there really isn't anything left to surface. If it imploded on the way down, small debris would have floated to the surface, but tiny pieces would not likely be seen.

Yes. Exactly.

 

[Montecore1]

Are French Navy taught morse code? US Navy sailors are not.

Actually the US Navy is taught Morse Code. See highlighted section in the link below...

Morse code: A staple in the Navy IW toolkit

The cryptologic technician (collection) (CTR) student cohort in the first revised Basic Manual Morse Trainer (BMMT) course wrapped up, Jan. 28, at the Center for Information Dominance (CID) Unit Corry Station.

www.dvidshub.net

 

[10ofRods]

What I don't 'get' is WHY there is no emergency way to open this submersible from the INSIDE if necessary! (of course, I mean from the ocean surface if they get there). I haven't seen any explanation of that yet. It seems like an essential thing to do!

It's been explained here several times (and I probably just posted about it).

Official explanation (I can find a citation if you want but it's in the youtube where they cover the screwing on of the hatch).

An unbolted hatch would not withstand the pressure of the water at 4000M below sea level. According to Rush.

There's a partial explanation here:

Playstation controller and acoustic messaging: How the missing Titanic tourist sub works

The submersible reported missing miles off the coast of Cape Cod was an unorthodox vessel with a relatively unproven history, according to company materials and experts.

abcnews.go.com

I personally think this was another piece of safety theater and not at all the only possible way of solving the engineering problem - but I suppose it's also easier and cheaper and maybe allows a tiny bit more space inside.

Apparently, the increased depth of this dive (well beyond where most occupied submersibles go) meant that the hatch had to be secured in this manner.

Sub passengers 'will suffocate even if they surface due to hatch design'

Experts say the sub would need to be found by rescuers before the vessel's oxygen supply runs out because the five passengers would not be able to open its hatch from inside.

www.express.co.uk