TN - Holly Bobo, 20, Darden, believed abducted 13 April 2011 - #30

[Mr. Noatak]

Hi birpu,
I think we can both agree with the good Inspector Clouseau! I had a question for you all ready to send and I took a moment to read the latest posts and magically you had answered it. Could you use that clairvoyant gift of yours to solve this for us? Smooth Operator recognized immediately how your fresh eyes would contribute to this thread. I have a long way to go but thanks to you I am confident I can eventually catch up. :bud:

I do have a question....do you think James heard a scream coming from the Bobo's at 7:40 that morning?


MOO

My Opinions only, no facts here:

I covered this question a short while ago. I think that this particular time may be OK, because the witness had to hear the scream while leaving for work AND relay the info to his mother. Under those cirumstances, this might be one of the most accurate parts of the timeline.

 

[Mr. Noatak]

N/T I agree with you about the rose colored glasses, and also about Clint's story. My point about the video of the TBI/Sheriff's news conference is this...why go to so much trouble to DEMOSTRATE the method of the "dragging" of Holly if Clint Bobo had not explicitely made statements to that effect. Now Clint says there was no dragging...it can only be that Clint's story has changed. I say that because LE or anyone might make a mistake in saying "Lead" vs "Dragged" but not in specifically demostrating the technique of the interaction unless that was the statement that was made. You are right, if its not the truth, its a lie.

That leaves what really happened...hows this...Clint has someone in the house with him that the family doesn't know about...call it a "friend". CB and this friend get to horsing around with Holly while she is trying to leave for school. Something bad happens, and one thing leads to another..they come up with a story and "friend" leaves with Holly and Clint stays behind to cover up the story...

My opinions only, no facts here:

It is important to stick to the 20 minute window, between the scream and the first police car arriving. That is the amount of time available to remove Holly from the scene. Until we have additional info, the theory should conform to that timeline. I say this with all due respect, as I am limited to news reports only.

 

[Dewey2Me1MoThyme]

What i don't get, James hears a scream, aparently he thought it was a scream as in panic / threat or he would not have called his mother. Clint sees his sister dragged/ pulled / lead into the woods and waits for a call from his mother. Are the men cowards or mommas' boys in that neck of the woods. Not one male took action other than by phone? Makes no sense to me.

 

[MizStery]

My Opinions only, no facts here:

I covered this question a short while ago. I think that this particular time may be OK, because the witness had to hear the scream while leaving for work AND relay the info to his mother. Under those cirumstances, this might be one of the most accurate parts of the timeline.

Thank-you for your confirmation. I just keep reading and refining over the same parts I think are rock solid. I just keep going over and over them....wondering if there is something I missed. I appreciate your opinion. I am careful to try and identify in my mind which events are lifted from the morning of Holly's abduction and which have been revised. I also agree with other posters that CB is either afraid or being used. I really feel sorry for him. In a way CB is a victim too. I will be shocked if I am proved otherwise about him. MOO

 

[birpu]

I think grief is an SOB. It brings up feelings you never even knew existed. Put that in front of a camera…

It’s very difficult to judge people on emotion alone. Throw in some facts (if you can find them)… then let’s talk.

Let me rephrase my statement a bit. Of course their grief is real, whatever happened. The question is, is it a result of knowing Holly is missing, or knowing Holly is dead? I think the two might look different.

 

[birpu]

Hi birpu,
I think we can both agree with the good Inspector Clouseau! I had a question for you all ready to send and I took a moment to read the latest posts and magically you had answered it. Could you use that clairvoyant gift of yours to solve this for us? Smooth Operator recognized immediately how your fresh eyes would contribute to this thread. I have a long way to go but thanks to you I am confident I can eventually catch up. :bud:

I do have a question....do you think James heard a scream coming from the Bobo's at 7:40 that morning?


MOO

I agree with Mr. Noatek that this is one of the more verifiable bits of information we have. We still don't know with certainty who screamed, however.

 

[Mr. Noatak]

My opinions only, no facts here:

In the Jamison family (Oklahoma), McStay family (California) and the Maura Murray cases, it was relatively straightforward to develop hypotheses and identify suspects and/or victim locations and sensible investigative strategies. In these three cases almost all of the evidence was laid upon the table by the investigators. But in the Holly Bobo case I have only been privy to indirect "evidence" and rumors. I am ashamed to admit the huge amounts of effort I have put into this seemingly-secretive Holly Bobo case, without knowing a smit of what the authorities know. I have looked at just about everyone involved and uninvolved, including names and addresses not known to Websleuths. But without complementary factual info from the investigators working the Holly Bobo case, I am hog-tied.

Having said this, I want to point out that in the 80's I miserably failed in my analysis of the Green River Killer (before the internet). I predicted that he was unmarried and living with his mother AND failed to recognize that he liked to revisit the victims that he had previously dumped by the road. I do not intend to make similarly egregious mistakes and have had a pretty solid record since those early days. But I need at least a few crumbs of official evidence in the Holly Bobo case to figure it out. OK, whining completed.

 

[birpu]

My opinions only, no facts here:

In the Jamison family (Oklahoma), McStay family (California) and the Maura Murray cases, it was relatively straightforward to develop hypotheses and identify suspects and/or victim locations and sensible investigative strategies. In these three cases almost all of the evidence was laid upon the table by the investigators. But in the Holly Bobo case I have only been privy to indirect "evidence" and rumors. I am ashamed to admit the huge amounts of effort I have put into this seemingly-secretive Holly Bobo case, without knowing a smit of what the authorities know. I have looked at just about everyone involved and uninvolved, including names and addresses not known to Websleuths. But without complementary factual info from the investigators working the Holly Bobo case, I am hog-tied.

Having said this, I want to point out that in the 80's I miserably failed in my analysis of the Green River Killer (before the internet). I predicted that he was unmarried and living with his mother AND failed to recognize that he liked to revisit the victims that he had previously dumped by the road. I do not intend to make similarly egregious mistakes and have had a pretty solid record since those early days. But I need at least a few crumbs of official evidence in the Holly Bobo case to figure it out. OK, whining completed.

Mr. Noatek,

Really glad you are back on this thread after your absence for a bit. I imagine you to be ensconced in a leather chair in your library at home, having a spot of bletted medlar on toast, with an aged port, grumbling about the noisy neighborhood children (who are somewhat afraid of you), though you secretly put a brand new soccer ball in their yard as you walked your corgi late the previous evening. Please don't shatter my illusions.

Way back when you entered this thread or not long thereafter, you said at one point you could solve this case if you had - was it the answers to three things...? I can't find that post. One of them was who took a lie detector test and what the results were. Or, who did NOT take a test. I can't remember - I was very curious at the time to hear what those three points would reveal. But you never said. Do those three things still stand as being critical to solving this case for you? And what were they, since I can't remember?

 

[~n/t~]

We need a statement from TBI NOW. This is ridiculous. Is anything being done to find the truth? Is anyone still searching? Are they just sitting and waiting for leads and tips to come in? Why haven't they cleared anyone? :banghead:

 

[~n/t~]

I would have to assume TBI has asked the family to provide a list of people who may have wanted to harm Holly or the family? If so, were they checked out? After 6 months they still haven't cleared anyone? WTH?

 

[Seaturtle]

We need a statement from TBI NOW. This is ridiculous. Is anything being done to find the truth? Is anyone still searching? Are they just sitting and waiting for leads and tips to come in? Why haven't they cleared anyone? :banghead:

I share your frustration. Mine got even worse over the past few days while I have been trying to research other things about the Parsons/Darden area. Early on I completely discounted the theories about "powerful" people and secrecy in the community - but the past few days have started to change my mind. Trying to learn about previous deaths, missing persons and crime in that area is like going back in time 50 years. It could just be that the area is far enough away from major media markets that finding anything in print or via the web is unlikely but there are brick walls and dead ends at every turn.

My personal opinion is that the community wants this case to "go away". The reasoning behind it could many different things related to the unwanted spotlight or attention. All I can say is that cursory research into criminal activities and deaths/disappearances of young people in that area raises enough red flags to make me want to dig even deeper. :waitasec:

 

[TxLady2]

I think grief is an SOB. It brings up feelings you never even knew existed. Put that in front of a camera…

It’s very difficult to judge people on emotion alone. Throw in some facts (if you can find them)… then let’s talk.

Totally agree!! I also think people see what they want to see. If you look hard enough for something "odd" in someone's demeanor, you're no doubt going to find it. What one person finds strange may be normal to someone else.
FAIK, there hasn't been a rule book written on how NOT to act when you have a loved one missing and the cameras are up close and personal.

 

[Carla Lashelle]

I see no evidence that "the community" wants this to "go away". Continuing community support is one of the things that makes me believe the Bobo's story.

 

[Oriah]

I see no evidence that "the community" wants this to "go away". Continuing community support is one of the things that makes me believe the Bobo's story.

Couldn't agree with this post more, Carla. Thank you.

The constant negative approach taken on WS's toward Holly's family and community have- for the first time- made me not very proud of the WS community.

Everyone is, of course, entitled to their opinion.

Mine is that none of this family/community bashing is helpful in finding Holly.

 

[Oriah]

Totally agree!! I also think people see what they want to see. If you look hard enough for something "odd" in someone's demeanor, you're no doubt going to find it. What one person finds strange may be normal to someone else.
FAIK, there hasn't been a rule book written on how NOT to act when you have a loved one missing and the cameras are up close and personal.

ITA, TxLady.

I come from a very diverse family.

If I was abducted by a stranger tomorrow, I guarantee:
At least one of my sibs would come across as 'simple' (and therefore guilty.)
One would come across as arrogant and defensive (and therefore guilty).
One would come across as extremely intelligent and sweet (and therefore guilty.)
Several of my closest friends would come across as 'hicks' because no one would be able to understand their dialect (and therefore guilty.)
And several of my other closest friends would come across as rich, snooty, and 'connected' (and therefore guilty.)
My parents would come across as religious freaks (and therefore guilty.)
And my significant other? Well, he spent 20+ yrs in the Special Forces... (Guilty of course!)

But you know what? NONE of that would be the case. None of it.

Off rant. But had to get that off my chest.

Oh Holly, where are you? We are still searching for you. I'm on YOUR side of the fence, Holly.

 

[mountainguy777]

There is nothing wrong with questioning the family in ANY case, especially one such as this where LE has not ruled anyone out, and very easily could with one press conference. It would ne irresponcoble to not co sider family when it happened at the family home and the last eyewitness is a family member.

Notice I said nothing about "bashing". Bashing is NOT questioning.

 

[Carla Lashelle]

Couldn't agree with this post more, Carla. Thank you.

The constant negative approach taken on WS's toward Holly's family and community have- for the first time- made me not very proud of the WS community.

Everyone is, of course, entitled to their opinion.

Mine is that none of this family/community bashing is helpful in finding Holly.

I have no problem with legitimate questioning of inconsistent statements and details if they are known to come from the family themselves. In this case the family's statements have been pretty consistent. Unfortunately they have also for various reasons left out a lot of "in between" details, making it hard to figure out what really happened. Over the last 6 months little bits of info have crept out here and there.

For example, the ORIGINAL reports of what happened to Holly included Clint going out of the house with a gun. Then the gun disappeared from any account of what happened. I mentioned the initial reports that mentioned a gun here before, and people were like what??? Theres no mention of a gun. Then, guess what, the latest account from the family has Clint getting a gun and going out to look for Holly...

That kind of in and out again detail is frustrating if you are trying to figure out what did or did not happen.

In a way more of my concern is not so much with the family (who I do believe) but in law enforcement (who i have zero trust or respect for) or reporters (who I have less than zero respect for).

 

[Oriah]

There is nothing wrong with questioning the family in ANY case, especially one such as this where LE has not ruled anyone out, and very easily could with one press conference. It would ne irresponcoble to not co sider family when it happened at the family home and the last eyewitness is a family member.

Notice I said nothing about "bashing". Bashing is NOT questioning.

Nope, nothing wrong with questions or theories.

I would just like to see some evidence of motive for all of these theories circulating around the family, friends, and community of Holly Bobo.

My post was simply to point out what I know to be true in my own experience.

If I was abducted by a stranger tomorrow- my family would 'fail' miserably with the media. And most of them would 'fail' miserably with LE questioning as well.

It is the other side of the reality coin- not playing devils advocate at all, actually. Reality.

 

[Oriah]

I have no problem with legitimate questioning of inconsistent statements and details if they are known to come from the family themselves. In this case the family's statements have been pretty consistent. Unfortunately they have also for various reasons left out a lot of "in between" details, making it hard to figure out what really happened. Over the last 6 months little bits of info have crept out here and there.

For example, the ORIGINAL reports of what happened to Holly included Clint going out of the house with a gun. Then the gun disappeared from any account of what happened. I mentioned the initial reports that mentioned a gun here before, and people were like what??? Theres no mention of a gun. Then, guess what, the latest account from the family has Clint getting a gun and going out to look for Holly...

That kind of in and out again detail is frustrating if you are trying to figure out what did or did not happen.

In a way more of my concern is not so much with the family (who I do believe) but in law enforcement (who i have zero trust or respect for) or reporters (who I have less than zero respect for).

BBM:
This I understand.

Imvho, it is unbelievable how much conflicting info gets tossed around in cases like Holly's. Very frustrating. But unfortunately very common.

 

[~n/t~]

I doubt the Jackson Sun suddenly decided to put a gun in Clint's possession on that morning. I doubt the Jackson Sun suddenly decided that Drew was at grandma's property. I doubt the Jackson Sun quoted Clint verbatim that he was concerned about the crime scene being contaminated.

These are statements made by the family and not something that was just pulled out of hat by the media to make up a fairy tale story. I believe the Jackson Sun's version of what was told to them by the family.

Furthermore, I'd like to remind everyone that the family has not been ruled out. I don't see anything wrong with questioning what happened that morning. The brother's version makes no sense.

I see posters questioning Lisa Irwins parents and they haven't even been named suspects or persons of interest. In this case, we have the TBI director on camera saying nobody has been ruled from a direct question asked by a reporter of whether Clint or Drew were suspects. In addition, the latest Jackson Sun version has TBI stating that everyone is a suspect and the focus remains where Holly went missing and not any other city, State or Country or Continent.