TN - Shooting at private Christian Covenant School, Nashville, suspect dead, multiple victims, 27 Mar 2023

[Campizi67]

Police say she was being treated for an 'emotional disorder', and that her parents believed she no longer had any weapons

If this is true, I wonder what medications she was taking.. And if her interest in guns and talk of death was sparked before taking medicine or after...

.

 

[fred&edna]

 

[al66pine]

Hale's Purchases of Firearms?

If she had mental illness then she would not be permitted to purchase any weapons legally. One of the questions on the background check specifically asks that. She could have lied.

@FLmom777
Could you please provide a link w quote from the "background check" form showing the question asking if applicant has a "mental illness?"

IF Hale completed ATF Form 4473,* it did not ask applicant whether they have a 'mental illness."

This is Question 11f:
"Have you ever been adjudicated as a mental defective or have you ever been committed to a mental institution? See Instructions for Question 11.f)."

IIRC, the Nashville Police Chief or spokesperson said Hale purchased the guns legally, so presumably LE has seen the ATF forms (or equivalent).
Have any ATF Forms Hale completeddbeen publicly released (leaked)?

________________________________________________
* ATF Form 4473:

https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/b/b1/Atf_form_4473-firearms_transaction_record_5300_9revised_0.pdf

National Instant Criminal Background Check System - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

 

[Mapache]

https://twitter.com/x/status/1640403479985373186

https://twitter.com/x/status/1640403752266940416

that is very sad, may they all Rest In Peace. I wonder though, what happened to the shooter? did they get murdered? or did they commit??

 

[Deleted member 39678]

Why? What do you hope to learn by granting the shooter the platform he obviously wanted?

I have no doubt that reading the killers writings would give us some understanding on who she was.

I guess we could debate whether making these killers writings public is an incentive for future killers to do the same thing.

I can see where trying to figure out the "why" would help the public in making decisions that could prevent future tragedies. On the other side it's possible that another mentally ill person could see doing the same thing as a way to make their ideas known to the public.

Which one is the best course of action to prevent future school shootings? I'm not sure. JMO.

 

[WingsOverTX]

I have no doubt that reading the killers writings would give us some understanding on who she was.

I guess we could debate whether making these killers writings public is an incentive for future killers to do the same thing.

I can see where trying to figure out the "why" would help the public in making decisions that could prevent future tragedies. On the other side it's possible that another mentally ill person could see doing the same thing as a way to make their ideas known to the public.

Which one is the best course of action to prevent future school shootings? I'm not sure. JMO.

We live in an open society. It will be evidence should any kind of lawsuits ensue. It does no honor to the mass murderer & those fearing some kind of retaliation have many means of combatting their real or imagined fears. Plus they have an agenda & want to use this event for their own purposes IMO.

When the question is light or darkness, always err on the side of light. That's one reason the invention of the printing press was so revolutionary in human history.

My opinion only

 

[Nova]

that is very sad, may they all Rest In Peace. I wonder though, what happened to the shooter? did they get murdered? or did they commit??

Sorry, I think your question was overlooked. If I understand correctly, the murderer was shot and killed by police responding to the crime scene.

 

[YepperBepper]

Why? What do you hope to learn by granting the shooter the platform he obviously wanted?

I'd suggest the horse already left the barn. That platform was created by purposefully choosing the slaughtering of children instead of the mall (which LE says was another target) and by the MSMs use of specific identifier. There is not a soul out there who has not at least toyed with conclusions, IMHO.

Is it common not to release the manifesto? Serious question, as I only followed a few mass shootings (where they were released).

Very uncommon is the full body cam release (available on YouTube of all places) and the almost immediate release of the surveillance video.

 

[Sundog]

Rex Engelbert and Michael Collazo: Who are the Nashville officers who took down Covenant School shooter?

Who are the Nashville cops who put down an active shooter in a Christian elementary school Monday?

www.foxnews.com

More information on the two Nashville police officers and heroes who took down the shooter at Covenant School/Church.

 

[Nova]

I have no doubt that reading the killers writings would give us some understanding on who she was.

I guess we could debate whether making these killers writings public is an incentive for future killers to do the same thing.

I can see where trying to figure out the "why" would help the public in making decisions that could prevent future tragedies. On the other side it's possible that another mentally ill person could see doing the same thing as a way to make their ideas known to the public.

Which one is the best course of action to prevent future school shootings? I'm not sure. JMO.

Although nobody has supplied a direct link, several posters have made reference to studies showing that mass shootings DO inspire imitators. So we would have to conclude that publishing any statement by the murderer would be to at least risk additional violence.

Not much to debate on that score...

 

[Cool Cats]

Nashville police who took out a school shooter in minutes appeared to call out Uvalde's officers, saying 'we will never wait to make entry' to 'stop a threat'​

Nashville police who took out a school shooter in minutes appeared to call out Uvalde's officers, saying 'we will never wait to make entry' to 'stop a threat'

A retired NYPD sergeant told Insider that Nashville's "timely" release of information about the deadly mass shooting has been "textbook."

www.yahoo.com

 

[Deleted member 39678]

We live in an open society. It will be evidence should any kind of lawsuits ensue. It does no honor to the mass murderer & those fearing some kind of retaliation have many means of combatting their real or imagined fears. Plus they have an agenda & want to use this event for their own purposes IMO.

When the question is light or darkness, always err on the side of light. That's one reason the invention of the printing press was so revolutionary in human history.

My opinion only.

I question whether suppressing the public release of the killers writings in this case will really have any affect on future killers behavior.

A small insignificant affect? Or a meaningful affect? JMO.

 

[WingsOverTX]

I'd suggest the horse already left the barn. That platform was created by purposefully choosing the slaughtering of children instead of the mall (which LE says was another target) and by the MSMs use of specific identifier. There is not a soul out there who has not at least toyed with conclusions, IMHO.

Is it common not to release the manifesto? Serious question, as I only followed a few mass shootings (where they were released).

Very uncommon is the full body cam release (available on YouTube of all places) and the almost immediate release of the surveillance video.

The IMMEDIATE transparency & openness of LE is an excellent example of best practices. Would that other agencies were so adept at gathering & releasing public information. I applaud the Nashville PD.
MOO

 

[Nova]

I'd suggest the horse already left the barn. That platform was created by purposefully choosing the slaughtering of children instead of the mall (which LE says was another target) and by the MSMs use of specific identifier. There is not a soul out there who has not at least toyed with conclusions, IMHO.

Is it common not to release the manifesto? Serious question, as I only followed a few mass shootings (where they were released).

Very uncommon is the full body cam release (available on YouTube of all places) and the almost immediate release of the surveillance video.

But none of that suggests the content of any statement would actually aid public awareness.

I'm a 1st Amendment guy, myself, and generally lean toward more public exposure rather than less. But when dealing with terrorists--and that label includes mass shooters of non-combatants--where publicity IS the end goal, providing that publicity strikes me as unwise. I'd rather the MSM police themselves, but I've been waiting almost 70 years for that to happen!

 

[iamshadow21]

I question whether suppressing the public release of the killers writings in this case will really have any affect on future killers behavior.

A small insignificant affect? Or a meaningful affect? JMO.

Well, it's open source, but there are, of course links at the bottom, as always:

Mass shooting contagion - Wikipedia

 

[WingsOverTX]

But none of that suggests the content of any statement would actually aid public awareness.

I'm a 1st Amendment guy, myself, and generally lean toward more public exposure rather than less. But when dealing with terrorists--and that label includes mass shooters of non-combatants--where publicity IS the end goal, providing that publicity strikes me as unwise. I'd rather the MSM police themselves, but I've been waiting almost 70 years for that to happen!

I understand your concerns. Releasing it right now in the midst of emotional turmoil that naturally occurs after such a horrific event may not be the best course of action. Allowing a cool down period would be wise.
JMO

 

[Deleted member 39678]

Although nobody has supplied a direct link, several posters have made reference to studies showing that mass shootings DO inspire imitators. So we would have to conclude that publishing any statement by the murderer would be to at least risk additional violence.

Not much to debate on that score...

Does the act of mass shootings inspire further shootings or is the inspiration from the release of the killers writings?

Perhaps the extensive news reports of these school shootings which always have the killers name and photo is the inspiration. JMO.

 

[Sundog]

I understand your concerns. Releasing it right now in the midst of emotional turmoil that naturally occurs after such a horrific event may not be the best course of action. Allowing a cool down period would be wise.
JMO

Agree, waiting a week or two would be wise.

 

[Nova]

I understand your concerns. Releasing it right now in the midst of emotional turmoil that naturally occurs after such a horrific event may not be the best course of action. Allowing a cool down period would be wise.
JMO

That makes sense to me, Wings. I agree with your point that it probably won't be possible to keep any "manifesto" secret forever. So just hold onto it until it has to become part of public records...

Does the act of mass shootings inspire further shootings or is the inspiration from the release of the killers writings?

Perhaps the exstensive news reports of these school shootings which always have the killers name and photo is the inspiration. JMO.

Hard to say, Ranch. :irony: I'd rather we not use my grandchildren to find out. :/irony: (Not that I am blaming you or your ideas on this subject.)

 

[YepperBepper]

But none of that suggests the content of any statement would actually aid public awareness.

I'm a 1st Amendment guy, myself, and generally lean toward more public exposure rather than less. But when dealing with terrorists--and that label includes mass shooters of non-combatants--where publicity IS the end goal, providing that publicity strikes me as unwise. I'd rather the MSM police themselves, but I've been waiting almost 70 years for that to happen!

I understand. I'm having internal arguments about this all night. On one hand....I want to know the nuts and bolts. On the other ..I don't.

This person could have been angry about climate change, but the MSM, being who and what they are created the narrative before the police officers even had a chance to file their paperwork.

I think the salacious headlines already created the presumed and expected social contagion. Will the release of the motive add to it? Perhaps? But it WILL be released at some point. Does the social contagion start all over if they wait 6 months? Rhetorical and unanswerable questions, I know.

In the interim, I could read the diaries of Klebold and Harris, the manifesto of Kaczynski, the manifesto of the Walmart shooter in Virginia or that of the supermarket shooter in Buffalo. Why not this one?