trial day 45: the defense continues its case in chief #137

[Angelina Frost]

I'm glad the defense went with the pedophile thing because it reveals the total weakness of the case and I think that factor will be a major influence on the penalty that is given.

I keep trying to get in the heads of the defense attorneys and figure out what they were thinking or how they were trying to piece together this self defense claim. When they rehearsed the trial and played it out in their minds before it got started, it must have looked much different to them. I think they believed that the pedophile thing would have a strong impact and prejudice the jury against Travis. I have to believe that the defense attorneys got so locked into their client's BS that they lost perspective on how totally absurd this would come across to real people in the real world.

BBM

ITA. At best, the DT has the possibility of a 50/50 split with men and women on that jury. At worst, 11 to 1. I can't imagine anything more psychologically damaging for an innocent man to be accused of pedophilia. It's disgusting. The fact that there is nothing to support it, which the jury knows, will absolutely backfire on them. Rightfully so.

Had they left it out and just gone with a straight battered woman defense, sprinkled with a little insanity here and there, I would have worried. They could have sold that one imo. As they have laid it out repeatedly, it just makes them look more deplorable as each day goes by.

 

[Nosey Parker]

Yes, she probably learned from the books given to her by Samuels and probably her attorneys. I do think Alyce was duped.

Duped initially perhaps, but I cannot see, with her years of experience in DV, that she remained ignorant. I do believe she looked at all the conceived advantages to herself in remaining on the case, and elected to go along with the defence strategy.

 

[Sleuth5]

Alas....I only roast the turkeys....

Out here in the Northwestern wilds, we often roast our own coffee over the campfire, near to our wagons.

 

[EquallyDivided]

BBM

I heard the Ker-Ching sound repeatedly yesterday.

I hear it every time she implied anyone who grew up in an abusive home (except Arias, and perhaps a few other women) couldn't grow up and be non-abusive themselves, or have a normal intimate relationship unless they first had 'help' or an 'intervention' - 'help' or an 'intervention' of the kind ALV makes at least part of her living from.

Yet another constituency of people that Ms ALV has alienated. The Ker-Ching sound was getting more tinny and feeble as they day went on.

Ms AVL would do well to remain on the stand for as long as possible at this rate of pay. Her prospects for future earnings aren't looking too good right now.

Some would say that the help and intervention would be HIS GRANDPARENTS stepped in and raised him - and that he routinely attended church from that point, on. ALV doesn't consider being displaced to grandparents and spiritual healing as help OR intervention? Incredible. Absolutely incredible.

 

[Nezumi]

I honestly think Travis was a virgin, in that he never had vaginal sex. As I understand it, lots of young mormons seem to justify sexual behavior as long as it's not in the traditional sense of vaginal sex. Correct me if I'm wrong but that's how I see it, which would make Travis normal.

And it's an idea/behavior that's as old as religious prohibitions on human sexual activity - not exclusive to the Mormon religion. Humans are sexual by nature. Religious control of human sexuality is not - it's an artificial construct. There really is nothing new under the sun!

 

[rob]

ALV did not show one sniff of compassion or sorrow for Travis who was murdered. ALV had the nerve to apologize to JA for having to read her intimate journals etc. and yet she has no problem with TA's texts and emails put on display for the world.

During the jury questions her hatred towards Travis was so obvious it's very scary.

If I were a man who had ALV as my child custody evaluator I would have been on the phone to my lawyer and/or the court to have that changed. ALV has proven she cannot be objective.

I didn't get to hear many of the juror questions. I wish someone had asked her did she feel ANY sympathy for the victim (Travis)? Was his death justified? Do YOU FEEL it was justified?

 

[prima.facie]

It's because nobody understands domestic violence. The Defense doesn't even understand their own case. Alyce tried to explain it from the stand but it went right over everyone's head.

Twenty years ago a therapist told me men express guilt as anger. It went right over my head. I had no idea what he was talking about.

But, that's the key. That is why domestic violence escalates. The more the man leads the double life, the more guilt he feels, the more guilt he feels, the more he acts it out as anger, the more he acts it out as anger, the more guilt he feels. IT'S LIKE A SNAKE EATING ITS TAIL.

That is why Alyce said on the stand--it is ok to feel anger, but it's what you do when you feel that emotion that is the problem. And, she pointed out that Travis anger, as demonstrated in the texts, was now over the top as RAGE, and not only that, but a rage which was not quickly abating.

There's a lot going on here, and nobody seems to be getting it, including the DT.

IMO

Im assuming you are not buying Alyce's tripe and are just making hypothetical...?

However, in case not, curious...at what point in any of the evidence produced did it show Travis in RAGE ? I never saw any. I saw him angry (justifiably because he was being stalked and abused himself); however, rage? Nope. Never.

And nobody understands domestic violence? Really? I think everyone gets it, but chose to ignore the truth in this case. And I disagree with your therapist 20 years ago. I know plenty of people who live what is being described as double lives and don't have "anger" or "rage" issues......and what you are describing is most certainly NOT just associated to just men. That assessment by a therapist is just completely misleading. Every situation and person is different. Please add in women and then add in people with mental issues.

 

[Linda7NJ]

BBM

I heard the Ker-Ching sound repeatedly yesterday.

I hear it every time she implied anyone who grew up in an abusive home (except Arias, and perhaps a few other women) couldn't grow up and be non-abusive themselves, or have a normal intimate relationship unless they first had 'help' or an 'intervention' - 'help' or an 'intervention' of the kind ALV makes at least part of her living from.

Yet another constituency of people that Ms ALV has alienated. The Ker-Ching sound was getting more tinny and feeble as they day went on.

Ms AVL would do well to remain on the stand for as long as possible at this rate of pay. Her prospects for future earnings aren't looking too good right now.

Why was she unaware of Travis's grandmother and the Mormon faiths help, guidance and intervention?

Wait... Before you answer... I KNOW why


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[camcneishg]

in this news article, her former art teacher says she was "perfect"....LOL
http://www.siskiyoudaily.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20130125/NEWS/130129835

 

[Horace Finklestein]

It's clear that Alyce is one of those types who subscribes to the often repeated myth that 90% of women who kill their spouses were defending themselves. This statistic is found on many DV advocacy/awareness sites.

Anyway, here's another interesting case of an alleged female stalker killing an her ex.

http://www.nj.com/bergen/index.ssf/...double_murder_stalked_victims_for_months.html

Similar to Jodi's case in that Monica is alleged to have brought with her a gun AND a knife, using the gun on the ex and the knife on the new girlfriend. Fortunately, self-defense won't fly in this case because the girlfriend was also killed.

She seems to think all those movies she refers to are accurate depictions of reality.

 

[TigerBalm]

I get really annoyed when ALV brings up Chris and Sky Hughes.
ALV obviously cherry picked what Sky Hughes said, which was before the defendant was even officially dating Travis, to only support the defendant.

Guess she missed (or forgot) this comment from Sky.

 

[Bravo]

Is there court today?
TIA

Yes. It is my understanding Lawyers to be in Court for 9 a.m. (AZ) and Trial to begin at 9:30 AZ time. I'm assuming it "may" start on time. Fridays are dark days so early start and no cases for the Judge prior. Now whether that 1/2 hour with the Lawyers may run later. Remains to be seen. Sigh.....

 

[momof7]

It's because nobody understands domestic violence. The Defense doesn't even understand their own case. Alyce tried to explain it from the stand but it went right over everyone's head.

Twenty years ago a therapist told me men express guilt as anger. It went right over my head. I had no idea what he was talking about.

But, that's the key. That is why domestic violence escalates. The more the man leads the double life, the more guilt he feels, the more guilt he feels, the more he acts it out as anger, the more he acts it out as anger, the more guilt he feels. IT'S LIKE A SNAKE EATING ITS TAIL.

That is why Alyce said on the stand--it is ok to feel anger, but it's what you do when you feel that emotion that is the problem. And, she pointed out that Travis anger, as demonstrated in the texts, was now over the top as RAGE, and not only that, but a rage which was not quickly abating.

There's a lot going on here, and nobody seems to be getting it, including the DT.

IMO

But what exactly did he do with that rage 1000 miles away from his 'victim'. It didn't escalate? AVL stated clearly that it takes a lot to keep anger going. She went to AZ on June 3rd/4th. About 6 days later.

It seems that some of the point being missed is that it is possible that the argument or confrontation in AZ resulted in JA's rage that escalated to an obvious murder or overkill. Two weapons? 27 stab wounds, slit throat and a gun shot. There was rage alright. But, I am not buying the victim was the one with the rage at that point.

K

 

[Kensie]

Back to work WS peeps !!! Keep up the good posts.

 

[Truth Detector]

'Tis a brisk sunny morn! :seeya: Ursa appears to have found greener pastures, so I must be content with watching the deer and zombie turkeys whilst enjoying a fine Kona blend...

Ah, but you've not tried my own fresh-roasted:

 

[kayice]

I believe it was July 2010

I think this is why the jury is questioning ALV when she talked to Jodi, asking for dates. Some juror is on the case about Jodi's cons.
There were 2 questions like this?

 

[kscornfed]

NO WAY, sorry not yelling at you but when JA tried to plea M2 the document stated that if it weren't excepted that they would drag not just Travis but his family, friends and many others through the mud. She is a manipulator and now has a team to help her. Not to mention endless amounts of state tax dollars to trash Travis. His family knew this and still wanted Juan to proceed.:furious:

exactly. and WHY does anyone think the state should have cut a deal with JA? i don't get it. this woman is a murderer and we have the right to prosecute and punish her as such for the good of society.

and to the OP's opinion that the state FORCED the defense to do what they're doing, that's also not true. you know what they could've done instead?

the KILLER could have said she'd accept LWOP and pleaded guilty---that's the only deal i think the state would've taken.

she's been trying to get away with murder since day one. she butchered this poor guy and she knows it, and she's been lying ever since to weasel out of paying for it.

 

[websurfer]

So far the Jury Q?'s are kinda iffy...pro and con Ja....

 

[Lorelilly]

What is this Urban Dictionary that everyone is talking about??

Google it and Enter at your own risk....:blushing:

 

[Kensie]

But what exactly did he do with that rage 1000 miles away from his 'victim'. It didn't escalate? AVL stated clearly that it takes a lot to keep anger going. She went to AZ on June 3rd/4th. About 6 days later.

It seems that some of the point being missed is that it is possible that the argument or confrontation in AZ resulted in JA's rage that escalated to an obvious murder or overkill. Two weapons? 27 stab wounds, slit throat and a gun shot. There was rage alright. But, I am not buying the victim was the one with the rage at that point.

K

I agree 100 percent. None of this self defense makes any sense. We all know who had the rage - the one that slaughtered the other person.