Trial Discussion Thread #27 - 14.04.16, Day 24

[Murphys_Law]

The evidence as submitted, was one of the most unprofessional, unscientific, and calculated deceptions I have seen in court (and outside of court for that matter).

• There was total disregard for replicating the actual environmental, physical conditions, attenuating factors in both designing and conducting the experiment.
  
  
• The team submitted a totally undocumented piece of evidence/results of an experiment to the court.
  
  
• The expert witness never offering, only admitting to data manipulation of the sound sequences after intense prosecutorial questioning

This goes WAY beyond misleading the court.
I wonder if the defence team can be charged with deliberately trying to deceive the court.

 

[Viper]

One word comes to mind again in picking this witness, that some of us said was in effect since the BH Affidavit was seen:

DESPERATION

BIB Agreed!

You know folks I was expecting OP's ballistics expert to do this - tailor his expert opinion to match what OP's fairy tale needs, and do that just for the money that he is being paid. But I honestly did not see this coming with Dixon. Oh well, live and learn...

The timing of all of the recent "testing" and work by these "experts" coincides directly with the sale of OPs murder home. Ah, probably just a coincidence.

 

[zwiebel]

Journo Debora Patta wants to know if she can get a job as a defence ballistic expert because she fired a gun once......

https://mobile.twitter.com/Debora_Patta

 

[Freya1977]

Unless they slept through the real gunshots and woke up to [Oscar] screaming, followed by the bat strikes.

You're blindly believing OP's "version"

 

[Really?]

What a monster.....and mocking her pleas for help......sick.....twisted OP.

 

[james83]

LOL. Well, no, because the two sets of 'gunshots' were separated by ten to fifteen minutes.

But some of the witnesses did say they heard screaming throughout the 'gunshots,' with last scream after last 'gunshot.' Those witnesses were hearing Oscar scream as he tried to break open the door with the bat.

Remember one witness thought a woman was watching her husband being shot. She heard a woman scream throughout the 'gunshots.' And, we know that probably wasn't possible for Reeva to scream throughout the real gunshots and definitely not afterwards.

You are mixing your own theory with the facts im afraid.

 

[Insp.Dots]

As long as he doesn't suggest the smell of 'Mr Sheen' is part of his theory, he should just about make it through.

Well......I think it safe to say Dixon has done nothing to enhance the credibility of the defence's version of events. It has made me think though.

Firstly I thought when asked by Masipa the other day Nel said the door in court was a Replica?

Can anyone confirm this. I also cannot understand how if it is the actual door why cleaners would be allowed to touch it at all?

Surely it should be treated as evidence until the Court case and any subsequent appeals have been exhausted?
Hoping Minor 4th or one of the attorney's can explain this please.

 

[molly333]

I put it to you that the actual gunshots may well have been the second set of sounds, and the screaming WAS Reeva. OP's ex girlfriend says he does NOT "scream like a woman"

Then what was the first set of 'gunshots' the Stipps heard?

It can't be the bat. The bat comes after the gunshots according to both sides.

 

[DebinGA]

Do all pistol bullets sound alike when fired? If not, how can a sound test using other than black talon bullets be valid?

 

[soozieqtips]

LOL. Well, no, because the two sets of 'gunshots' were separated by ten to fifteen minutes.

But some of the witnesses did say they heard screaming throughout the 'gunshots,' with last scream after last 'gunshot.' Those witnesses were hearing Oscar scream as he tried to break open the door with the bat.

Remember one witness thought a woman was watching her husband being shot. She heard a woman scream throughout the 'gunshots.'
And, we know that probably wasn't possible for Reeva to scream throughout the real gunshots and definitely not afterwards.

BBM - that's not true. Did you listen to Dr Saayman's testimony where he said after the first shot to Reeva's hip, it would have been natural to scream, that it would have been an involuntary reaction to being shot in the hip? By the way, Roux promised he would absolutely prove that the shot to the head was first, making it impossible for Reeva to have screamed. We're still waiting for him to come true on that promise.

Where did you hear that it 'probably wasn't possible' for Reeva to scream through the gunshots?

 

[Freya1977]

What a monster.....and mocking her pleas for help......sick.....twisted OP.

That's what I was thinking. She's screaming help and he's yelling back at here "oh help, help, help" in a sarcastic manner

 

[sweetcaro]

I cannot get a stream to work, help! Please let me know what is working for you.

 

[molly333]

You are mixing your own theory with the facts im afraid.

How so? It's not 'my theory.' It's the witness testimony.

Only two witnesses heard two sets of 'gunshots'--the Stipps.

With screaming in between.

 

[shane13]

Do all pistol bullets sound alike when fired? If not, how can a sound test using other than black talon bullets be valid?

No, they would certainly sound differently.
But I thought he said they got hold of some black talons.

 

[kittychi]

IIRC one of the last questions Nel asked OP was why he used black talon bullets, and OP said they are what's used "with my firearm". But didn't Dixon say black talons weren't used for the gun sound test because the DT couldn't get them? Either they're very hard to get or they make a greater than average sound.

IIRC, they don't make them anymore.

 

[Forensics]

Why would the conditions change how one sounds relative to the other?

If they are both under the same changed conditions, then they would still sound the same relative to each other.

The only time you would have a problem is if the gunshots are heard under one set of conditions and the bat strike under another.

But that is not the case--it was same set of conditions for both, 10 to 15 minutes apart.

Did you listen to the video? They sound very much alike to the point where you probably couldn't tell them apart, given a 10 minute break between the two sets of sounds.

In this instance, they were recorded at separate sessions on different days which brings into question the recording conditions on each occasion. A more professional approach would be to record them both at the same session, with details given as to any post production work on the two sets of sounds.

 

[Gbtaketwo]

Yep! That's exactly right

I can't give you evidence of this but I have often had a feeling that the hip shot was during the first set of bangs and that the second set were to finish her off .
Outlandish opinion I know but I do just see this as possible
Maybe the blood on the floor disproves this because there should have been more blood unless of course she first fell partly on to the toilet (some blood could have gone down inside the pan and then slipped off after the ricocheted shot to avoid being hit again . I know it doesn't totally add up but neither does OP's version
J MOO

 

[shane13]

I cannot get a stream to work, help! Please let me know what is working for you.

They are on lunch break for 10 more minutes.

 

[Mr Fossil]

Then what was the first set of 'gunshots' the Stipps heard?

It can't be the bat. The bat comes after the gunshots according to both sides.

Does it? I must have missed the bit where the Prosecution accepted this. I recall hearing Nel say early on that the State's case was that the gun shots were at 3:17. Has this changed?

 

[Insp.Dots]

Journo Debora Patta wants to know if she can get a job as a defence ballistic expert because she fired a gun once......

https://mobile.twitter.com/Debora_Patta

I can't say I've fired a gun but I have played call of duty with my son, so I think I may also be able to help?!:floorlaugh: