trial thread: 3/16/2012

[Oldsoul2]

I couldn't never sit on this jury with this type of crime and testimony

 

[Wondergirl]

After reviewing her statement of May 24McClinitic stands by her earlier testimony that she used the hammer on Victoria and kicked her

Jury is excused while the court considers a legal matter

Does anyone know any legal examples of witnesses who have lied to LE admittedly, in original interviews, and then changed their statements?

It must be common in cases where there are allegedly more than 1 person at the scene of a crime, in a "he said, she said" scenario, where there are self serving statements made, whatever the reason.

Before TLM even testified, if I am following this correctly, she could be proven to be a liar. She admitted she had lied.

If she originally told LE MTR killed Victoria, then changed it to herself as having killed Tori, subsequently testifying on the stand that she killed Tori, and now after having reviewed her statement from May 24th, she keeps it as that, then it is what it is, isn't it?

Unless I am missing something here, unless TLM's statement on the stand this week has changed according to her previous and final statement to Smyth, then nothing has actually happened.

It's not like the Crown and the Defence aren't aware of TLM's original statement and subsequent statement.

They are both ready to "deal" with TLM on the stand, I suspect.

Obviously the Crown felt it better to put her there than not. She tells alot of details, many of which will likely be backed up by other witnesses and evidence, which we haven't even heard yet.

JMO

 

[antiquegirl]

Maybe she still thinks if she takes the fall for him he will actually apply for conjugal visits with her.

Yet, she's sticking to her story that he was there and that he assaulted Tori. If he's convicted on any one of his charges, he will get life in prison. No conjugal visits between them if they're both incarcerated.

 

[Wondergirl]

IMO I think it's because her credibility is a major issue and since she changed her story already,by asking her to review her testimony to make sure this is what the truth is, they are letting the jury see that this testimony is in fact what happened and she is not under distress this time.

I agree.

I believe that TLM has testified on the stand exactly as she testified to Smyth during the May 24, 2009 interview.

The Crown is looking to confirm her testimony.

 

[margaret_diane]

I haven't even started reading today's thread yet - so this might have been mentioned already, but if not - I wanted to say this about TLM's shoes:
-> They may LOOK clean to the naked eye. BUT if they sprayed those shoes with a substance called luminol and then shone a black light over them, those same shoes might reveal all sorts of things!! The combination of luminol and a black light would show if they had blood or semen on them at some point.

-> Even if TLM were to have washed those runners in a washing machine, unless she used bleach or peroxide then any blood, streaks or spatters) would light up using black light and luminol. Semen would wash away - but blood would not, unless bleach or peroxide were used on them.
http://www.enotes.com/luminol-reference/luminol

Incidentally, for those who might be interested, there is actually a kit one can purchase for their own personal use to detect blood and semen stains in say, hotels. Here is a link to that for those who are interested. I'm providing it so that you can see how a luminol test works - but I suppose you could buy and use for your own personal use as well.
[ame="http://www.metacafe.com/watch/939721/dirty_hotels_exposed/"]Dirty Hotels EXPOSED! - Video[/ame]

 

[Oldsoul2]

IMO regardless, the jury will take into account that she has already waived her right to trial, said I did it and got 25 years. I don't believe they will question whether or not she did it or MR did it. She has nothing to gain. The rape and his presence alone will get him a maximum sentence, that's why I said in the beginning, I don't understand what the point is for him to have gone to trial. Guess I'll wait for the defense to reveal that answer

 

[maxfactor]

Yet, she's sticking to her story that he was there and that he assaulted Tori. If he's convicted on any one of his charges, he will get life in prison. No conjugal visits between them if they're both incarcerated.

I've had several discussions with employees of federal prisons and that's not entirely true. As I understand it conjugal visits between Federal Inmates are suspended for the time being and is under review. Up until last spring they were taking place.

 

[antiquegirl]

Canada

In Canada, all inmates, with the exception of those on disciplinary restrictions or at risk for family violence, are permitted "private family visits" of up to 72 hours' duration once every two months. Eligible visitors, who may not themselves be prison inmates, are: spouse, or common-law partner of at least six months; children; parents; foster parents; siblings; grandparents; and "persons with whom, in the opinion of the institutional head, the inmate has a close familial bond". Food is provided by the institution but paid by the inmates and visitors, who are also responsible for cleaning the unit after the visit. During a visit, staff members have regular contact with the inmate and visitors.[4]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Conjugal_visit#Canada

 

[Oldsoul2]

Yes maxfactor, that is true, there are no conjugal visits at all in any federal prison, I believe, don't quote me but it's been YEARS since that's been suspended

 

[Kamille]

I agree.

I believe that TLM has testified on the stand exactly as she testified to Smyth during the May 24, 2009 interview.

The Crown is looking to confirm her testimony.

Add to that, I think whatever she told LE on the 19th when she and MR were first arrested was done as a direct result of anger at MR for whatever they had told her. Perhaps it was Smyth in his "quiet way" that dragged the truth out of her after she had some time to cool off. He is the one who would be pointing out the obvious about evidence.

MOO

 

[nonfictionrocks]

I've had several discussions with employees of federal prisons and that's not entirely true. As I understand it conjugal visits between Federal Inmates are suspended for the time being and is under review. Up until last spring they were taking place.

IMO, even if allowed, I would seriously doubt MTR would agree to this with her.

 

[margaret_diane]

He buys her hair dye, takes his battery out of his cellphone, has extra clothes, gets her to go inside of the Home Depot where she would obviously be captured on film instead of him, washes his car inside and out and disposes of items (with her) and SHE is the one to cover Tori with garbage bags before killing her (and Tori was motionless, WHY was she motionless?). And she had access to the vehicle to get the hammer which I thought was in the trunk. Sorry, I don't believe it. Why was she so concerned with covering Tori with garbage bags first? That sounds like something HE would do to not get dirty. JMO

The use of the garbage bag over the head could have been to make Tori appear less human. De-humanzing a victim apparently makes it easier for perps to use, abuse and murder them. This is why professionals advise that if you're in a situation wherein you've been kidnapped, are being held against your will, or are facing a situation where you could be murdered, you should continue to try to remind your assailant that you are human. That you have a name. A life. A family - use their names etc. These measures help make it harder for the perp to detach and dehumanize, and they just might realize what they're doing, take mercy and release you, or at least not harm you (harm further / murder).

 

[Sailor Bug]

overtime

A verdict has been reached in the trial of a former Rutgers University student accused of spying on and intimidating his gay roommate by use of a hidden webcam.

 

[myzzy]

is it possible that she got some type of deal to plead guilty with no trial for giving her full confession and be a witness to the crown against MR and now is changing the story that she gave the crown initially?

Any Canadian lawyers out there know if this could have happened what the implications against TLM could be?


Thoughts to Tori's family and friends today!

 

[Wondergirl]

Laura Carney ‏ @TheLC_75

#Rafferty - McClintic stands by her testimony earlier this week that it was her who killed Tori.




39m Melanie Nagy ‏ @NagyCBC


Crown asking having reviewed the May 24 statement do you want to change your testimony?McClintic "No". #sl #rafferty

 

[margaret_diane]

My impression from all of this is that she changed her story after that interview with Jim Smyth. MOO

If so - that could pose an issue for either the Crown or the Defence given his recent issues in another criminal matter, wherein the judge expressed concerns regarding the tactics he used to draw a confession from someone.

http://news.nationalpost.com/2011/1...-interrogation-techniques-derail-murder-case/

 

[Wondergirl]

Crown clarifying.

Avery Moore ‏ @AveryFreeFMNews

McClintic says again that she is the one who kicked and killed Tori Stafford. Same as in testimony given last week.https://twitter.com/#!/search/#Rafferty
https://twitter.com/#!/search/#Rafferty

Gerry Dewan ‏ @GerryDewanCTV Crown Gowdey asks if she kicked Tori. McClintic says yes. She's asked if she hit Tori with the hammer, again she says yes.

Linda Nguyen ‏ @LindaNguyenPN

McC mistakenly says yes then explains it was her who kicked and used hammer on Tori

38m Avery Moore ‏ @AveryFreeFMNews

Crown asks McClintic if she wants to change her testimony about who killed Tori after having read the statement. She said no.


#Rafferty

 

[margaret_diane]

Very interesting article about Det Jim Smyth


http://news.nationalpost.com/2011/1...-interrogation-techniques-derail-murder-case/

Sorry - I think I just posted the same article -- I hadn't seen your post yet.

 

[Wondergirl]

James Look ‏ @JamesAmazing

“@NagyCBC: Judge tells the jury to not speculate on what is happening here.Jury is dismissed.

 

[nursebeeme]

http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/toronto/story/2012/03/16/tori-stafford-friday.html

they (the jury) have been out a little under an hour now while something is argued...