trial thread: 3/27/2012

[crazyladi]

He was in the car and opened the trunk remotely from inside the car. Wouldn't he wonder why such a small bag was being put in the trunk?

Exactly. He knew what was in the bag IMO. Dont know who suggested getting the items but he knew. It comes across that way in the video. They were in a mission.

 

[~n/t~]

@RaffertyLFP

• Derstine suggests that jerky video may make people seem to be walking faster than they are

Didn't he say the other day when TLM was on the stand that she looked relaxed, not rushed (paraphrasing) or am I dreaming? Is this the same video?

 

[matou]

Ms. Armstrong told prosecutor Michael Carnegie she arrived home from work and a chiropractor’s visit at around 4:30 p.m. to find Mr. Rafferty’s car parked outside, with a dark-haired woman in the passenger’s seat.

Ms. Armstrong made no mention of seeing a child in the vehicle. (The trial has been told that Tori was by then in the back seat of Mr. Rafferty’s Honda Civic, hidden under a coat.) She testified that Mr. Rafferty came inside the house, stayed for about 10 minutes and that she sold him the “Percs” for $3 apiece - a one-dollar markup from what she had paid.

http://www.theglobeandmail.com/news...n-witness-tells-stafford-jury/article2382899/

 

[fats]

Percocets, not Oxys. If BA wasn't asked how much she was paid, there's no way to know.

JMO

The Toronto Star reported that BA couldn't remember the amount she sold (JMO to cover her actions) and TLM thought it was about $300 worth of percs/oxys --a baggie full. So that would mean avout 100 pills. BA said she bought them for $2 and sold them for $3. She is the mother of 2---who are these people? :maddening:

 

[Oldsoul2]

Geez........ this court sure takes a lot of days off!

Salem

Are they scheduled to go to the crime scene on Thrusday?

 

[Hello_Kitty]

He had $114 in the bank, but he couldn't take out $100, he could only take out $80. Had he maxed his limit for the day?

April 10th is when GST cheques come out, but usually arrive earlier, and when direct deposited even earlier than that. (James had gone to pick up his GST cheque on April 8th).

Erm, I thought the GST cheques came out on the 5th? At least mine does, but it's usually in my bank the night before after 10pm. It's the Energy tax and sales tax that come out on the 9th and 10th.

 

[matou]

So he bought a hundred percs off of her then? $300 is 100 pills, as was explained above. JMO Was he going to sell them at an even higher price? JMO

 

[jolady]

She was high as a kite? She also testified to that. I'm surprised considering how many pills she popped she knew she was in Home Depot.

I wondered just how high she was, or is she just highly functional when high because she was in and out of HD in under 7 min I believe. That is a short time in my opinion. Also she used the self checkout, which in the best of times I find confusing. I use them pretty regularly and never seem to breeze through the scanning and paying very quickly. In Woodstock there is only the Zehr's grocery store (which is not her closest grocery option), Canadian Tire and Home Depot that have self checkouts. I would question how much experience she has had with them. No real conclusion about this, just a comment. It has always puzzled me that a person strung out on drugs could go through HD so quickly. MOO

 

[matou]

By then, the famous video of Tori leaving her school with an unidentified woman (now known to be Ms. McClintic) had been aired, and Mr. Rafferty told Ms. Armstrong “he thought he recognized the girl in the video,” she said.
He also told her he believed the police knew who the mystery woman was, too, and were forcefully trying to get her to confess.

http://www.theglobeandmail.com/news...n-witness-tells-stafford-jury/article2382899/

 

[Juris_Prudence]

Ms. Armstrong told prosecutor Michael Carnegie she arrived home from work and a chiropractor’s visit at around 4:30 p.m. to find Mr. Rafferty’s car parked outside, with a dark-haired woman in the passenger’s seat.

Ms. Armstrong made no mention of seeing a child in the vehicle. (The trial has been told that Tori was by then in the back seat of Mr. Rafferty’s Honda Civic, hidden under a coat.) She testified that Mr. Rafferty came inside the house, stayed for about 10 minutes and that she sold him the “Percs” for $3 apiece - a one-dollar markup from what she had paid.

http://www.theglobeandmail.com/news...n-witness-tells-stafford-jury/article2382899/

Thank you for posting this! I was listening to 680news this morning and I *thought* I heard that MR paid 2$ a pill for them. I couldn't find a link when I went looking earlier today to support what I thought I heard so this helped a lot!

 

[Oldsoul2]

So he bought a hundred percs off of her then? $300 is 100 pills, as was explained above. JMO Was he going to sell them at an even higher price? JMO

It wasn't just percs it was also oxycontin, apparently their pretty expensive.

 

[KMouse]

Now, this is something I've had a problem with ever since the trial began. By all accounts from her own family, Tori was feisty, energetic, restless, and somewhat rebellious. No matter how scared she was, I just can't imagine her meekly lying there under a coat during all those stops they made. Her personality suggests that she should have been squirming, crying, protesting, etc. Yet, no one noticed anything - not BA, not anyone near the car at Home Depot, nor any other drivers passing them on the road during the 2 1/2 hours she was supposed to be in that car. I still can't believe that she wasn't drugged at some point before they reached their destination in Mt. Forest.

JMO

Neither did Jaycee Dugard.

Theorizing what a person/child would do if they were kidnapped is irrelevant to me. Tori was eight years old. She could have been wimpering in the back seat covered with the coat. She was most likely ordered to keep her mouth shut & her face out of sight.
We all do the stranger-danger talks with our kids but we don't cover specific scenarios about what to do if somebody takes you and shoves you into a car and threatens you.

 

[Alice Ramnit]

These actions suggest the defence is plausible.

If MR really had planned the abduction:

(1) He would have already had the garbage bags and hammer with him. To suggest he made TLM get these items to cover for himself is too risky. If he was that smart he would have known he would be caught on tape.
(2) He would not have stopped for drugs.
(3) He would not have gone to Tim Horton's and risk getting caught.

Now, if TLM had taken Tori with her and told MR that she was babysitting Tori perhaps and/or did not give MR any intentions of what SHE planned, then:

(1) She would have stopped to get tea at Tim Horton's.
(2) She would be okay with MR stopping to get drugs.
(3) She could have lied to MR about Home Depot and said she had to pick something up.

You would not stop for drugs or tea or murder weapons UNLESS you are a smug sociopath who believes he is above the law...

If he were just babysitting wouldn't Tori have been sitting up in the backseat and spotted by BA, other 401 drivers, the staff/patrons at the stores etc?
Wouldn't you offer her a treat from Tim Hortons???

No, no no....I just can't see the babysitting scenario...

 

[matou]

Rafferty told Armstrong that he thought he recognized the woman and the car, and that police were trying to get her to confess to Tori's kidnapping, Armstrong said.
"He said that they were waking her up in the middle of the night and they were screaming and yelling at her and spitting in her face."


Why would he tell BA that? How would he be able to explain HOW he "knew" this to BA?


Oh yeah, I find this part amusing: "I could pretty much tell him anything," Armstrong said. "It was like girl talk."


http://www.guelphmercury.com/news/l...d-several-guelph-ties-jury-hears-at-his-trial

 

[~n/t~]

By then, the famous video of Tori leaving her school with an unidentified woman (now known to be Ms. McClintic) had been aired, and Mr. Rafferty told Ms. Armstrong “he thought he recognized the girl in the video,” she said.
He also told her he believed the police knew who the mystery woman was, too, and were forcefully trying to get her to confess.

http://www.theglobeandmail.com/news...n-witness-tells-stafford-jury/article2382899/

He thought he recognized the girl in the video but he knew they were forcefully trying to get her to confess.

 

[Oldsoul2]

Rafferty told Armstrong that he thought he recognized the woman and the car, and that police were trying to get her to confess to Tori's kidnapping, Armstrong said.
"He said that they were waking her up in the middle of the night and they were screaming and yelling at her and spitting in her face."


Why would he tell BA that? How would he be able to explain HOW he "knew" this to BA?


Oh yeah, I find this part amusing: "I could pretty much tell him anything," Armstrong said. "It was like girl talk."


http://www.guelphmercury.com/news/l...d-several-guelph-ties-jury-hears-at-his-trial

IMO He should have told his defense team to go with the homosexual theory instead...

 

[matou]

I wonder if he was like having a girlfriend and a boyfriend all in one package? JMO MOO

 

[Kimster]

Stay on topic and leave each other alone in here. Your mods have been quite patient. I'm not going to be as patient if I see a bunch more alerts and have to return. :nono:

:saber:


THIS POST LANDS AT RANDOM AND IS NOT ABOUT THE POST ABOVE IT.

 

[Sailor Bug]

Are they scheduled to go to the crime scene on Thrusday?

I'm thinking yes. jmo

Chapter 4: The Mount Forest death scene, which the jury will visit. "It will be difficult to go the very place where this happened, I know that, but understanding the crime scene is crucial to understanding the crime," Gowdey said. Photographs, some of them graphic, will be used to explain "exactly how the killing happened."

 

[nursebeeme]

Stay on topic and leave each other alone in here. Your mods have been quite patient. I'm not going to be as patient if I see a bunch more alerts and have to return. :nono:

:saber:


THIS POST LANDS AT RANDOM AND IS NOT ABOUT THE POST ABOVE IT.

<-------------------- what kimster said... and I will add a :nurse: