GUILTY Turkey - Sarai Sierra, 33, NY woman murdered, Istanbul, 21 Jan 2013 - #2

[Yellow]

What I find a little strange is where she would have gotten the money to go in the first place. Ok, this is a once in a lifetime trip, I get that. Still, it had to have costs at least $1500-2000 total, I would think? Between the room, airfare to 3 different cities, food, fees, etc? Or at least $1000 I would say...

Now, if you divorce it from your own personal circumstances and consider she lived in an apartment in a lower class area of Staten Island, she was either unemployed or working only part time, her husband was a city bus driver (how much do they make $25,000?), she went to college part time and had declared bankruptcy...and had 2 kids...

How could she have spent a month or a half month income for her family on a trip? Remember it does not seem like she was middle class; it seems like her family income was just above the poverty line....do working class families spend 5 % of their yearly income for one member of the family to take a trip?

It also does not seem like she saved for it a long time... Like I could see if you saved for the trip for 1 or 2 years, if you were working class and you were going to treat yourself. But it seems like she started planning in June, so it took her only 6 months to save? I guess people just put it on credit cards but still... If her husband had to wire her money her balance must not be that much...

Also, where would she have gotten the money to save? it appears that probably it was paid for by the husband. Sometimes the husband makes enough for the family so whatever the wife makes is not needed for family expenses or vice versa. But I would think that would not be the case here; if she worked, I am sure she could not keep her whole pay check for herself, some of it had to go for family expenses. So how much could she have really saved?

Also, I am not even sure she was working. Who can take 3 weeks off from a part time job? Maybe a week, maybe 2, but 3? I doubt she was working which means the husband was footing the bill.

I never bought the drug mule theory and still do not. But I cannot help but wonder if any of this plays into her murder, like maybe someone else paid for trip, or maybe someone wanted her to transport gold or jewelry, etc... Could the trip have involved an opportunity to make money (legally or illegally)?

I cannot help but think that what working class family has an extra $1000-2000 lying around to pay for vacations for one member?

I thought of this as I was reading comments to news articles. Many people are questioning how an unemployed women whose husband is a city bus driver could afford such a trip and I think they raise a valid point.

 

[Gio]

Something tells me that this wasn't the first time SS had strayed from the marriage.

It doesn't make sense to me that someone would go from devout mom/wife to sleeping on a stranger's couch in A'dam overnight.

I suspect she's been trying to break free for years (her bankruptcy filing listed her marital status as separated in 2005, so this isn't a new development), and all the while he keeps holding out hope that eventually she will get it out of her system and return back to him.

 

[KuriousKev]

What I find a little strange is where she would have gotten the money to go in the first place. Ok, this is a once in a lifetime trip, I get that. Still, it had to have costs at least $1500-2000 total, I would think? Between the room, airfare to 3 different cities, food, fees, etc? Or at least $1000 I would say...

Now, if you divorce it from your own personal circumstances and consider she lived in an apartment in a lower class area of Staten Island, she was either unemployed or working only part time, her husband was a city bus driver (how much do they make $25,000?), she went to college part time and had declared bankruptcy...and had 2 kids...

How could she have spent a month or a half month income for her family on a trip? Remember it does not seem like she was middle class; it seems like her family income was just above the poverty line....do working class families spend 5 % of their yearly income for one member of the family to take a trip?

It also does not seem like she saved for it a long time... Like I could see if you saved for the trip for 1 or 2 years, if you were working class and you were going to treat yourself. But it seems like she started planning in June, so it took her only 6 months to save? I guess people just put it on credit cards but still... If her husband had to wire her money her balance must not be that much...

Also, where would she have gotten the money to save? it appears that probably it was paid for by the husband. Sometimes the husband makes enough for the family so whatever the wife makes is not needed for family expenses or vice versa. But I would think that would not be the case here; if she worked, I am sure she could not keep her whole pay check for herself, some of it had to go for family expenses. So how much could she have really saved?

Also, I am not even sure she was working. Who can take 3 weeks off from a part time job? Maybe a week, maybe 2, but 3? I doubt she was working which means the husband was footing the bill.

I never bought the drug mule theory and still do not. But I cannot help but wonder if any of this plays into her murder, like maybe someone else paid for trip, or maybe someone wanted her to transport gold or jewelry, etc...

I cannot help but think that what working class family has an extra $1000-2000 lying around to pay for vacations for one member?

Working part time (not confirmed), separated, 2 kids...I would say public assistance (welfare). It's all so strange with a lot of pieces missing.

 

[necco]

What I find a little strange is where she would have gotten the money to go in the first place. Ok, this is a once in a lifetime trip, I get that. Still, it had to have costs at least $1500-2000 total, I would think? Between the room, airfare to 3 different cities, food, fees, etc? Or at least $1000 I would say...

Now, if you divorce it from your own personal circumstances and consider she lived in an apartment in a lower class area of Staten Island, she was either unemployed or working only part time, her husband was a city bus driver (how much do they make $25,000?), she went to college part time and had declared bankruptcy...and had 2 kids...

How could she have spent a month or a half month income for her family on a trip? Remember it does not seem like she was middle class; it seems like her family income was just above the poverty line....do working class families spend 5 % of their yearly income for one member of the family to take a trip?

It also does not seem like she saved for it a long time... Like I could see if you saved for the trip for 1 or 2 years, if you were working class and you were going to treat yourself. But it seems like she started planning in June, so it took her only 6 months to save? I guess people just put it on credit cards but still... If her husband had to wire her money her balance must not be that much...

Also, where would she have gotten the money to save? it appears that probably it was paid for by the husband. Sometimes the husband makes enough for the family so whatever the wife makes is not needed for family expenses or vice versa. But I would think that would not be the case here; if she worked, I am sure she could not keep her whole pay check for herself, some of it had to go for family expenses. So how much could she have really saved?

Also, I am not even sure she was working. Who can take 3 weeks off from a part time job? Maybe a week, maybe 2, but 3? I doubt she was working which means the husband was footing the bill.

I never bought the drug mule theory and still do not. But I cannot help but wonder if any of this plays into her murder, like maybe someone else paid for trip, or maybe someone wanted her to transport gold or jewelry, etc...

I cannot help but think that what working class family has an extra $1000-2000 lying around to pay for vacations for one member?

I thought of this as I was reading comments to news articles. Many people are questioning how an unemployed women whose husband is a city bus driver could afford such a trip and I think they raise a valid point.

NYC bus drivers made an average of $49K a year in 2004. So probably more like 55-60 now.

http://gothamist.com/2004/02/02/the_most_personal_of_questions_how_much_do_you_make.php

 

[necco]

Working part time (not confirmed), separated, 2 kids...I would say public assistance (welfare). It's all so strange with a lot of pieces missing.

Really? Now we're randomly theorizing she's spending her welfare checks on trips to Turkey?

It really is devil or angel around here, isn't it?

We don't know why they declared bankruptcy in 2005. But given that within the three years prior to the filing they had two children and moved across country, perhaps she lost her health insurance when she was pregnant. Or they took pay cuts to move home to be closer to her family.

 

[KuriousKev]

Really? Now we're randomly theorizing she's spending her welfare checks on trips to Turkey?

It really is devil or angel around here, isn't it?

We don't know why they declared bankruptcy in 2005.

It was just a thought :angel: fact is none of us know. We could only assume her husband funded it but then there's all of the reports that say she saved for months, there are no reports that says her husband paid for the trip. Her husband never mentioned that he funded the trip during his many interviews.

 

[KuriousKev]

BTW, Her husband could have certainly afforded to pay for the trip IF, that is IF this is the same Steven Sierra:

"Steven Sierra is a New York Public Authority Employee with a salary of $73,846, which is 48% higher than the average for all New York State Employees as of 12/31/10. Steven Sierra is employed as a BUS OPERATOR-REVENUE VEHICLE in the NYC Transit Authority division of the Metropolitan Transportation Authority agency. Steven was hired on February 17, 1992. "

LINK

 

[Yellow]

NYC bus drivers made an average of $49K a year in 2004. So probably more like 55-60 now.

http://gothamist.com/2004/02/02/the_most_personal_of_questions_how_much_do_you_make.php

Still, with taxes in NYC being what they are, take home pay is not all that much..they take like 30% away on taxes...NYC tax is 8% alone. As living expenses are alot. I imagine apartment was $1500 at least

It just seems like alot to spend for a trip for a working class family, especially considering the fact that it does not seem like she was working.

It could be too that she perceived the trip as a way to make money, perhaps in a completely legal way. Like maybe something w the photography, maybe she was going to try to sell some of her pictures as a way to pay for some of the trip.

 

[KuriousKev]

Still, with taxes in NYC being what they are, take home pay is not all that much..they take like 30% away on taxes...NYC tax is 8% alone. As living expenses are alot. I imagine apartment was $1500 at least

It just seems like alot to spend for a trip for a working class family, especially considering the fact that it does not seem like she was working.

It could be too that she perceived the trip as a way to make money, perhaps in a completely legal way. Like maybe something w the photography, maybe she was going to try to sell some of her pictures as a way to pay for some of the trip.

I feel the same. As I mentioned upthread, there is no mention from the press or her husband that he funded the trip. There are many reports that say SS saved for her own trip.

 

[Yellow]

BTW, Her husband could have certainly afforded to pay for the trip IF, that is IF this is the same Steven Sierra:

"Steven Sierra is a New York Public Authority Employee with a salary of $73,846, which is 48% higher than the average for all New York State Employees as of 12/31/10. Steven Sierra is employed as a BUS OPERATOR-REVENUE VEHICLE in the NYC Transit Authority division of the Metropolitan Transportation Authority agency. Steven was hired on February 17, 1992. "

LINK

I am surprised bus drivers make so much, I guess bc it is unionized. Living in NYC that does not go too far..

Also we do not know whether they are living separate and perhaps are maintaining 2 apartments...

Unless she was selling pictures, it seems like her husband had to have paid for most of the trip. And that accords w the evidence bc she needed her husband to wire her the $500. Otherwise why not just put it on credit card or your own account.

It is sad but it may have been the case that SS was unhappy in marriage but stayed w husband for financial reasons. Like many women, maybe she could not afford to leave. Maybe that was why she was trying to be a photographer, that would give her independence to leave..

 

[Yellow]

Whatever happened to the fact that her ipad or phone was apparently activated on Jan 31? Remember when that happened and there was hope she was alive?

No one in the press is mentioning that anymore, was it true that it was activated? If so, either it was killer or random person who found it, right? I would think that would be a huge clue..

 

[KuriousKev]

Whatever happened to the fact that her ipad or phone was apparently activated on Jan 31? Remember when that happened and there was hope she was alive?

No one in the press is mentioning that anymore, was it true that it was activated? If so, either it was killer or random person who found it, right? I would think that would be a huge clue..

Yes, I believe it was her Turkish cellular that was activate and someone also logged into her skype account which I assume was installed on her iPad. I mentioned upthread that cellular companies have the ability to triangulate, using cell towers, on an approximate location where a cell phone was used...did they? who knows

 

[ToutCa]

Tout what do you live in Bedsty?

Not exactly but very close! Within blocks.

 

[looking4answers]

I think it was forced.

Why would a woman ask a man who forced sex on her, to meet up to site see the next day? Does not click for me, not at all. I tend to disbelieve the sex talk now, and revert back to her beliefs and just a friendly outgoing demeanor where she gets along well with men. She seems to be close to her brother, as he went to Turkey to look for her.

 

[ToutCa]

I bet we would find the answers to some of our questions if we could have a sit down with Ms. Magdalena Rodriguez, best friend of SS, the one who early on said she backed out of the trip at the last minute but then later said she informed SS early on that she was unable to go.

She's got no incentive to bad-mouth her dead good friend...who she feels guilty for having left to take the trip solo...

 

[ToutCa]

"Istanbul authorities say the area where the mother-of-two was murdered is a known rape black spot in a run down part of the city.

A Swedish tourist was raped at knife point in the same place in January 2007, and in March 2010 a Japanese girl suffered a chillingly similar attack to Sarai's murder when she was bludgeoned about the head with a rock and raped, according to Turkish daily newspaper Takvim.

Another 24-year-old Turkish girl was attacked at knife point at the same spot but managed to fight off her attacker and flee to safety.

This is very helpful.

This scenario would make it a random failed (?) rape attempt, and the perpetrator could be any male sex offender type. (No reason to think it must be a homeless or druggie).

But if it's a "known rape black spot", someone could have killed/disposed of her there to throw attention off the assault for other reasons.

Every step forward our feet get further mired in the mud.

 

[ToutCa]

young single female travellers is what i am talking about.

Again, there is no evidence of anything but that in the last 10 years there were sexual assaults on 3 women, including one Turk at that spot.

This information is very interesting in determining what may have happened there.

It is not useful in showing Istanbul is generally horribly dangerous for women, especially foreign women.

You keep trying to imply Istanbul is dangerous for foreign women, far more dangerous than NYC. You have no evidence for this.

You've been shown NYC murder rates which are higher than those of Istanbul. You have no response other than to say you don't like statistics.

Do you really think that in NYC we can't find reports of rapes of 2 foreign women in the last 10 years? Honestly, do you really believe that?

 

[ToutCa]

Maybe he honestly tried to help LE. We just don't know.

We do know.

At least about this part...he only "helped" LE after the FBI tracked him down! Meanwhile while a woman was missing, the woman he was the last to have known contact with, and the family plus Turkish and American LE was pleading for info, what did good ol Taylan do? He deleted all his web profiles and went to ground.

He's a coward. I have no sympathy for that sort of behavior.

 

[ToutCa]

Bourne!! We're kindred spirits! I think he did it too.

I was all for Taylan too, but if the DNA evidence implicates someone else, that's how it is.

We really need to learn more about this DNA evidence. Is there a lot of it? In what form? Multiple forms on multiple objects? On the murder weapon? All showing one male perp?

Must...know...info...eyes...glazing...fist...clenching....

 

[ToutCa]

I just had something strange happen and now I think Taylan did it.Its too crazy to say what happened,so I'm just going to leave it at that.

Wow, what happened?? I hope you are OK.

I raved about Taylan for dozens of pages, saying he was my #1 suspect, it would defy belief if he didn't do it, etc.

Nothing weird happened to me.

Don't worry, Taylan is NOT Keyser Soze!!!