GUILTY Turkey - Sarai Sierra, 33, NY woman murdered, Istanbul, 21 Jan 2013 - #4

[Herat]

It could be because of the weather too, maybe it was raining or cold when she wore the cap and then she took it off.

I don't think that bag she has under her right shoulder has much room in it. Probably not enough for an Ipad and a cap, too.

 

[looking4answers]

EXACTLY. That's just what I was thinking.

Which also relates back to ToutCa's comment about the Munich stop still being part of the investigation.

Yipes.

This is making me mental.ullhair:

Where did the LE say that anyone from Munich was a suspect? Show evidence.

Also, show evidence from LE that anyone from Amsterdam or Munich travelled to Turkey for one day just to see Sarai before she left back to the US.

Also, relate how a person (Sarai) who was attempting to contact one person to meet them for a tourist outing (Taylan) with whom they had also talked about it the previous day, would suddenly switch plans to meet someone coming hundreds if not thousands of miles away from Amsterdam or Munich to meet her for less than one day on a whim (maybe less than a few hours tops) at one spot near some walls. Wouldn't she already know about them being there, and not within a couple of hours or so of having other possible plans with Taylan?

Please deduce for me your logic at getting to this possibility. None of the facts show any rational way at getting there and also how it relates to her behaviors and communications as provided by the LE. I am asking sincerely, it is important we all deduce logical theories so that we do not sway the news who come here to read statements based on things that the LE has not implied with any of their statements. Remember, Ammer and others are people with relationships (families, friends) and careers, and associating them with things that the facts as provided by the LE do not even provide evidence for is a dangerous thing to do in smearing them.

I found this line of deduction (or lack thereof) led to starting conversations about the possibility her husband could be a suspect as well.

I really just want people to be more careful.

 

[NewYork625]

It could be because of the weather too, maybe it was raining or cold when she wore the cap and then she took it off.

It's just that when I first saw the cap I had assumed she was wearing it to look conservative. I don't remember ever seeing another woman around here wearing a cap like that one. I didn't associate it with any sort of winter cap. It was yesterday that I first saw the photo of her on the NYC subway wearing the same cap. It could well be that she was just wearing it to keep warm.

 

[zarra30]

Uhhh.....I'm going to completely reserve comment on this outfit, especially the bell bottom pants.
I'm glad the pics were released.
I'm sure her family and female friends will know her style of dressing and can identify her clothing.

http://www.internethaber.com/saraini...li-504455h.htm

 

[Herat]

Please deduce for me your logic at getting to this possibility. evidence for is a dangerous thing to do in smearing them.

Hey- don't accuse me of using logic!:groucho:

I'm referring to comment by ToutCa. You can use the link if it comes through.

"The most mainstream and credible of Turkish media, Hurriyet, just posted on its news blog TODAY that Turkish LE are still pursuing 3 lines of investigation:
LINK
(1) Homeless denizens of the walls, including but not exclusively "Z"
(2) SS's Instagram and gmail contacts
(3) SS's side trip, and in particular the mysterious "Munich" leg "

 

[Herat]

I really just want people to be more careful.

Yes. Quite.

 

[bet2173]

It's just that when I first saw the cap I had assumed she was wearing it to look conservative. I don't remember ever seeing another woman around here wearing a cap like that one. I didn't associate it with any sort of winter cap. It was yesterday that I first saw the photo of her on the NYC subway wearing the same cap. It could well be that she was just wearing it to keep warm.

I was making that comment to emphasize that it could be a simpler reason than what we suspect. Because it's a murder case we try to attribute big causes to every detail, she could have a bad hair day and tuck her hair in a cap, she was wearing caps with the fellow instagramers in NYC but not like in the style in Istanbul

 

[Herat]

Uhhh.....I'm going to completely reserve comment on this outfit, especially the bell bottom pants.

http://www.internethaber.com/saraini...li-504455h.htm

I think bell-bottom pants are "over" and not a good fashion choice for a short woman, no matter how thin.

And they don't tuck into those wedge boots very easily without bunching up at the bottom and looking a bit like a harem pant.

 

[ThinkHard]

I had read that TK recommended SS to spend her last day in the peninsula, referring to tip of the Old City, saying "The peninsula is our pride". Sounds weird. No matter how I translate it or read it. What's with that? What are we proud of? Who are we? Locals of Lygos, Byzantium, New Rome, Constantinople or İstanbul?

I would never recommend that. And to do what? Promenading? Saray Point (sarayburnu) looks out to the Marmara Sea, not much to see. The view of Saray Point is much nicer than the view from Saray Point.

So weird.

Bad advice.

I agree, it would seem more likely that someone would recommend going to Rumeli for great photo opps.

 

[CMac2]

I think bell-bottom pants are "over" and not a good fashion choice for a short woman, no matter how thin.

OH NO!!!! **Quickly changes out of bell-bottom pants**

 

[Herat]

OH NO!!!! **Quickly changes out of bell-bottom pants**

I'm glad you got the hint. I really didn't want to have to tell you out here in front of everyone....

 

[zarra30]

I think bell-bottom pants are "over" and not a good fashion choice for a short woman, no matter how thin.

And they don't tuck into those wedge boots very easily without bunching up at the bottom and looking a bit like a harem pant.

Exactly.
Wide flare is dated.
Slim fit is in now in NYC.
But to each his own.
It will be of value to hear the response from people who know her style once they have a look.

 

[ThinkHard]

It's just that when I first saw the cap I had assumed she was wearing it to look conservative. I don't remember ever seeing another woman around here wearing a cap like that one. I didn't associate it with any sort of winter cap. It was yesterday that I first saw the photo of her on the NYC subway wearing the same cap. It could well be that she was just wearing it to keep warm.

I don't think she would have felt the need to wear a cap in Istanbul for the sole purpose of being conservative in Istanbul. It's just not that type of city. Yes some women wear head scarves but the majority of women do not cover their heads at all. Even the ones that do cover their heads do so in varying ways, some cover all of their hair so the scarf just frames their face, some have a few wisps of hair sticking out, some have a lot of hair showing. But regardless the majority if women in Istanbul do not cover their heads at all, a point that would have been very obvious to Sarai when she was there, so I don't think her choice to wear a hat would have been at all influenced by trying to be conservative.

Perhaps just a fashion statement, and she seemed to wear one in NY, perhaps due to the weather. As Yashim pointed out it was 63 on the day she disappeared, so if she was wearing it for weather, it would explain why she wasnt wearing it that day.

Or like Herat said, she wasnt wearing it that day so that her hair wouldn't be kinked by hat head because she wanted to get some good pictures of herself. And since its hard to take pictures of yourself.....well maybe just maybe this is another clue she was meeting someone there.

 

[EncyclopediaBrown]

It's just that when I first saw the cap I had assumed she was wearing it to look conservative. I don't remember ever seeing another woman around here wearing a cap like that one. I didn't associate it with any sort of winter cap. It was yesterday that I first saw the photo of her on the NYC subway wearing the same cap. It could well be that she was just wearing it to keep warm.

i know someone who has a cap just like hers - her husband. those caps were super popular a while back, when i was still in new york. i have one almost identical. it is obvious that she's into graffiti, part of the graffiti movement is hiphop - i wouldn't be surprised if it's just part of the image. perfect new york hat to hide your eyes and walk amongst the masses.

 

[looking4answers]

There is absolutely no accountability in the media.

Here is the case for why:

1. A Paper is owned by an entity, and most likely it's owners/shareholders are driven by one factor and one factor alone: the bottom line/shareholder price.

2. This equates to driving one thing that increases revenue, readership. Readership is driven not really by the quality of the way an article is written as we all know, but by the way that the story raises attention from other life events, so sensationalism reigns supreme in doing this.

3. This is abused of course, by writing articles that are not necessarily fact checked, or even if they are, are quoted or stated in a way so as to make the content stand out in a sensationalist way. This could mean by honing in on specific facts/language that will usually psychologically prod readers to be inquisitive.

4. The reason why "writers", and I use this word liberally, are removed from being associated to what they write, is because there are no costs great enough as compared to the benefit of the salary they encrue from their master the news source. I would also never call most of them "journalists" nowadays as most are so far removed from this type of research/analysis.


So now, this is where the base for my case in dealing with this issue starts.

Basically, the media and the "writers" need some form of "cost" associated with their craft, as they have too much effect/power and no real tangible repercussions from abusing this said power. This includes the editors and publishers, but the real people to make squirm sort of a bottom up approach of accountability is to start with the writers. I have had this idea for a while, and as a technologist and with my connections in the start up community, I intend to take my frustration with the media over the years, and make them accountable. Watch me.

I liked this quote, in regards to this issue, because I can misuse it for the double entendre:

"Today's opportunities erase yesterday's failures." gene brown.

 

[Herat]

Exactly.
Wide flare is dated.
Slim fit is in now in NYC.
But to each his own.
It will be of value to hear the response from people who know her style once they have a look.

So you are postulating that isn't SS in the not-hip bellbottom pants?

 

[looking4answers]

Hey- don't accuse me of using logic!:groucho:

I'm referring to comment by ToutCa. You can use the link if it comes through.

"The most mainstream and credible of Turkish media, Hurriyet, just posted on its news blog TODAY that Turkish LE are still pursuing 3 lines of investigation:
LINK
(1) Homeless denizens of the walls, including but not exclusively "Z"
(2) SS's Instagram and gmail contacts
(3) SS's side trip, and in particular the mysterious "Munich" leg "

I wan't picking on you promise, you were just the last quote on the subject that I clicked on, from the conversation started by someone else. Sorry, I apologize if you thought I was, I was not. I do cherish everyones thoughts. Just wanted to make an overall point. Perhaps I should not have quoted your quote specifically. So I ask you to forgive me.

 

[ThinkHard]

There is absolutely no accountability in the media.

Here is the case for why:

1. A Paper is owned by an entity, and most likely it's owners/shareholders are driven by one factor and one factor alone: the bottom line/shareholder price.

2. This equates to driving one thing that increases revenue, readership. Readership is driven not really by the quality of the way an article is written as we all know, but by the way that the story raises attention from other life events, so sensationalism reigns supreme in doing this.

3. This is abused of course, by writing articles that are not necessarily fact checked, or even if they are, are quoted or stated in a way so as to make the content stand out in a sensationalist way. This could mean by honing in on specific facts/language that will usually psychology prod readers to be inquisitive.

4. The reason why "writers", and I use this word liberally, are removed from being associated to what they write, is because there are no costs great enough as compared to the benefit of the salary they encrue from their master the news source. I would also never call most of them "journalists" nowadays as most are so far removed from this type of research/analysis.


So now, this is where the base for my case in dealing with this issue starts.

Basically, the media and the "writers" need some form of "cost" associated with their craft, as they have too much effect/power and no really tangible repercussions from abusing this said power. This includes trhe editors and publishers, but the real people to make squirm sort of a bottom up approach of accountability is to start with the writers. I have had this idea for a while, and as a technologist and with my connections in the start up community, I intend to take my frustration with the media over the years, and make them accountable. Watch me.

I liked this quote, becuase I can misuse it for the double entendre, in regards to this issue:

"Today's opportunities erase yesterday's failures." gene brown.

Ok. I hear you but no one on this board is saying the media is trust worthy. I'm pretty sure we all agree that what they publish is more about selling papers then facts. No ones arguing that point.

 

[Herat]

I don't think she would have felt the need to wear a cap in Istanbul for the sole purpose of being conservative in Istanbul. It's just not that type of city. Yes some women wear head scarves but the majority of women do not cover their heads at all. Even the ones that do cover their heads do so in varying ways, some cover all of their hair so the scarf just frames their face, some have a few wisps of hair sticking out, some have a lot of hair showing. But regardless the majority if women in Istanbul do not cover their heads at all, a point that would have been very obvious to Sarai when she was there, so I don't think her choice to wear a hat would have been at all influenced by trying to be conservative.

Perhaps just a fashion statement, and she seemed to wear one in NY, perhaps due to the weather. As Yashim pointed out it was 63 on the day she disappeared, so if she was wearing it for weather, it would explain why she wasnt wearing it that day.

Or like Herat said, she wasnt wearing it that day so that her hair wouldn't be kinked by hat head because she wanted to get some good pictures of herself. And since its hard to take pictures of yourself.....well maybe just maybe this is another clue she was meeting someone there.

That cap is big enough to cover all of her hair. Keeps it neat and makes sure her hair doesn't get in the photos. A known hazard for people with long hair who like to take photos. Keeps you warm. Makes you less visible as a young woman. Is a bit concealing, not for conservative wear, but somewhat less vulnerable.

 

[Yashim]

I believe Yashim was guessing that perhaps he lived in Yenikoy (translation Newtown), because its an upscale area near his lawyers office in Sariyer. But that is an area that is quite far from begoylu. It's down the Bosphorous passed the second suspension bridge that crosses the Bosphorous connecting the European and Asian sides.

Frankly, we don't have anything to work with to guess where he lived. I think we needed that info to develop scenarios about how the body was transferred if TK was the perp and the primary crime scene was his house. (I personally never considered TK as a suspect.)

But his office or wherever he was on January 21 shouldn't be far. Because, due to many urban renewal, renovation/restoration projects, Istanbul has become a gigantic construction yard. If he was far, he would hit the road early in order not to make SS wait, after all it was her last day in Istanbul and it'd be the gentlemanly thing to do. And, with that buffer, he would either meet SS or even wait for her.

I gotta go now, but if I get any more news, I'll pass it on to you guys before we inform the press.