GUILTY TX - Alanna Gallagher, 6, Saginaw, 1 July 2013 - #13

[Brightbird]

ITA There's one in every neighborhood, that creepy kid who everyone knows just isn't right. Yet, when a child turned up dead, no one posted about TH (or other possible POI's right under their nose). Too many were far more pleased to raise unwarranted suspicions about parents with no history of past bad deeds. It wasn't until after his arrest that the stories about TH came out of the woodwork. Why?

An even bigger question for me is why the criticism of the parents hasn't stopped even after TH's arrest. Now that is something I cannot make sense of :banghead:

 

[CHERIE.T]

You are right. The Star Telegram implies that:



Read more here: http://www.star-telegram.com/2013/0...police-looking-for-drivers.html#storylink=cpy


And then the search warrant lists the two surveillance cameras as being at the North and South end of Babbling Brook. Some super sleuther's here identified the home where the video stills were captured as being on babbling brook before the warrant was released though.

THANK YOU :seeya: I've been trying to find that. I really appreciate it.
Lol it took me an hour to read our WS thread ...way back, still didnt find it.

 

[Confusion]

BBM

IDK. I really think people feel safer placing the blame on the parents, that means there is no boogie man. And then so many parents are guilty. It's gonna be a hard habit to break.

Maybe it's because my kids are grown and I have no grandchildren, but I tend to be the opposite way. I almost always see the parents as the least likely people to hurt their child, and only consider them when I run out of other possibilities - or the evidence is too overwhelming to ignore. I just can't bring myself to add to the misery of someone who is suffering from one of the worst pains I know of. Since I'm not responsible for any arrests, etc., I'd rather err on the side of caution. I'd much rather admit that I was wrong than to try to unsay hurtful things I said about someone already in great pain. I know somebody always has to rule them out in order to move on with the investigation, but it's not going to be me.

 

[Dr. Know?]

There's a connection here we aren't privy to factually. I'm open for whatever brings justice for Alanna and helps the family heal.

If there's another perp, bring them on!

 

[greenpalm]

What I'm hoping is that, unbeknownst to us, there really IS a cam at that other location!!

I am totally hoping that too!! I'm certain LE wouldn't necessarily tell us, but it seems highly unlikely that there aren't ANY around that neighborhood.

I'm confused about on which corner the tarp was found. The arrest warrant says the Southwest corner of Cindy Lane and Roundrock, on the south side of the street. I guess, because of the way the crime scene photo from overhead is oriented, I really had been thinking she was on the southeast corner.

I think I have it straightened out in my head now. I rotated the overhead crime scene photo so it's oriented the same way as the map (although this makes the picture sideways)

If these are wrong, someone please tell me!! I don't want to perpetuate incorrect stuff.

Thanks.

 

[dandan08]

Great spot greenpalm! I always thought her body was left on the southeast corner too, but having checked you're absolutely right. It changes things for me regarding the route he/she/they took to transport her body. It seems like they probably turned right onto Silverbrook (or left on Bridle Trail), then left onto Old Decatur Road and then left again on Roundrock Drive. Obviously I could be totally wrong but that seems the most probably/easy route now.

 

[bessie]

Bond set at $1M for Saginaw suspect in Alanna Gallagher case

Associated Press Posted on July 31, 2013 at 1:09 PM Updated today at 3:37 PM
SAGINAW, Texas — Bond has been set at $1,000,000 for a hospitalized North Texas teenager charged with shooting an Arlington officer serving an arrest warrant for the murder of a 6-year-old girl.

Alanna Gallagher Update: Texas officer shot while serving warrant in girl's slaying released from hospital

July 30, 2013 12:20 PM
(CBS/AP) FORT WORTH - A North Texas police officer shot while serving a capital murder warrant in the slaying of 6-year-old Alanna Gallagher has been discharged from a hospital.

Officer Charles Lodatto/
Arlington Police Dept. via CBS DFW

$1 Million Bond Set for Man Held in Alanna Gallagher's Murder

Wednesday, Jul 31, 2013 | Updated 10:14 AM CDT
Defense attorney Rose Anna Salinas said Wednesday that she's visited her client. Salinas declined to release Holder's condition or comment further.

 

[dandan08]

Right i've been going through Streetview in Google Earth that show images from April 2013. I am trying to see what other houses in the area (Silverbrook and Bridle Trail) have home security camera's.

If the perp turned right onto Silverbrook from Babbling Brook then I have spotted at least one camera (im 99% certain it is a camera), and a possible two other camera's too. Not to mention any that are hidden or further back near the front doors that I can't see.

If the perp turned left onto Bridle Trail I have spotted at least two camera's too (99% certain), and a possible two other camera's too that i'm not sure about.

Assuming these were on and running on the day of the murder then the vehicle that was used would have been caught quite a few times on camera imo.

The streetview images for where Alanna's body was dumped are from 2008 and are poor quality so there's no way of checking those really.

I can post pictures to what i've found if people want, but i'm not sure if it's against the TOS?

 

[FrayedKnot]

I think they were found with the body.
Not on the body but with it. Imo

Thank you. That has been making me buggy.

 

[FrayedKnot]

Right i've been going through Streetview in Google Earth that show images from April 2013. I am trying to see what other houses in the area (Silverbrook and Bridle Trail) have home security camera's.

If the perp turned right onto Silverbrook from Babbling Brook then I have spotted at least one camera (im 99% certain it is a camera), and a possible two other camera's too. Not to mention any that are hidden or further back near the front doors that I can't see.

If the perp turned left onto Bridle Trail I have spotted at least two camera's too (99% certain), and a possible two other camera's too that i'm not sure about.

Assuming these were on and running on the day of the murder then the vehicle that was used would have been caught quite a few times on camera imo.

The streetview images for where Alanna's body was dumped are from 2008 and are poor quality so there's no way of checking those really.

I can post pictures to what i've found if people want, but i'm not sure if it's against the TOS?

I think publicly available Google images are allowed, but may want to check with a mod to be sure since I am not one, although I play one at home....:werk:

 

[FrayedKnot]

ITA There's one in every neighborhood, that creepy kid who everyone knows just isn't right. Yet, when a child turned up dead, no one posted about TH (or other possible POI's right under their nose). Too many were far more pleased to raise unwarranted suspicions about parents with no history of past bad deeds. It wasn't until after his arrest that the stories about TH came out of the woodwork. Why?

Possibly because some of those accounts were embellished.

Even well-meaning people will suddenly remember that there was something "off" about a guy once he gets arrested and face-shot for child rape and murder.

As for scrutinizing the parents initially, I think many of us go there because we go with what statistically fits. And it's usually the parents. I did not see any bashing of them here, but that is likely due to efficient moderating.

For me personally, I worried not about the family living situation, but the open-ended aspect of it because I felt that it may have exposed Alanna to someone unsavory. IMO, it was a perfectly logical place to look.

Again, nobody knows until we know, but I can't blame anyone for looking at the parents first. Sad, but true. As a parent, I hope never to go through something like this but I would expect to be scrutinized from the get-go should the worst ever happen to my lil boo.

 

[dandan08]

Wow, just found this.

The white car (not sure of make) that is parked on TH's driveway in streetview in April and is also parked on the road outside TH's house on 4/11/2013, i've found again on street view on the corner of Jan Court/Bridle Trail.

Here is the car on TH's driveway in April:

And here it is at the stop sign on Jan Court waiting to turn onto Bridle Trail:

Now if you looked at the map, and the direction the white car is coming from in Jan Court, then it leads me to believe that this person lives around that area. Other than visiting other friends then there's no reason for them to be on that road unless they lived around there. I've marked where the car can be seen, both on Jan Court and outside TH's house on Babbling Brook.

Here are direct links on Google Maps:

Streetview: http://goo.gl/maps/7VdVc

2009/2010 Google Maps view: http://goo.gl/maps/c5tUn (use Google Earth for 4/11/2013 view)

Obviously this car hasn't been mentioned in the investigation at all and it could be anyone. But it's clear whoever it is has associated with TH in mid April this year and may have sold that car since.

 

[21merc7]

As far as DNA still being on the belt buckle, I'll agree with CatFancier about how he carried her. Wrapped in the tarp, picked up by the belt, hence the DNA on the buckle where his hand would be to pick up the tarp. Couldn't wash that off once taken in whatever manner, carried, wheel barrow, auto.

We don't know if that is the ONLY DNA found, that is just what was released. We do know she was washed off. Most likely with something with bleach a.k.a. chlorine if LE was testing hot tub or pool water.

JMO

 

[skibaboo]

I believe I read Holder washed the body off with a hose! but I could be wrong maybe I got the stories mixed up....

No reports to that effect, IIRC, but I do remember someone here theorizing along those lines.

I think that may have been me, I'm sorry if I confused you. Backwoods is correct. I hadn't read anything stating it in MSM of heard rumour, I was just theorising.

Could the 'evidence of capital murder' be the hose? It's a horrible thought.. What I'm thinking would depend on when the photo was seen by LE on TH's phone, and what the ME had determined by then. I don't want to say it, unknown liquid all over the body and clothing, could she have been hosed down, ugh... inside and out with some type of bleach concoction in an attempt to destroy evidence?

Original post here http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showpost.php?p=9706952&postcount=425

 

[oceanblueeyes]

Possibly because some of those accounts were embellished.

Even well-meaning people will suddenly remember that there was something "off" about a guy once he gets arrested and face-shot for child rape and murder.

As for scrutinizing the parents initially, I think many of us go there because we go with what statistically fits. And it's usually the parents. I did not see any bashing of them here, but that is likely due to efficient moderating.

For me personally, I worried not about the family living situation, but the open-ended aspect of it because I felt that it may have exposed Alanna to someone unsavory. IMO, it was a perfectly logical place to look.

Again, nobody knows until we know, but I can't blame anyone for looking at the parents first. Sad, but true. As a parent, I hope never to go through something like this but I would expect to be scrutinized from the get-go should the worst ever happen to my lil boo.

That may be true but under these particular set of circumstances the percentages go way down when it comes to involvement of parents.

When a child has been found to be missing/kidnapped and later found to have been murdered only 14% of the time is the murderer a parent(s). 44% of abducted/murdered children are killed by a stranger and 42% of the time it is an acquaintance, neighbor, (bingo) etc.

No doubt bio parents murder their children more often than others do (approx. 440 per year) but their usual MO is pretending the child has had an 'accident' in the home and they will call 911 right away trying to fool others into thinking it was not a criminal act but merely an accident. Then the autopsy reports tell a much different story of course. Many of those cases also include prolonged abuse to the victim child and older abuse injuries are notated in the AR. A lot of these children die from prolonged abuse and neglect too.

So that is why I don't assume beforehand that the parents have involvement when the child was missing from the home at the time and was later found murdered. A SW was done of their home of course but that is SOP and has been done in just about every case I can remember when a child was reported missing. I do remember they did a SW on Jessica Ridgeway's home and all the other missing children cases I can remember.

So the cases where the child was reported missing/abducted/kidnapped are the ones I definitely sit back and wait to see what the investigation reveals rather than judging the parents beforehand without anything to base it on. Those are the cases where the guilt of the parent really drops.

imo

 

[oceanblueeyes]

I think that may have been me, I'm sorry if I confused you. Backwoods is correct. I hadn't read anything stating it in MSM of heard rumour, I was just theorising.



Original post here http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showpost.php?p=9706952&postcount=425

I think it is a capital murder case because 1) it may be premeditated 2) happening in the commission of another felony (sexual assault on a child) 3) the victim was a child 6 years of age. 4) kidnapping of an underage child.

 

[greenpalm]

I think that may have been me, I'm sorry if I confused you. Backwoods is correct. I hadn't read anything stating it in MSM of heard rumour, I was just theorising.



Original post here http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showpost.php?p=9706952&postcount=425

Could the 'evidence of capital murder' be the hose? It's a horrible thought.. What I'm thinking would depend on when the photo was seen by LE on TH's phone, and what the ME had determined by then. I don't want to say it, unknown liquid all over the body and clothing, could she have been hosed down, ugh... inside and out with some type of bleach concoction in an attempt to destroy evidence?

Yep, and I did it too, on July 29:

I'm going to assume they have reason to believe he used the hose in the crime. There may have been hose pieces in the garbage bag with Alanna, or, as I have stated earlier, they may have found photographs of the crime that he posted on the Internet somewhere. <shudder>, or they may have found trace evidence on Alanna that lead them to search for hose, particularly given that they had seen that photo earlier. We also know that Alanna was wet with an unknow liquid, could it have just been water from a hose? Did he hose her off?

(An aside: Did anyone notice there is a yellow garden hose in the Google Streetview photo of the Holder's home? It's on the ground right outside the open door of the white car.)

I think the search warrant is saying they are seizing the phone because it is capable of storing evidence of Capitol Murder, not because they KNOW it is storing that evidence, but I want to re-read that part.

 

[greenpalm]

That may be true but under these particular set of circumstances the percentages go way down when it comes to involvement of parents.

When a child has been found to be missing/kidnapped and later found to have been murdered only 14% of the time is the murderer a parent(s). 44% of abducted/murdered children are killed by a stranger and 42% of the time it is an acquaintance, neighbor, (bingo) etc.

No doubt bio parents murder their children more often than others do (approx. 440 per year) but their usual MO is pretending the child has had an 'accident' in the home and they will call 911 right away trying to fool others into thinking it was not a criminal act but merely an accident. Then the autopsy reports tell a much different story of course. Many of those cases also include prolonged abuse to the victim child and older abuse injuries are notated in the AR. A lot of these children die from prolonged abuse and neglect too.

So that is why I don't assume beforehand that the parents have involvement when the child was missing from the home at the time and was later found murdered. A SW was done of their home of course but that is SOP and has been done in just about every case I can remember when a child was reported missing. I do remember they did a SW on Jessica Ridgeway's home and all the other missing children cases I can remember.

So the cases where the child was reported missing/abducted/kidnapped are the ones I definitely sit back and wait to see what the investigation reveals rather than judging the parents beforehand without anything to base it on. Those are the cases where the guilt of the parent really drops.

imo

What you are saying is true, OceanBlue, but this case was unusual in that she was found BEFORE she was reported missing. So in the defense of those who were leaning toward it being her parents, the theory was that they were covering up an accident by making it look like abduction and murder.

Now, of course we all know that's not true, but if it had been, the "missing and abducted" statistics would have been irrelevant, because she wouldn't ever have actually been missing. That would have been a coverup. And we certainly know of cases where children go missing and parents are seriously suspected, Baby Lisa Irwin and Kyron Horman are two good examples.

ETA: I only posted this to explain the thinking. I really wasn't ever all that convinced it was the parents. I was trying to make the parent theory work, and coming up with strange ideas to make the parent theory work simply because of statistics.

 

[kkdj]

Wow, just found this.

The white car (not sure of make) that is parked on TH's driveway in streetview in April and is also parked on the road outside TH's house on 4/11/2013, i've found again on street view on the corner of Jan Court/Bridle Trail.

Here is the car on TH's driveway in April:

And here it is at the stop sign on Jan Court waiting to turn onto Bridle Trail:

Now if you looked at the map, and the direction the white car is coming from in Jan Court, then it leads me to believe that this person lives around that area. Other than visiting other friends then there's no reason for them to be on that road unless they lived around there. I've marked where the car can be seen, both on Jan Court and outside TH's house on Babbling Brook.

Here are direct links on Google Maps:

Streetview: http://goo.gl/maps/7VdVc

2009/2010 Google Maps view: http://goo.gl/maps/c5tUn (use Google Earth for 4/11/2013 view)

Obviously this car hasn't been mentioned in the investigation at all and it could be anyone. But it's clear whoever it is has associated with TH in mid April this year and may have sold that car since.

Is that the same white car that was in his driveway where someone was flipping off the cameras? Was it a google map pic im thinking of?

 

[dandan08]

Is that the same white car that was in his driveway where someone was flipping off the cameras? Was it a google map pic im thinking of?

Yes, the car is on his driveway in the top picture. I've added a picture of the occupants 'flipping off'