TX - Former Dallas Police Officer Amber Guyger, indicted for Murder of Botham Shem Jean #4

[MsFacetious]

I am feverishly trying to catch up here. In the call it doesn't appear she offered ANY life saving measures. Did she ever try stopping the bleeding, cpr...anything? I am so sorry if this has been addressed. I haven't been logging in for some time now and hope to catch up.

NO. Not at all. She told him to stay with her a couple of times but that is it. Doesn't check his vitals, put pressure on the wound to stop bleeding, just sit down and comfort him as he dies... nothing.

Unfortunately, I worry that if they can only consider a murder charge, that might not be something they can take into consideration... I don't know, or pretend to understand, the different charges and how they are applied (e.g., circumstances, intent, state of mind, etc.) but my biggest concern is that, since they have charged her with murder, the jury will not be given options if the case does not meet the necessary criteria.

I agree completely. I think that there need to be lessers included. Just like in Justine Damond's case. If they had only charged him with 1st degree and 2nd degree murder he likely would have been acquitted. That 3rd degree murder and manslaughter gave the jury what they needed to convict.

So, to answer your question, I personally ‘expect’ that an officer who realizes she just shot an innocent man should attempt to provide aid to her victim. She did not know the extent of his injuries. Just because your opinion is that “nothing could be done” does not excuse her for not trying at the time, IMO.

Yes! *I* would be assessing him and I'm not a cop. I've done so in other trauma situations and I'm not a medical professional. She had ENOUGH training to assess him and put pressure on a wound. That's way less than police training, it's more like girl scouts.

Actually engage with the patient and assess vitals for a start.

Yes. Set the phone down and put it on speaker phone. Find the wound and slow the bleeding if there is some. Check his vitals and give that information to LE. Request a helicopter. I mean ANYTHING.

This is like when the parent calls to report the child missing... and very little of the 911 call is about the child at all. It just doesn't bode well for the defendant in the case.

RBBM
Respectfully, I disagree. With regard to the 911 recording, I think the complete disregard she had for her victim does hurt her. As you noted, she was ridiculously self absorbed during the call (immediately after she killed an innocent human being).

I am very interested in hearing how her attorney will explain why she felt the need to bang on her own door and demand to be let in her own apartment. Hard to believe her story with that witness account. I hope there are others who also heard that.

Edited to fix broken quote.

I was pretty shell shocked when I posted last night... I'm more inclined to agree with you now. I still think the repeating of "I thought it was my apartment" is going to lend credibility to that statement.

However, if there is VIDEO of her walking around while he's bleeding on the floor? Omg... that's not going to go well.

I also think that "ignorance is not a defense" will likely come up.

If you don't know your buddy is going to go in a rob that store and kill a guy, but you drive him there? Still guilty.

If you fully believe that girl is 18 but you have sex with her and she's 15? STILL guilty.

It seems crazy to allow ignorance to be a defense in a case where the person is the one who pulled the trigger. Her training should have given her an ADVANTAGE of noticing details, calling for back up, etc.

I see a lot of similarities to Justine in Botham. I think that both defendants were not cut out to be cops. Neither established a threat or identified the target. They just killed them.

I realize LE have more leeway with "I THOUGHT I was in danger" but in these two specific cases I just don't think it applies. All Amber had to do was back up and call for backup. Or, back up and DOUBLE CHECK where she was.

I expect that the attorney will try to claim the banging and yelling was someone else... or discredit that witness entirely. I also hope there are multiple witnesses who heard it.

 

[NervousNellie]

Bravo @MsFacetious ! ITA!

I worry there is only one witness to the door pounding. Then it just becomes he-said-she-said. And, depending on the make up of the jury, that could go either way.

 

[mickey2942]

A lot of criminals have tried to use drug use as a defense, "I was high when I did it.". As some sort of lame justification for their actions.

JMO, but the "I was tired from working", falls into that same category for me. People have to take responsibility for their behavior.

 

[CrimeDawg123]

There have been some times when I have been very tired after being awake for long periods of time. But I can't imagine being so tired as to go into the wrong apartment and not immediately realize i was in the wrong place. I'd like to know more about the door. I understand it would close automatically. If it was ajar as she at one time claimed (or propped open) you'd think that would have raised a huge red flag to her. If it was closed, she presumably would have tried to use her key in the lock. Would he key fit in the lock? It obviously wouldn't unlock the door, but i'd like to know if it would go in. I'm pretty sure she will convicted of something. Just not sure what yet.

@PrairieWind does that mean the jury will have the option of a lesser manslaughter charge? Or will they only be able to convict on the murder charge?

 

[MCDRAW]

I think if they upgraded the charge from manslaughter to murder, they have the evidence to prove it. JMO

 

[NervousNellie]

I think if they upgraded the charge from manslaughter to murder, they have the evidence to prove it. JMO

I hope you are right. I am not as generous with my opinion in their reasoning for the upgraded charge.

 

[mickey2942]

I hope you are right. I am not as generous with my opinion in their reasoning for the upgraded charge.

I believe that this case is simmering on the back burner, and Dallas would prefer to have it gone. I wonder if the murder charge is part of the pressure for Guyger to take a manslaughter plea deal. I don't believe that Guyger will get a pass during a trial. Especially for a jury trial, she may do better with a bench trial.

I have absolutely no doubt that there are already plans for a lot of marches and demonstrations. They will be full of church folks, elderly, families...not a gang of thugs. Lots of peaceful protest, that could easily change quickly.

 

[MsFacetious]

The frantic 911 call that Amber Guyger made after she shot Botham Jean in his Dallas apartment did nothing to shake his family's belief that the Dallas police officer murdered him.

In fact, Jean's mother told The Dallas Morning News on Tuesday that hearing Guyger’s pleas for help as Jean moans and takes his final breaths made her more certain than ever.

“The call made me strengthen my view that Amber Guyger is a cold-blooded killer because she was more concerned about losing her job than my son, the value of my son,” Allison Jean said. “She does not sound like she was trying to help him at all.”

In 911 call, Amber Guyger worried more 'about losing her job than my son,' Botham Jean's mother says | Crime | Dallas News

 

[PrairieWind]

@PrairieWind does that mean the jury will have the option of a lesser manslaughter charge? Or will they only be able to convict on the murder charge?

I believe the jury will likely be allowed to consider lesser included charges.

 

[JerseyGirl]

Fired Dallas police officer Amber Guyger appeared in court on Thursday (June 6) for the first time since she killed Botham Jean, facing the judge who will oversee her murder trial.

Jury selection will begin on September 6 – exactly one year after Botham Jean’s death.

Amber Guyger, Dallas Police Officer Who Killed Botham Jean, Will Face Trial Before A Black Female Judge

 

[CrimeDawg123]

Fired Dallas police officer Amber Guyger appeared in court on Thursday (June 6) for the first time since she killed Botham Jean, facing the judge who will oversee her murder trial.

Jury selection will begin on September 6 – exactly one year after Botham Jean’s death.

Amber Guyger, Dallas Police Officer Who Killed Botham Jean, Will Face Trial Before A Black Female Judge

I cannot wait for this trial. And for justice.

 

[sloane7777]

I cannot wait for this trial. And for justice.

no way (the link)I have to say I'm surprised !!!!

 

[Rocco]

Fired Dallas police officer Amber Guyger appeared in court on Thursday (June 6) for the first time since she killed Botham Jean, facing the judge who will oversee her murder trial.

Jury selection will begin on September 6 – exactly one year after Botham Jean’s death.

Amber Guyger, Dallas Police Officer Who Killed Botham Jean, Will Face Trial Before A Black Female Judge

I wonder what the point was in mentioning the Judge's skin color in the headline of the article.

What difference does it make?

 

[angelainwi]

I wonder what the point was in mentioning the Judge's skin color in the headline of the article.

What difference does it make?

I think because the article was from bet.com

 

[Gardenista]

New filings in Amber Guyger murder trial reveal legal strategy

 

[YESorNO]

Amber Guyger's attorneys want her murder trial for killing Botham Jean moved out of Dallas

July 8, 2019

"Fired Dallas police Officer Amber Guyger's attorneys asked a judge Monday to move her murder trial out of Dallas, citing "media hysteria" surrounding the fatal shooting of Botham Jean....

Guyger's attorneys, Robert Rogers, Toby Shook and Michael Mowla, argued in their court filing that the "publicity surrounding this case has been prejudicial and inflammatory." Jean's death was international news, and area media outlets published a stream of stories after his death. Guyger's attorneys cited 297 articles about Guyger and Jean in their motion...

The trial is scheduled to start Sept. 23. Jury selection is slated to begin on the first anniversary of Jean's death. "

Amber Guyger's attorneys want her murder trial for killing Botham Jean moved out of Dallas | Crime | Dallas News

(Botham Jean [Instagram])

 

[Via Marple]

Amber Guyger's attorneys want her murder trial for killing Botham Jean moved out of Dallas

July 8, 2019

"Fired Dallas police Officer Amber Guyger's attorneys asked a judge Monday to move her murder trial out of Dallas, citing "media hysteria" surrounding the fatal shooting of Botham Jean....

Guyger's attorneys, Robert Rogers, Toby Shook and Michael Mowla, argued in their court filing that the "publicity surrounding this case has been prejudicial and inflammatory." Jean's death was international news, and area media outlets published a stream of stories after his death. Guyger's attorneys cited 297 articles about Guyger and Jean in their motion...

The trial is scheduled to start Sept. 23. Jury selection is slated to begin on the first anniversary of Jean's death. "

Amber Guyger's attorneys want her murder trial for killing Botham Jean moved out of Dallas | Crime | Dallas News

(Botham Jean [Instagram])

Media hysteria, or public outrage?

Try moving it to "robot land" then.....

 

[PrairieWind]

Media hysteria, or public outrage?

Try moving it to "robot land" then.....

I don't think that they will succeed in getting a change of venue. The media coverage hasn't been that crazy.

 

[sloane7777]

She should have thought about that when she was shooting first asking questions later, she shot and killed someone here , trial should be HERE! IMO

 

[Via Marple]

She should have thought about that when she was shooting first asking questions later, she shot and killed someone here , trial should be HERE! IMO

Not to mention, AG had happily used (social) media herself to advocate her agendas.... Live by the sword, die by the sword......