TX - Sandra Bland, 28, found dead in jail cell, Waller County, 13 July 2015 #1

[katydid23]

Being LE is 'one of the safest jobs in America?' oh, ok...any links?

 

[bessie]

Meyer said it is standard practice to have someone put out their cigarette.

“No one, including a police officer, wants to get a burning cigarette jammed into their face or eye; it’s basic procedure,” he said.

http://www.latimes.com/nation/la-na-sandra-bland-arrest-experts-20150722-story.html#page=1

By that logic, it also should be basic procedure to request that a subject immediately clip his/her fingernails. Just speaking for li'l ole me, I could more damage, more swiftly, with ten of those than a single cigarette. And what about keys? They pose as much a risk as a cigarette. Can a citizen routinely be commanded to surrender the vehicle keys, as well? That subject might be worthy of some research.

In my personal and humble opinion, any discourse on this topic would benefit if the participants would agree to 1) separate the initial events from the tragic aftermath; and, 2) set aside the issue of race. Then we'd be left to wrestle over gender, which might prove to be the more significant factor to this situation.

JMO

---

Sandra Bland, 28, pre-mortem

http://www.cnn.com/2015/07/22/us/texas-sandra-bland-arrest/

 

[nomoresorrow]

The 10 Deadliest Jobs in America: *Note: It ain't LEO's...

1. Logging workers
2. Fishers and related fishing workers
3. Aircraft pilot and flight engineers
4. Roofers
5. Structural iron and steel workers
6. Refuse and recyclable material collectors
7. Electrical power-line installers and repairers
8. Drivers/sales workers and truck drivers
9. Farmers, ranchers, and other agricultural managers
10. Construction laborers

http://www.forbes.com/sites/jacquelynsmith/2013/08/22/americas-10-deadliest-jobs-2/

 

[KaaBoom]

And so, her initial arrest in the eyes of the officer was for the traffic violation. (I don't think that someone who is pulled over by a traffic cop is de facto under arrest, but that is what he says in the dashcam video.)

Actually that pretty much is the truth of the matter. As soon as they turn on their flashing red and blue lights, you are under arrest. You are no longer free to go about your business. Thats the same as being under arrest. Thats the way I have always approached being stopped by the police and it has helped me a lot. For example when they ask me "You understand that you are not under arrest, right?" I respond that I do not know that. I'm not free to go, so I believe I am under arrest. That always ends the conversation right there.

 

[popsicle]

And they do that very well. LE is one of the safest jobs in America. It is very safe to arrest an unarmed black woman for refusing to put out a cigarette, rather then go out and arrest a real criminal who might be armed and dangerous. So instead of fighting crime, we have gutless cops who harass and arrest law abiding citizens, who are doing nothing wrong.

With a National avg of 3.5 and LE being 18.6, I don't think it is one of the safest by a long shot. It isn't one of the deadliest per 100k but it sure is not one of the safest in America.

http://www.npr.org/sections/money/2013/01/08/168897140/the-deadliest-jobs-in-america-in-one-graphic

http://www.bls.gov/iif/oshwc/cfoi/cfoi_rates_2011hb.pdf

 

[nomoresorrow]

How Dangerous is it to be a Cop? By the numbers...

"In 2013, out of approximately 900,000 sworn officers, just 100 died from a job-related injury. That's about 11.1 per 100,000, or a rate of 0.01%.

Policing doesn't even make it into the top 10 most dangerous American professions. Logging has a fatality rate 11 times higher, at 127.8 per 100,000. Fishing: 117 per 100,000. Pilot/flight engineer: 53.4 per 100,000. It's twice as dangerous to be a truck driver as a cop—at 22.1 per 100,000."

http://fee.org/freeman/detail/by-the-numbers-how-dangerous-is-it-to-be-a-cop

 

[katydid23]

How Dangerous is it to be a Cop? By the numbers...

"In 2013, out of approximately 900,000 sworn officers, just 100 died from a job-related injury. That's about 11.1 per 100,000, or a rate of 0.01%.

Policing doesn't even make it into the top 10 most dangerous American professions. Logging has a fatality rate 11 times higher, at 127.8 per 100,000. Fishing: 117 per 100,000. Pilot/flight engineer: 53.4 per 100,000. It's twice as dangerous to be a truck driver as a cop—at 22.1 per 100,000."

http://fee.org/freeman/detail/by-the-numbers-how-dangerous-is-it-to-be-a-cop

It is not just 'deaths' that are the problem. LEOs are assaulted and injured in pretty high numbers.

 

[katydid23]

How Dangerous is it to be a Cop? By the numbers...

"In 2013, out of approximately 900,000 sworn officers, just 100 died from a job-related injury. That's about 11.1 per 100,000, or a rate of 0.01%.

Policing doesn't even make it into the top 10 most dangerous American professions. Logging has a fatality rate 11 times higher, at 127.8 per 100,000. Fishing: 117 per 100,000. Pilot/flight engineer: 53.4 per 100,000. It's twice as dangerous to be a truck driver as a cop—at 22.1 per 100,000."

http://fee.org/freeman/detail/by-the-numbers-how-dangerous-is-it-to-be-a-cop

Getting killed is a hazard in many occupations, but there is one glaring difference between death risks of law enforcement officers and those of other dangerous occupations: only police officers face the threat of murder as a part of their job. No one is out trying to kill fisherman or loggers or garbage collectors.

Jan 15, 2015


Police Work Isn't as Dangerous as You May Think | Blake ...
www.huffingtonpost.com/.../how-dangerous-is-police-...

 

[nomoresorrow]

With a National avg of 3.5 and LE being 18.6, I don't think it is one of the safest by a long shot. It isn't one of the deadliest per 100k but it sure is not one of the safest in America.

http://www.npr.org/sections/money/2013/01/08/168897140/the-deadliest-jobs-in-america-in-one-graphic

http://www.bls.gov/iif/oshwc/cfoi/cfoi_rates_2011hb.pdf

It may not be "one of the safest" (semantics...), but it is far below the rate of death for many other occupations; many occupations that I have worked in over the years and have personal lost family members and friends who worked in some of these "FAR more dangerous" occupations (fishing industry, iron worker (2), lineman, construction workers (2).

 

[KaaBoom]

I guess I need to listen to that part. I didn't listen to the whole 49 minute video.

How can someone be under arrest when they are pulled over? They are being lawfully detained for sure but they are not under arrest in my opinion.

I can see the resisting arrest when she wouldn't comply to his commands. But then where they lawful commands?

I'm not sure. JMO

What is the difference between being under arrest and being lawfully detained?

1 arrest
verb ar·rest \ə-ˈrest\
: to use the power of the law to take and keep (someone, such as a criminal)

: to stop the progress or movement of (something)

: to attract and hold the attention of (someone or something)

http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/arrest

 

[KaaBoom]

I did watch the dashcam video.

I guess I may have a different definition of "respectful." Sandra wasn't very respectful IMO.

Asserted your rights ≠ disrespect.

 

[oceanblueeyes]

With a National avg of 3.5 and LE being 18.6, I don't think it is one of the safest by a long shot. It isn't one of the deadliest per 100k but it sure is not one of the safest in America.

http://www.npr.org/sections/money/2013/01/08/168897140/the-deadliest-jobs-in-america-in-one-graphic

http://www.bls.gov/iif/oshwc/cfoi/cfoi_rates_2011hb.pdf

And this doesn't include police officers who are attacked each year. Do you have a link showing how many of them are attacked per year Pops? I doubt in the other categories those professions are attacked by another person. Some of the attacks on police officers every year are life threatening injuries.

Here statistics really don't mean anything to this officer's family who will now have to bury him because he was mowed down yesterday in the line of duty.

Hayward police sergeant killed during traffic stop

http://kron4.com/2015/07/22/major-police-activity-in-hayward/


IMO

 

[nomoresorrow]

(BBM)

Getting killed is a hazard in many occupations, but there is one glaring difference between death risks of law enforcement officers and those of other dangerous occupations: only police officers face the threat of murder as a part of their job. No one is out trying to kill fisherman or loggers or garbage collectors.

Jan 15, 2015


Police Work Isn't as Dangerous as You May Think | Blake ...
www.huffingtonpost.com/.../how-dangerous-is-police-...

Not True

"The second-highest cause of worker fatalities was assaults and violent acts, which accounted for 18% of deaths."

"Violence took the lives of 767 workers last year; with 463 homicides and 225 suicides. (Work-related suicides declined by 10% from 2011 totals, but violence accounted for about 17% of all fatal work injuries in 2012.) Shootings were the most frequent manner of death in both."

"There were 142 multiple-fatality incidents–incidents where more than one worker was killed–in 2012, in which 341 workers died."

In stark contrast...
"Since 1900, only 18,781 police officers have died from any work-related injury. That's an average of 164 a year. In absolute terms, officer fatalities peaked in 1930 (during alcohol prohibition) at 297, spiking again in the 1970s before steadily declining since.

If you look at police fatalities adjusted for the US population, the decline is even starker. 2013 was the safest year for American policing since 1875. In 2013, out of approximately 900,000 sworn officers, just 100 died from a job-related injury. That's about 11.1 per 100,000, or a rate of 0.01%."

http://www.forbes.com/sites/jacquelynsmith/2013/08/22/americas-10-deadliest-jobs-2/
http://fee.org/freeman/detail/by-the-numbers-how-dangerous-is-it-to-be-a-cop

 

[nomoresorrow]

No one is saying that police officers don't get killed; the claim was made that it was one of the most dangerous jobs/occupations. I realize that the actual facts don't fit in with the usual posters' narrative who routinely choose to simply ignore the truth and continue posting their pro-LE agenda/the civilian is always wrong, especially a black civilian... rhetoric. MO ~

*Too bad I can't stay and post all day - gotta job to get to

 

[KaaBoom]

WS is (was) an LE friendly/supporting site.

Here we go again. From the front page. Websleuths Crime Sleuthing Community Welcome to the Websleuths Crime Sleuthing Community. Can you point me to anything that says this is a law enforcement support site, or anything that says we can't or shouldn't sleuth law enforcement?

 

[KaaBoom]

The guy was an arrogant jerk. That's not against the law, and that's NOT murder.

It's abuse of power.

 

[katydid23]

Do you really want to keep doing this, because I can keep posting facts WITH LINKS TO BACK THEM UP to dispute your unfounded - WITHOUT FACTUAL LINKS - personal claims?

One of your links is from a left wing blog called The FreeMan, which is a very anti-LE site.

Here are some statistics that I will link:

The National Law Enforcement Officers Memorial Fund (NLEOMF) reports that a total of 1,501 law-enforcement officers died in the line of duty during the past ten years, an average of one death every 58 hours, or 150 per year. These include local and state police officers, federal officers, correctional officers, and military law-enforcement officers. Fact: Last year, 100 law-enforcement officers were killed. On average, over the past decade, there have been 58,261 assaults against law enforcement each year, resulting in 15,658 injuries. Fact: New York City has lost more officers in the line of duty than any other department, with 697 deaths. Texas has lost 1,675 officers, more than any other state. Just this week, NLEOMF released preliminary fatality statistics from August 2013 to August 2014. Total fatalities are up 14 percent, from 63 last year to 72 this year. “Five officers were killed in ambushes, which continue to be a major threat to law enforcement safety,” the group notes.


http://www.nleomf.org/facts/officer-fatalities-data/daifacts.html

Averages over the Last Decade

149 deaths per year 58,930 assaults per year 15,404 injuries per year

 

[ellie b]

When I first watched the dashcam video, last night, I must admit that I was only regarding it as a police officer pulling over a motorist and the actions that ensued. I am only commenting on what was shown and not the off camera stuff or the days after. I thought the police officer acted totally inappropriately, I didn't hear her swear or abuse him before he threatened to light her up, he was very unprofessional and bullying in my opinion. I don't understand that it matters what race either of them was, if she had been chinese and he was black it wouldn't have changed my opinions of his actions. I have the utmost respect for the police generally, but would never condone his actions (I am talking about what I saw recorded on the video), I would be extremely concerned if cops in my area behaved in that manner and I would also be extremely concerned and surprised if anyone from around here tried to justify his actions. I live on a small island of approx 70,000 people and we have relatively little serious crime, I am not aware of any racist problems at all and we have various nationalities and creeds come here to work. Neither bullying by police or any other authorities would be tolerated and neither would racism, so maybe that is why my viewpoint and opinion on this matter is different to people living in and experiencing a different part of the world.

 

[KaaBoom]

I would have to answer A with maybe and B with arrested yes, charged no.

A)I think that officers have the right to ask people to get out of their car during a traffic stop. When you don't comply it can be a problem. But sometimes the officer should wait for backup and calmly access the situation before physically removing the driver from the car.

I think that police should have to have a legitimate reason to ask people to get out of their car. He had none.

 

[katydid23]

No one is saying that police officers don't get killed; the claim was made that it was one of the most dangerous jobs/occupations. I realize that the actual facts don't fit in with the usual posters' narrative who routinely choose to simply ignore the truth and continue posting their pro-LE agenda/the civilian is always wrong, especially a black civilian... rhetoric. MO ~

*Too bad I can't stay and post all day - gotta job to get to

BBM


Actually, I think you got that backwards. Someone posted that LE was one of Americas safest jobs. And I asked for a link.

I didn't see anyone claim it was one of the MOST dangerous.