UK UK - Andrew Gosden, 14, Doncaster, South Yorks, 14 Sep 2007 #2

[callmehenry]

Was it a direct train to London? Because what’s to say he didn’t get off at an earlier stop with no cctv (or cctv that worked) hence why no one saw him in London? OR is there cctv of him getting off the train at London?

 

[Sarahlou]

Was it a direct train to London? Because what’s to say he didn’t get off at an earlier stop with no cctv (or cctv that worked) hence why no one saw him in London? OR is there cctv of him getting off the train at London?

He was last seen on CCTV leaving King's Cross station in London.

 

[Inspector Evans]

Wearing FFAF in casual wear and then the Slipknot shirt on the final day he was seen, he certainly liked his music so I think a gig happening down there could've tempted him down and then he met someone around the venue with bad intentions. Maybe went down, didn't realise gig was sold out and a tout promised him a ticket but took him away instead?

Of course with Andrew disappearing also the clothes and his PSP were seemingly never seen again. Wonder if there were any searches of waste disposal to see if any shirts turned up in rubbish but then you just wouldn't know which area to search I guess as he could've gone anywhere after leaving XC.

 

[callmehenry]

He was last seen on CCTV leaving King's Cross station in London.

Ah my apologies, I didn’t realise that

 

[ChatteringBirds]

Ah my apologies, I didn’t realise that

It took LE at the time so long to find the footage of him leaving King's Cross station in London that they weren't able to find additional CCTV footage showing where he went next, though.

In the years that have followed, a new team has his case, but the original team made critical errors, IMO. He definitely made it to London and then....?

 

[callmehenry]

It took LE at the time so long to find the footage of him leaving King's Cross station in London that they weren't able to find additional CCTV footage showing where he went next, though.

In the years that have followed, a new team has his case, but the original team made critical errors, IMO. He definitely made it to London and then....?

I’ve been reading up on the case after I made my last post… how frustrating for his family that LE placed all focus on them as opposed to trying to establish where in London he could have gone.

 

[Inspector Evans]

A real shame. Even the tip off about him possibly eating in Pizza Express an hour or two later would've given some clues with the CCTV surrounding that chain as to which direction he headed off next and then you could've started to form an electronic trial of those hours.

Instead was too late to retrieve further CCTV and we can only guess.

 

[tes1984]

I see a scenario where a couple of 20 something paedophiles ask him what he's up to. He says he's going to a concert, or planning to buy computer games.

They ask Andrew if he wants a VIP concert ticket, or to meet their mate who works at Virgin and gets half price computer games.

He says ok and off they all go. The two guys only really get away with it because of the CCTV issues.

 

[tes1984]

If the pizza sighting is accurate, then Andrew didn't have someone meeting him when he got off the train. He's not in a rush. Eating in, rather than buying a pizza slice from a street vendor.

I'm no expert in this case, but I favour a random encounter, rather than a planned one.

 

[Konstantin]

I see a scenario where a couple of 20 something paedophiles ask him what he's up to. He says he's going to a concert, or planning to buy computer games.

They ask Andrew if he wants a VIP concert ticket, or to meet their mate who works at Virgin and gets half price computer games.

He says ok and off they all go. The two guys only really get away with it because of the CCTV issues.

Reading between the lines I think this is what happened and what the police suspect happened.

It is not a murder enquiry even though AG has been missing for a very long time with no trace that we know of.

The two men who were arrested a while back and investigated - and yes they were released without charge - were arrested for a reason. There was something to possibly link them to AG after all this time and that is most likely some connection somehow to CSAM that the police think could include AG. Obviously as AG would now be an adult that would be historical material and difficult to prove that this was AG although to make arrests they would have had to be fairly sure that there was a high probability.

AG was a teenager and his mum and dad just won't have known him as well as they thought they did because he was no longer the little boy who was transparent to them. He had secrets. It is perfectly obvious he was secretive because he went off to London without telling them. They did not suspect anything at all. He kept that secret really well. His dad says AG told him he had lost his mobile, well teenagers lie. It is very easy to conceal the sorts of small mobiles we had back then. SIM cards were easy to come by and pay as you go could be arranged by someone else. Just because his dad says AG did not have a phone does not mean he did not. In fact, that is pretty meaningless.

I get that it is very hard for AG's dad, who seems a fantastic bloke, to get that he didn't know what his beloved son was up to but it is very common.

AG was not that happy at school, there are rumours he had some sort of "black book" that he wrote names of people he didn't like in. That sounds like a lonely boy who doesn't really fit with his peers. He didn't have close friends. He was intellectually smart, a geek but not street smart. He would have stuck out a bit even at a nice school. Sure, his sister was involved in anti bullying but AG was a teenage boy and it's not surprising he didn't confide in her about his personal life. He might have been struggling with or realising his sexuality, there might be a good reason why his dad mentioned that if AG is gay, the family is accepting of that. Why say that? There are many ways in which he was quite vulnerable and probably an easy target.

AG's story is very sad and if he is out there, I hope that he is safe and well and able to get support and help.

 

[davidt]

Reading between the lines I think this is what happened and what the police suspect happened.

It is not a murder enquiry even though AG has been missing for a very long time with no trace that we know of.

The two men who were arrested a while back and investigated - and yes they were released without charge - were arrested for a reason. There was something to possibly link them to AG after all this time and that is most likely some connection somehow to CSAM that the police think could include AG. Obviously as AG would now be an adult that would be historical material and difficult to prove that this was AG although to make arrests they would have had to be fairly sure that there was a high probability.

AG was a teenager and his mum and dad just won't have known him as well as they thought they did because he was no longer the little boy who was transparent to them. He had secrets. It is perfectly obvious he was secretive because he went off to London without telling them. They did not suspect anything at all. He kept that secret really well. His dad says AG told him he had lost his mobile, well teenagers lie. It is very easy to conceal the sorts of small mobiles we had back then. SIM cards were easy to come by and pay as you go could be arranged by someone else. Just because his dad says AG did not have a phone does not mean he did not. In fact, that is pretty meaningless.

I get that it is very hard for AG's dad, who seems a fantastic bloke, to get that he didn't know what his beloved son was up to but it is very common.

AG was not that happy at school, there are rumours he had some sort of "black book" that he wrote names of people he didn't like in. That sounds like a lonely boy who doesn't really fit with his peers. He didn't have close friends. He was intellectually smart, a geek but not street smart. He would have stuck out a bit even at a nice school. Sure, his sister was involved in anti bullying but AG was a teenage boy and it's not surprising he didn't confide in her about his personal life. He might have been struggling with or realising his sexuality, there might be a good reason why his dad mentioned that if AG is gay, the family is accepting of that. Why say that? There are many ways in which he was quite vulnerable and probably an easy target.

AG's story is very sad and if he is out there, I hope that he is safe and well and able to get support and help.

I agree with just about every you say. The two men arrested I believe were arrested on suspicion of hunan trafficking. The police at the time said it would take some time to examine a number of devices they had seized. To me that indicates perhaps images were involved? They were released without charge. However as you say they were arrested for a reason and the police could have arrested them without publicly linking them to AG. That they did so does make it feel like there was something going on.

In terms of AGs disappearance I've always considered it to be a two part mystery.

Part 1 is what was Andrew up to that day? Truth is we haven't a clue. There's no hard evidence all and all we can do is speculate.

Part 2 is what eventually happened to him and whether it is directly related to what Andrew was up to or if it was a random occurrence that had nothing to do with his trip. I've tended to lean towards random occurrence but can't rule out accident, suicide, meeting someone etc, etc.

I agree parents are not necessarily as much in the know about their children as they'd like to think they are. As for his school its quite hard to form an accurate picture of how AG felt about it. There are claims he'd cut himself off from all but a few friends. I've seen a few rumours about bullying. It's all quite vague and unsubstantiated in the main though. He apparently didn't socialise with school friends outside of school.

Bottom line really is that there's nothing of note to go on. There remains numerous permutations of what Andrew was up to and what eventually happened to him. And you can't rule any of them in or out as things stand.

 

[davidt]

It strikes me that Andrew was irritable that morning. It doesn't sound like he was looking forward to something. I wonder if he was fed up and it was a spur of the moment decision to bunk off school.

There are some reports that Andrew was irritable 'in the days leading up to his disappearance ". Was something festering? I've suggested previously perhaps this was a spur of the moment decision by Andrew. Perhaps this was more about avoiding school than having other plans. That he could genuinely have left for school that morning then changed his mind on the way. It would explain the total lack of anything indicating advance planning. Also after Andrew returned home after bunking school it might explain why he didn't take his birthday money or console charger. Perhaps at that stage he'd just bunked off and didn't have any plans as such. Perhaps when he left the house the second time he didn't know what he was going to do. Then on a whim decided to London. Again perhaps he didn't want to go back to the house again thinking the school may have already alerted this parents?

So draws money from a cash machine instead. Pure speculation of course but its difficult to rule anything out.

 

[Markybug]

Any more information on Andrew having had a mobile but “lost” it ?

 

[davidt]

Any more information on Andrew having had a mobile but “lost” it ?

I'm only aware he was said to have lost it and that he didn't want another one. No idea how or when he lost it. Did find it a little odd he didn't want another but it does sound like, games console apart, he had little interest in the Internet and tech. Is it known approximately when he lost it?

 

[dotr]

Disappearance of Andrew Gosden - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

''Gosden had light brown hair but was planning to dye it black before he disappeared''.

''Gosden owned a couple of mobile phones between the ages of ten and twelve but he rarely used them and subsequently lost them. He was given a new phone for his twelfth birthday, but also rarely used this and did not want to replace it when he lost it months before his disappearance.When his parents offered to replace the lost phones he stated that he would prefer a new Xbox''

 

[BethAnn777]

How many phones can one kid lose? Does that not seem strange? In my experience, it is strange he lost more than one phone. Losing one phone is totally understandable, but more than one? If Andrew wasn’t known to lose other things, that just seems wild. What else could have happened to the phones besides losing them? Selling them is the first thing that came to mind. What would he use the money for? I don’t think drugs, but cigarettes perhaps? I smoked when I was young and a nicotine addiction can happen very quickly and when you don’t have it, the withdraw is horrible. The mood swings alone were horrible.

 

[Inspector Evans]

Did lost them mean he just mislead it in the house and wasn't bothered about finding it or he purposely threw the phones in a bin or outside?

I presume the latest one before his disappearance was recovered just to see what contacts he had beyond close family and if there was any links to explore to London.

 

[davidt]

How many phones can one kid lose? Does that not seem strange? In my experience, it is strange he lost more than one phone. Losing one phone is totally understandable, but more than one? If Andrew wasn’t known to lose other things, that just seems wild. What else could have happened to the phones besides losing them? Selling them is the first thing that came to mind. What would he use the money for? I don’t think drugs, but cigarettes perhaps? I smoked when I was young and a nicotine addiction can happen very quickly and when you don’t have it, the withdraw is horrible. The mood swings alone were horrible.

If I'm reading it correctly he apparently lost at least three phones?

 

[davidt]

Did lost them mean he just mislead it in the house and wasn't bothered about finding it or he purposely threw the phones in a bin or outside?

I presume the latest one before his disappearance was recovered just to see what contacts he had beyond close family and if there was any links to explore to London.

Sounds like that one was lost as well. Is it known if any were on contracts or if they were PAYG.

 

[Charlot123]

How many phones can one kid lose? Does that not seem strange? In my experience, it is strange he lost more than one phone. Losing one phone is totally understandable, but more than one? If Andrew wasn’t known to lose other things, that just seems wild. What else could have happened to the phones besides losing them? Selling them is the first thing that came to mind. What would he use the money for? I don’t think drugs, but cigarettes perhaps? I smoked when I was young and a nicotine addiction can happen very quickly and when you don’t have it, the withdraw is horrible. The mood swings alone were horrible.

It doesn’t sound that strange to me. Unless we are talking about the first iPhone, or maybe Blackberry, most old mobile phones were cheaper and lighter. It was easier to lose them, they could even fall out of the pocket and mostly, one would not check if they had phones on them before leaving. If he asked for an Xbox it just means that a cellphone didn’t yet replace a computer for him. Unless someone was teasing/bullying him? This is always a possibility.