UK - Constance Marten & Mark Gordon charged, Newborn (found deceased), Bolton Greater Manchester, 5 Jan 2023 #4

[JerseyGirl]

Aristocrat and partner face manslaughter trial after baby found dead in woods

Mark Gordon and Constance Marten are both charged with manslaughter of their baby Victoria, concealment of the birth of a child and perverting the course of justice

www.independent.co.uk

 

[Observe_dont_Absorb]

It will be interesting to see how they will be after a few weeks in jail. Maybe more cooperative?

I often suspect people are quite heavily medicated in prison and this can result in a shift in demeanour, could be wrong.

 

[gerbil]

I often suspect people are quite heavily medicated in prison and this can result in a shift in demeanour, could be wrong.

By the authorities? In the UK?

 

[jackal67]

I often suspect people are quite heavily medicated in prison and this can result in a shift in demeanour, could be wrong.

no that doesn't happen. They will only be allowed medication that was already prescribed before they go into prison or anything that the prison doctors may prescribe for a new medical condition diagnosed by prison doctors. People are only medicated against their will it they have been sectioned under the mental health act and even then it will be strictly monitored

 

[Cherwell]

Honestly I'm not remotely surprised the trial won't happen for 8 months.

Well, I'm surprised that there's such a long delay to the plea hearing. If they both pleaded guilty there wouldn't be any need for a trial, would there? Unlikely, perhaps, but who knows for sure.

 

[Alyce]

The pair were told off by custody officers for communicating during a court hearing today. During the short hearing, the couple were seen smiling at one another and interacting.

The custody officers were seen telling the couple to stop interacting on at least two occasions.

Constance Marten and Mark Gordon told off for smiling in court hearing

Constance Marten and Mark Gordon are charged with the manslaughter of baby Victoria, who was found dead in Brighton on March 1 after a two-day search.

www.birminghammail.co.uk

 

[Observe_dont_Absorb]

no that doesn't happen. They will only be allowed medication that was already prescribed before they go into prison or anything that the prison doctors may prescribe for a new medical condition diagnosed by prison doctors. People are only medicated against their will it they have been sectioned under the mental health act and even then it will be strictly monitored

I didn't mean against their wishes. Just that a lot of people arrive in custody in chaotic or disheveled states and often they either have longstanding mental health problems that they've not been attending to and / or they're in withdrawal from frequent substance use. So I think that plenty of prisoners need medication once they're in the custody of the authorities and have access to a doctor. Not in any way saying this is the case here with CM or MG -but- I do often think to myself that the general demeanour of defendants could maybe be explained by medications. Especially when people are accused in the media of 'appearing emotionless' in the face of their alleged crimes / sentencing.

 

[JTT]

Daily Courtroom List for Friday 31 March 2023​

FINAL 1 ​ CENTRAL CRIMINAL COURT Court 1 - sitting at 09:45 am THE COMMON SERJEANT OF LONDON​ Plea and Trial Preparation T20237104 GORDON Mark A 47CC0611323 SUSWM CPS MARTEN Constance 47CC0611323 DTA - ALL PARTIES TO ATTEND IN PERSON

www.courtserve.net

What is "SUSWM"?

 

[JTT]

The pair are due back in the dock at the Old Bailey on Friday, where they may be asked to enter pleas to the charges.

the couple are accused of manslaughter by having “unlawfully killed baby Victoria”.

It is said the birth was concealed between January 27 and February 27,
and they are accused of “doing an act or acts by concealing the death of baby Victoria which had a tendency to pervert the course of public justice.”

Marten is being represented in the legal proceedings by leading barrister Lewis Power KC.

Constance Marten to stand trial next year over baby death charge

Aristocrat Constance Marten and her boyfriend will face a trial next January over allegations they killed a new-born baby girl and left the body in an abandoned shed.

www.standard.co.uk

"They are due to enter pleas on August 18, with a trial set for January 2, 2024."

Why on earth has such a long delay been scheduled for the trial?

 

[JTT]

The pair were told off by custody officers for communicating during a court hearing today. During the short hearing, the couple were seen smiling at one another and interacting.

The custody officers were seen telling the couple to stop interacting on at least two occasions.

Constance Marten and Mark Gordon told off for smiling in court hearing

Constance Marten and Mark Gordon are charged with the manslaughter of baby Victoria, who was found dead in Brighton on March 1 after a two-day search.

www.birminghammail.co.uk

They are the principals for the defence and they should be allowed to sit next to each other and confer as they feel necessary. If there is a reason to the contrary - and I can't think of what it might be - it should be told to the judge who can then rule appropriately.

 

[JTT]

Well, I'm surprised that there's such a long delay to the plea hearing. If they both pleaded guilty there wouldn't be any need for a trial, would there? Unlikely, perhaps, but who knows for sure.

The judge's assumption in setting a provisional trial date is that they will plead not guilty (to at least one charge), which quite possibly has already been indicated by the defence to the prosecution.

 

[Cuko]

Is there a UK lawyer on here who can explain the precise difference between manslaughter and gross negligence manslaughter, please?

 

[Alyce]

What is "SUSWM"?

At a rough guess, I would say it indicates whichever Magistrates Court they attended for their initial hearing.
If you look at court lists, there are many similar initials against each case.

They attended Crawley Magistrates, which is Sussex.

Just so this is completely clear - this is MOO and JMO -

 

[JennieM]

The pair were told off by custody officers for communicating during a court hearing today. During the short hearing, the couple were seen smiling at one another and interacting.

The custody officers were seen telling the couple to stop interacting on at least two occasions.

Constance Marten and Mark Gordon told off for smiling in court hearing

Constance Marten and Mark Gordon are charged with the manslaughter of baby Victoria, who was found dead in Brighton on March 1 after a two-day search.

www.birminghammail.co.uk

Imagine going to court for allegedly being responsible for the death of a baby and treating like a social meet-up.

 

[kittythehare]

An initial post-mortem examination was unable to establish the cause of the child's death and it is thought tests are ongoing.

Aristocrat and lover who went on run 'told off' for smiling before trial

Aristocrat Constance Marten and her partner Mark Gordon have been told they will face a trial at the Old Bailey early next year after a brief court appearance this morning

www.mirror.co.uk

An initial post-mortem examination was unable to establish the cause of the child's death and it is thought tests are ongoing.

https://www.itv.com/news/meridian/2023-03-31/constance-marten-and-mark-gordon-face-trial-over-baby-girls-death

Investigators have not publicly established how she died, but believe it may have happened "some time" before the remains were discovered on 1 March.

Constance Marten and Mark Gordon: Couple to stand trial over baby's death

Constance Marten and Mark Gordon are accused of manslaughter over the death of baby Victoria

www.bbc.com

 

[Cherwell]

The judge's assumption in setting a provisional trial date is that they will plead not guilty (to at least one charge), which quite possibly has already been indicated by the defence to the prosecution.

Yes, I realise that. It was the long delay to the plea hearing that surprised me, not the trial date.

 

[kittythehare]

Suppose it is found that the child died of natural or congenital causes?
She's got one of the smartest lawyers in the UK.
What is going on here?

 

[gerbil]

The concealing a birth and perverting the course of justice charges would still stand, at least.

 

[Observant-ADHD-ENFP-BSc]

What is "SUSWM"?

I'm guessing it could be Sussex Women. As in a Sussex Women's prison? or it could be West Sussex Magistrates. As Crawley is in West Sussex (Brighton is East Sussex)

 

[Alyce]

A couple were 'told off' for smiling at each other during a court appearance in which they were told they will face a trial early next year over the death of their baby daughter.

During today's hearing the pair were seen smiling at each other, causing the custody officers to tell them to stop interacting with one another.

Aristocrat and lover who went on run 'told off' for smiling before trial

Aristocrat Constance Marten and her partner Mark Gordon have been told they will face a trial at the Old Bailey early next year after a brief court appearance this morning

www.mirror.co.uk

Both were reprimanded by custody officers for interacting with one another on at least two occasions after exchanging smiles

Constance Marten and boyfriend told off for smiling in court

The couple went missing for more than 50 days before they were eventually found - but it was too late for little Victoria.

www.express.co.uk