UK - Libby Squire, 21, last seen outside Welly club, Hull, 31 Jan 2019 *ARREST* #18

[Lucy6226]

Let's not forget that the crimes which he has been charged with very likely don't represent the whole extent of his offending, either. The 'sketch' incident is missing, at the very least.

Yes I was thinking I wonder how many more women he watched who had no idea he was there...before he obviously got off on being caught

 

[JosieJo]

I'm worried at the minute that they can prove he killed her rather than raping her and her running off into the water

 

[Tortoise]

I have just started to follow this case and trial in any detail so I may have missed out on large chunks of information, but if that is all the prosecution have on him, it looks like it will be difficult to prove murder conclusively. Rape yes, premeditated rape yes, but murder .....? What does anyone else think?

Yes, I don't think they've proven Libby was murdered. No mention even of drag marks on the ground or on her body.

 

[Lucy6226]

I have just started to follow this case and trial in any detail so I may have missed out on large chunks of information, but if that is all the prosecution have on him, it looks like it will be difficult to prove murder conclusively. Rape yes, premeditated rape yes, but murder .....? What does anyone else think?

I'm not convinced he did intend to murder her, why suddenly jump up to rape and straight to murder. I think he tried to stop her screaming and ended up killing her. Left her. Panicked when realised about his DNA and thought putting her in the water to get rid of the evidence. Either way if he didn't killer her and left her in the state she was in them she wouldn't have survived the cold

 

[Pip2602]

I have just started to follow this case and trial in any detail so I may have missed out on large chunks of information, but if that is all the prosecution have on him, it looks like it will be difficult to prove murder conclusively. Rape yes, premeditated rape yes, but murder .....? What does anyone else think?

You might be right but I found this statement interesting
"It is not possible for the pathologist to determine how Libby died, but it is not necessary for the Prosecution to demonstrate any particular mechanism of death in this, or indeed in any other case of murder.

We say that you can be sure that Pawel Relowicz subjected Libby to unlawful violence at the Oak Road playing fields and that violence caused her death"

I think they could get a murder conviction if they can prove rape.

 

[Cherwell]

I have just started to follow this case and trial in any detail so I may have missed out on large chunks of information, but if that is all the prosecution have on him, it looks like it will be difficult to prove murder conclusively. Rape yes, premeditated rape yes, but murder .....? What does anyone else think?

I'm worried at the minute that they can prove he killed her rather than raping her and her running off into the water

I think his return to the scene is a telling piece of evidence. I certainly don't believe that he would go back out of concern for her welfare.

 

[lo so]

The car wouldnt even have been cold as he'd been driving round for hours!

Even if the car was cold, who leaves someone standing in the cold/snow until the car reaches what they feel is an appropriate temperature to heat them up?

 

[HongKongPhooey]

My take on the pathology report was not their findings were not necessarily consistent with drowning and therefore she most likely had already died before going into the water to my mind.

I hope they hammer this point further home if they can.

 

[elliefant]

His offending reminds me of Colonel Russell Thingie in Canada

 

[Vermont24]

With the trial expected to last several weeks, you'd expect that the prosecution haven't played all their cards just yet.

 

[CrazyLilBlondie]

So this drone footage of Old Oak Playing Fields - was this before he met Libby, or after?

 

[Vermont24]

So this drone footage of Old Oak Playing Fields - was this before he met Libby, or after?

In the days before.

 

[Newthoughts]

I'm worried at the minute that they can prove he killed her rather than raping her and her running off into the water

But the signs weren't typical of drowning - that would suggest to me that she didn't run into the river. I would assume that would show very clear signs of gasping in water. And they did say dead or dying when she was dumped suggesting she wasn't conscious.

Plus I think earlier there were discussions of the slope up to the river and the uneven nature of the ground and the fact it was frozen all of which would have made it difficult even without being intoxicated and hypothermic. He was fit and able she wasn't. I don't think she'd have got away and it would have been risky for him to let her

 

[jamjim]

So this drone footage of Old Oak Playing Fields - was this before he met Libby, or after?

It was after, the drone footage was found on 6th Feb, and he told police he had flown it a couple of days before.

Edit, that's how I read it. It would have been easier for him to check a decent sized area for any sign of Libby if he worried she'd got stuck on a branch etc. in the water, rather than him walking along on foot, also watching police search.

 

[lo so]

So this drone footage of Old Oak Playing Fields - was this before he met Libby, or after?

I thought it sounded like he was watching the police as they performed their searches

 

[Sooty]

For murder, as I understand (happy to be corrected!) They need to prove the intention was to kill or cause GBH which would likely result in possibility of death. The act of Rape on its own is not necessarily GBH, and the lack of proven injuries to her body make this difficult to argue.

 

[Mind your biscuits]

15:12
Relowicz's previous convictions - continued

• In Walgrave Street in February 2018, Relowicz watched a woman from outside her bedroom after she had returned from a shower.
• In May 2018 in Beresford Avenue, Relowicz stared at a young woman through her bedroom window.
• In Chester Avenue in December 2018, Relowicz stared through a window watching a woman dance in her underwear.
• On January 12, 2019, Relowicz was seen masturbating in Newland Avenue by two young women.
• On January 20, 2019, Relowicz was seen masturbating in Wellesley Avenue by two young women. The women went into their house but he continued to follow them as he masturbated and then ejaculated over their front door.

Just days before Libby vanished, Relowicz committed another burglary at Ventnor Street, between January 25 and 28. He broke into a shared house and stole the pink holdall found in his boot and much of the underwear and many of the sex toys and lubricants found inside.

Mr Wright says: “Several pairs of the knickers in the holdall were linked to this burglary by DNA testing that yielded the profiles of two of the girls in the house. The defendant’s DNA was also present on multiple pairs of those knickers. His saliva was present in the crotch of one pair and his semen present on two other pairs.”

'Libby killer's 2.30am sex act in Newland Avenue' - trial updates

OMG pass the bucket again, what a filthy monster. Moo

 

[jamjim]

15:53
A statement is now being read out from Libby's mum

A heartbreaking statement from Libby's mum Lisa who says she held a 'special bond' with her daughter. She says Libby liked Hull so had decided to go to the University of Hull. She said she was 'reluctant' for her to go but Libby had been 'adamant'.

She says Libby was 19 when she went to university and “loved life” there and “worked really hard”. She "enjoyed nights out and drinking but was very much against drugs".

She says Libby was 'always funny with a wicked sense of humour'

'Libby killer's 2.30am sex act in Newland Avenue' - trial updates

 

[Alyce]

I have just started to follow this case and trial in any detail so I may have missed out on large chunks of information, but if that is all the prosecution have on him, it looks like it will be difficult to prove murder conclusively. Rape yes, premeditated rape yes, but murder .....? What does anyone else think?

I do think they will be able to convict of murder.



This quote from the Prosecution covers it for me.

Whether that be by asphyxiation, or by any other means, such as deliberately throwing her into the freezing River Hull in the sure knowledge that she would drown. He intended at the very least to cause her really serious injury. His purpose was to rape her and to use whatever force was necessary to achieve that end, to silence her screams and to escape detention.


If it can be shown that the perpetrator intended to cause serious harm and that serious harm leads to the death of the victim, then the perpetrator can be found guilty of murder, whether or not he ( or she ) intended murder.

 

[Ktboo]

Just drove past Libby’s bench. There’s two bouquets of flowers laid there which were not there this morning. Made me smile.