Found Deceased UK - Nicola Bulley Last Seen Walking Dog Near River - St Michaels on Wyre (Lancashire) #11

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  • #101
I seen a Manchester Evening news reporter (I think) live reporting from scene and he said something about the signal isn’t great here! I’m assuming that (he said he was using his phone to record) he was talking about network reception? So is this to do with his data as obviously no wi-fi? So I was wondering if it would have been the same for NB on works call? Or maybe the reception where she was on call was ok, why make a work conference call if you can’t get a great service signal? Even if you have data does it rely on your actual phone signal because you can’t get wi-if? As I’ve said I’m not tech savvy, anyone enlighten me? Plz?
 
  • #102
Run off with a lover? What, and have her parents, sister, husband and kids all think she's dead? Unbelievable.
It is The Scottish Sun though, so maybe he said nothing of the sort!
 
  • #103
It's always interesting (if slightly depressing) to see where people's minds wander with things like this.

1) As has been stated, there are multiple (many recent) cases of people drowning in rivers and not being found for weeks, if not months.

2) There is no evidence to suggest abduction, murder or any other form of foul play.

3) Why are the people claiming there's no evidence NB fell into the river then jumping to the conclusion that she was abducted (or worse), when there's even less evidence for that?

4) What kind of evidence for drowning are people expecting to find? Some slippery/muddy boot marks along an embankment I could understand, but that's only one way to fall into a river - and especially when a distracting dog is involved - but other than that, what? She was well wrapped-up with the sort of warm, tight-fitting clothing you'd expect for a dog walker on a winter morning; not the sort of clothing that is likely to come lose and end up lodged on a tree branch or the side of a riverbank downstream. We already know where NB's phone was, so that doesn't need to be found.

As it is, instead of going along with the police's original hypothesis and simply waiting for what appears to be the sad realisation that her body will eventually be found (as so many ultimately are in these situations), we're looking for a 'shabby red van' and assuming there's some sort of local murderer doing the rounds. I think it's ridiculous, and I think some people are showing how (negatively) impacted by Netflix they now are.

It's possible to wait and be patient without jumping to all kinds of unsavoury conclusions. I saw Claudia Lawrence's name mentioned earlier, and I do remember that case from the time - I don't think this is that.

I haven't seen PA's TV interview yet but I did read the transcript (thanks for posting it a few pages back); the poor guy and their kids must be going through hell, but at this point I don't think anyone is really under any illusions.
Pretty bang on analysis for where we are at this point. Couldn't agree more.
 
  • #104
I seen a Manchester Evening news reporter (I think) live reporting from scene and he said something about the signal isn’t great here! I’m assuming that (he said he was using his phone to record) he was talking about network reception? So is this to do with his data as obviously no wi-fi? So I was wondering if it would have been the same for NB on works call? Or maybe the reception where she was on call was ok, why make a work conference call if you can’t get a great service signal? Even if you have data does it rely on your actual phone signal because you can’t get wi-if? As I’ve said I’m not tech savvy, anyone enlighten me? Plz?
I’m sorry can’t find the link to his stream as I can’t remember his name
 
  • #105
There doesn't seem to have been anything from her mum, dad or sister since their first television appearance when her dad said that she was upbeat after completing the mortgage. It's her friends who have been interviewed. There has been nothing more from her own family
Her friend was interviewed for the programme but none of her own family. I thought her sister might have spoken too.
 
  • #106
There doesn't seem to have been anything from her mum, dad or sister since their first television appearance when her dad said that she was upbeat after completing the mortgage. It's her friends who have been interviewed. There has been nothing more from her own family

Presumably of their own choice and/or under good advice. And who could blame them?

It must be incredibly upsetting for them to witness the toxic, out of control speculation about PA and some of NB's friends that followed NB's disappearance. Why would they want to put themselves in the eye of that noxious storm where they would no doubt find that every word out of their mouths would be held up to ignorant, speculative light and viewed through a suspicious lens?

They have more than enough to deal with without adding that to the grief mix.
 
  • #107
So where is the other phone? Maybe not worth carrying two phones. One will do if you need to make an emergency call.


The PF bloke said it "would have been a foot higher" which presumably is either some flood water coming down or the tide coming over the Weir. There don't seem IMO to be other reasons for that.

There is a little tributary just upstream. One wonders if the tide does come in here and reverse the flow occasionally.
Water level has probably dropped due to little or no rainfall for a few days. I'm on the South coast so not sure what it's been like in Lancs but it's been pretty dry here for a while.

Edit (17:31) - I've seen on here that that recording unit was actually down stream and therefore tidal so the comment about the water level being higher earlier can still be due to my reasoning above. I'm surprised there is not more variation in the levels, however if it is in a tidal part of the river.
 
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  • #108
Agree. Oh, and the responses are not just 'fight or flight' as people assume - it's fight, flight or freeze.
I believe fawn is also part of that response grouping
 
  • #109
It is The Scottish Sun though, so maybe he said nothing of the sort!
here's the English Sun
same story

bit more from the link ( pinch of salt etc but it might be of interest to those members who've been interested in NB's Strava account so am pasting it below)

'Faulding added he had spoken to Nicola’s friends who told him that as far as they knew she rarely walked by the river bank.
He claimed one of them had shown him her Strava app which recorded her walking activity and it showed she didn’t walk by the river but in the fields.
Faulding believes this could have been a decoy, as with the case of Laura Tom.

The 18-year-old disappeared in 2003 having celebrated passing her driving test at a pub near her home in Owston Ferry near Scunthorpe.
One of her white stilettos was discovered close to a nearby river bank.
However, her body was found buried in a haystack 11 days later.
Pub landlord Guy Beckett, Laura’s on-off boyfriend, was later convicted of her murder.'
 
  • #110
I seen a Manchester Evening news reporter (I think) live reporting from scene and he said something about the signal isn’t great here! I’m assuming that (he said he was using his phone to record) he was talking about network reception? So is this to do with his data as obviously no wi-fi? So I was wondering if it would have been the same for NB on works call? Or maybe the reception where she was on call was ok, why make a work conference call if you can’t get a great service signal? Even if you have data does it rely on your actual phone signal because you can’t get wi-if? As I’ve said I’m not tech savvy, anyone enlighten me? Plz?
Means nothing really, there are 4 different mobile networks in the UK, depending on which one the reporting was using vs NB then you can't conclude anything.

"Having data" is related to your phone signal in the sense the bandwidth (data rate) will usually be proportional to signal strength. In the case of the reporter may be attempting the stream a video requiring higher bandwidth vs an NB Teams audio call at low bandwidth then also can't be compared like for like.

Plus when there is a large increase in the number of people in an area, especially rural, the mobile phone network can get saturated with extra traffic and even with a strong signal can use up all the bandwidth meaning mobile users get poor performance even with a strong signal.
 
  • #111
This Faulding guy is really starting to wind me up. He was hired as a search and rescuer, so why is he passing himself off as an all-purpose detective? Telling the Sun that she could have "run off with a lover" when he has no evidence whatsoever is bang out of order! Obviously the police must have an open mind about such things (they'd be failing in their job if they didn't) but there's no need for him to be saying that in the press.
I don't mind him. As he's in MSM we can discuss what he's suggesting which is very difficult otherwise due to the (sensible) rules of WS. He's saying things I've thought, and I bet I'm not the only one here.
 
  • #112
Means nothing really, there are 4 different mobile networks in the UK, depending on which one the reporting was using vs NB then you can't conclude anything.

"Having data" is related to your phone signal in the sense the bandwidth (data rate) will usually be proportional to signal strength. In the case of the reporter may be attempting the stream a video requiring higher bandwidth vs an NB Teams audio call at low bandwidth then also can't be compared like for like.

Plus when there is a large increase in the number of people in an area, especially rural, the mobile phone network can get saturated with extra traffic and even with a strong signal can use up all the bandwidth meaning mobile users get poor performance even with a strong signal.
Thank you
 
  • #113
It's always interesting (if slightly depressing) to see where people's minds wander with things like this.

1) As has been stated, there are multiple (many recent) cases of people drowning in rivers and not being found for weeks, if not months.

2) There is no evidence to suggest abduction, murder or any other form of foul play.

3) Why are the people claiming there's no evidence NB fell into the river then jumping to the conclusion that she was abducted (or worse), when there's even less evidence for that?

4) What kind of evidence for drowning are people expecting to find? Some slippery/muddy boot marks along an embankment I could understand, but that's only one way to fall into a river - and especially when a distracting dog is involved - but other than that, what? She was well wrapped-up with the sort of warm, tight-fitting clothing you'd expect for a dog walker on a winter morning; not the sort of clothing that is likely to come lose and end up lodged on a tree branch or the side of a riverbank downstream. We already know where NB's phone was, so that doesn't need to be found.

As it is, instead of going along with the police's original hypothesis and simply waiting for what appears to be the sad realisation that her body will eventually be found (as so many ultimately are in these situations), we're looking for a 'shabby red van' and assuming there's some sort of local murderer doing the rounds. I think it's ridiculous, and I think some people are showing how (negatively) impacted by Netflix they now are.

It's possible to wait and be patient without jumping to all kinds of unsavoury conclusions. I saw Claudia Lawrence's name mentioned earlier, and I do remember that case from the time - I don't think this is that.

I haven't seen PA's TV interview yet but I did read the transcript (thanks for posting it a few pages back); the poor guy and their kids must be going through hell, but at this point I don't think anyone is really under any illusions.

Absolutely excellent post, spot on and logical.
 
  • #114
  • #115
It's always interesting (if slightly depressing) to see where people's minds wander with things like this.

1) As has been stated, there are multiple (many recent) cases of people drowning in rivers and not being found for weeks, if not months.

2) There is no evidence to suggest abduction, murder or any other form of foul play.

3) Why are the people claiming there's no evidence NB fell into the river then jumping to the conclusion that she was abducted (or worse), when there's even less evidence for that?

4) What kind of evidence for drowning are people expecting to find? Some slippery/muddy boot marks along an embankment I could understand, but that's only one way to fall into a river - and especially when a distracting dog is involved - but other than that, what? She was well wrapped-up with the sort of warm, tight-fitting clothing you'd expect for a dog walker on a winter morning; not the sort of clothing that is likely to come lose and end up lodged on a tree branch or the side of a riverbank downstream. We already know where NB's phone was, so that doesn't need to be found.

As it is, instead of going along with the police's original hypothesis and simply waiting for what appears to be the sad realisation that her body will eventually be found (as so many ultimately are in these situations), we're looking for a 'shabby red van' and assuming there's some sort of local murderer doing the rounds. I think it's ridiculous, and I think some people are showing how (negatively) impacted by Netflix they now are.

It's possible to wait and be patient without jumping to all kinds of unsavoury conclusions. I saw Claudia Lawrence's name mentioned earlier, and I do remember that case from the time - I don't think this is that.

I haven't seen PA's TV interview yet but I did read the transcript (thanks for posting it a few pages back); the poor guy and their kids must be going through hell, but at this point I don't think anyone is really under any illusions.
"She was well wrapped-up with the sort of warm, tight-fitting clothing you'd expect for a dog walker on a winter morning; not the sort of clothing that is likely to come lose and end up lodged on a tree branch".
I agree unlikely to have come loose but it was polyester & well might have snagged on tree branches, stubby grass, leaving fibres for forensics.
 
  • #116
It depends upon the type of barking. I am used to this in the place I walk. If you hear persistent barking it is either a dog enjoying himself in the river/ a dog being aggressive with another dog / interacting playfully

Certainly you take note snd quite often I would try and observe what is going on by walking nearer or into view.
So yes I would say you would react … whether you would act on it is a different matter. I probably would try and see what is going on.
But there is also the question of whether the fog would bark, even if worried and concerned. One of mine would bark and the other would stay silent.Springer spaniels aren’t particularly
..."she didn’t walk by the river but in the fields".
Faulding added he had spoken to Nicola’s friends who told him that as far as they knew she rarely walked by the river bank.
He claimed one of them had shown him her Strava app which recorded her walking activity and it showed she didn’t walk by the river but in the fields.

Hence dog bone dry. Similar for us.. much as dogs, especially spaniels, love going in water. It’s not always convenient and if you can avoid it .. you do.
 
  • #117
So I keep seeing the water depth being quoted as 0.4m, anybody actually concluded the depth at the point near the bench?

This suggests it is around 7 metres typically upstream. The 0.4m one often quoted is on or after the weir which is bound to be different to the rest of the river.

There are two more monitoring stations upstream, both suggesting around 7 metres normally and same on 27th Jan
depth 2.png
.

depth.png

And this is the weir station:

depth 3.png
 
  • #118
Water level has probably dropped due to little or no rainfall for a few days. I'm on the South coast so not sure what it's been like in Lancs but it's been pretty dry here for a while.

It seems an interesting bit of river. A gauge further up is at Kirkland bridge and shows this for the last week.

(Gaugemap.co.uk)

IMG_20230211_165400.jpg


IMO from that one could suggest that it is either subject to tidal influence or there is some sort of water extraction happening.

IMO I would go with extraction. Possibly for agriculture or feeding another watercourse.

This measuring station is well above the Weir.
 
  • #119
DBM Duplicate
 
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  • #120
Just running a wild thought over in my head and sharing. I'm not saying this is what happened, I'm just throwing what little we know up in the air and seeing how it falls.

If we suspend our notions of what is likely for one moment, and accept that someone other than NB could operate her phone then it becomes only an assumption that she herself clicked on the phone link for the teams meeting (camera and audio off). It is possible to send a text on someone else's phone which appears to be from them if they have access to it. The only witness sightings were from a distance (dogs interacted but did they interact?), then the last physical interaction with NB for definite would be dropping the kids off at the school as the kids and teachers/other parents could not be mistaken. Could it be that it was someone other than NB in the field but dressed up in the same clothes, of the same size, same hair, with local knowledge, who would be able to control the dog as they had walked it before? The bench scene then being staged. Whatever happened to NB having happened immediately after the school drop.

Please do tell me if there are obvious holes in this so that I can put it in the discarded list.

I'm still leaning towards a possible abduction, having abandoned the river as a theory.
 
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