UK - Nurse Lucy Letby, Faces 22 Charges - 7 Murder/15 Attempted Murder of Babies #20

[EyeSpyU]

That was how it was in the UK years ago but not now ...most nurses now have a degree ..most band 7s and above have masters degree.
There are many advanced nurse practitioners now doing the same jobs as the house officers , many run their own ward rounds and clinics without Dr's.
In fact my nurse director was a professor

So a band 7 nurse is what was a sister nurse, then? After a senior sister was the matron who was in charge of the ward.

It‘s sad the NHS has dumbed down now, it’s in a terrible state. I have read they’re now allowing pharmacists to diagnose minor ailments too and prescribe medicines. Personally, I’d sooner have a doctor who has far more knowledge and experience. The NHS is in such a mess now and I can’t understand why if a nurse takes degrees etc to run clinics don’t train for a PhD so they can be a doctor and rise the ranks eventually, nor just for prestige but better pay.

 

[Marantz4250b]

Strange. A shredder isn’t really something the average person would forget they had, like if someone asked if they had a printer they’d know wouldn’t they. Wonder what made her forget she had one when the police found it had been used too. Very strange.

This is my point - if it hit its duty cycle limit and shut off then she may have thought it was broken. Hence my comments about wanting to see further pics of it in the state in which it was found.

 

[EyeSpyU]

<modsnip - quoted post was removed>
Here’s just one of thousands of links about the case and what she’s been charged with.

it says she’s been accused with injecting insulin into the babies.<modsnip - personalizing>Lucy Letby told police insulin dose given to baby was ‘not done by me’

 

[Marantz4250b]

Here’s just one of thousands of links about the case and what she’s been charged with.

it says she’s been accused with injecting insulin into the babies. I’m surprised you don’t know that!Lucy Letby told police insulin dose given to baby was ‘not done by me’

I did know that.

Please point out which of the thousands of links you know of which contains the info that these babies died of insulin poisoning.

Please provide a link which says that doctors noticed it quickly.

If you can't then please do the decent thing and retract your statements.

 

[EyeSpyU]

This is my point - if it hit its duty cycle limit and shut off then she may have thought it was broken. Hence my comments about wanting to see further pics of it in the state in which it was found.

That makes sense. But she’d still know she had a shredder whether it was working or not. If mine was broken and someone asked me if I had one I’d say I did have one but it isn’t working.

 

[Marantz4250b]

I’ve already explained it to you. Being injected with insulin can kill you. What don’t you understand about that? Tell me, and I will try and find why it’s so dangerous in case you don’t know where to look.

No, you said babies DIED of insulin poisoning.

Please provide a link to that "fact".

Edit: you said I read Lucy Letby killed some of the babies with insulin.....

Where did you read that? Link please.

 

[JosieJo]

So a band 7 nurse is what was a sister nurse, then? After a senior sister was the matron who was in charge of the ward.

It‘s sad the NHS has dumbed down now, it’s in a terrible state. I have read they’re now allowing pharmacists to diagnose minor ailments too and prescribe medicines. Personally, I’d sooner have a doctor who has far more knowledge and experience. The NHS is in such a mess now and I can’t understand why if a nurse takes degrees etc to run clinics don’t train for a PhD so they can be a doctor and rise the ranks eventually, nor just for prestige but better pay.

I'd have to disagree I'd would rather have many a nurse practitioner treat me that many a Dr.

Most nurses do not want to be Dr's its a totally different role and would find it insulting to suggest otherwise as their level of training is often the same.

Same with pharmacists who train to the same level as a junior Dr and their knowledge of pharmacology may be far superior.

Gone are the days when nurses bowed when the Dr walked in thankfully.

Each role has a part to play based on their training and knowledge level not their job title.

Yes the NHS is a mess but that's funding and the massive uptake in its requirements

 

[JosieJo]

I’ve already explained it to you. Being injected with insulin can kill you. What don’t you understand about that? Tell me, and I will try and find why it’s so dangerous in case you don’t know where to look.

I think you said she actually killed someone with insulin but the insulin cases are attempted murder charges

 

[marynnu]

What’s odd about it according to the senior doctors is that being injected with huge amounts of insulin usually kills a baby, just like Beverley Allit killed some of the babies she was in charge of. It was sheer luck that doctors quickly suspected the babies had massive amounts of insulin inside them and managed to treat them accordingly. I read Lucy Letby killed some of the babies with insulin or sometimes air. But you seem to think she didn’t even though doctors have proven it.

There was no luck involved. The blood sugars fell and that was treated appropriately. Nobody knew these babies had been poisoned with insulin.

This podcast is very good, lays it all out clearly:

The Trial

True Crime Podcast · Updated twice weekly · The Trial goes behind the headlines of some of the biggest trials in the world. We take you into the courtroom, bringing you the detail as the evidence unfolds, examining key moments and carrying out …

podcasts.apple.com

 

[Marantz4250b]

Not for the lack of (alleged) wanting, mind you!

Why would a medic pump a baby full of insuline if not to kill him/her??

JMO

That may be the case but the poster I replied to stated very specifically that LL is charged with killing babies with insulin. That us categorically untrue!

Furthermore, he/she has refused to provide a link to this alleged information and has accused me of saying things I never said.

 

[marynnu]

Do you mean ppl in the UK now can be treated by a nurse instead of a doctor?

And what is it about "nurses bowing to doctors"?
I never heard of this phenomenon

JMO

Yes, we now have nurses who are called Advanced Nurse Practitioners (ANPs). On NNU they're ANNPs of course! They train in their own specialist area, for example A&E, and take on some roles previously done only by doctors. They are very expert in their field and I find them much more reassuring than a doctor just out of training! Our ANNPs would intubate, insert lines, prescribe a limited amount if drugs etc. Invaluable.

To bow down to someone is not literal! It means to treat them as if they are better than you & do as they tell you without question.

 

[Dotta]

To bow down to someone is not literal! It means to treat them as if they are better than you & do as they tell you without question.

I know

I mean everybody has a job he/she trained for.

There are no "better or worse" professions, everybody is needed and useful for society.

Every honest work should be respected and that concept of "bowing to" others (not literal haha) is alien to me.

But mind you - in literal sense ALSO
JMO

 

[JosieJo]

I know

I mean everybody has a job he/she trained for.

There are no "better or worse" professions, everybody is needed and useful for society.

Every honest work should be respected and that concept of "bowing to" orhers (not literal haha) is alien to me.

JMO

Thankfully it's like that here now.. many years ago the consultants were treated like gods and nurses were very much like servants in a way ...many years ago I must add

 

[esther43]

Here is Meyer's cross examination of baby E and F's mum:

Ben Myers KC, defending, said: “What happened that night, it must have been very intense and very upsetting?”
“Yes,” replied the witness.

Mr Myers said: “I am suggesting there were three times you went down that evening.
“I am going to suggest you went down about 8pm… then actually it’s nearer to 10pm – rather than 9pm – when you went down with the breast milk. And you then went back again when (Child E) was being resuscitated at about 11pm.
“Do you disagree with that?”

Child E’s mother said: “Absolutely.”

Mr Myers went on: “I am not going to suggest that (Child E) was not upset when you went down. I am going to suggest he was not as upset to the degree you described. It was not as bad as that?”

The witness replied: “ It was horrendous.”

Mr Myers said: “You said what you saw was blood. Is it possible what you saw was some sort of dark liquid with flecks of material – aspirates?

Child E’s mother said: “It was blood.”
Mr Myers said: “I suggest to you that there was no time that Miss Letby said the tube was irritating (Child E)?

The witness said: “I disagree.”

Mother ‘completely trusted’ nurse when she left ‘screaming’ son in her care

Nurse Lucy Letby, 32, is said to have murdered the infant with an injection of air into the bloodstream.

www.expressandstar.com

Sounds like mum really stood her ground. It is not a good look for an attorney to say " .... I am going to suggest he was not as upset to the degree you described. It was not as bad as that?” when the baby died hours later....

And Myers to baby E's Mum.
" I'm going to suggest you were there at around 8.00pm " oh reaaaaally? So now it seems the defendant has a different account to both Myers and the prosecution. (Defendant said on Thurs it was around 9.00) So now Myers looks like he was the one "adding in new things" to fit the narrative, not Dewi Evans as he has so frequently proposed.

 

[esther43]

Dbm

 

[katydid23]

<modsnip - information not presented at trial>

My feeling is that while LL’s involvement is quite possible, immediately after the first babies died, no one suspected homicide, and now the case against her looks circumstantial because mostly, time has passed. Her behavior, notes and things in her house might be indicative of some unhealthy interest, but not iron-clad proof of murder. The most convincing aspect, insulin, is missing the direct connection with LL. ((
<modsnip - information not presented at trial>

<modsnip - response to snipped portion of above post>

The 'direct connection' with LL and the insulin is two fold----she is one of 2 nurses that co-signed for and made up the bags and hung the first one. And she was the ONLY caretaker that was present in the unit for ALL of the charged collapses.

 

[Cluedoneit]

In a case where any possible suspect has the right to be there due to their job, all evidence would be circumstantial. DNA, fingerprints on tools etc would be useless for any suspect in cases like this, even if her fingerprints were on the insulin bags it would prove zero as she and everyone else in the ward would’ve touched the TPN bags at some point as part of their job.

 

[katydid23]

And Myers to baby E's Mum.
" I'm going to suggest you were there at around 8.00pm " oh reaaaaally? So now it seems the defendant has a different account to both Myers and the prosecution. (Defendant said on Thurs it was around 9.00) So now Myers looks like he was the one "adding in new things" to fit the narrative, not Dewi Evans as he has so frequently proposed.

Wait, I am not sure that is correct. Did LL say it was around 9 pm?

I thought she said it was not at around 9 pm? But I will reread the testimony.

 

[Tortoise]

And Myers to baby E's Mum.
" I'm going to suggest you were there at around 8.00pm " oh reaaaaally? So now it seems the defendant has a different account to both Myers and the prosecution. (Defendant said on Thurs it was around 9.00) So now Myers looks like he was the one "adding in new things" to fit the narrative, not Dewi Evans as he has so frequently proposed.

I'm not sure LL has said it was around 9pm? That is the whole point at issue with the mother's account.

Her nursing note written up hours after he died said the mother was present at the start of the shift (which would be around 8pm) and again at around 10pm.

 

[katydid23]

Doctors have a lot of power, and obviously make all the medical decisions, but do not have a management role re. nurses. And over here saying someone is your superior is a little insulting to you I think!

Sorry, I did not mean it in an insulting way. My age is showing, as I am 73 years old. So we would use that term superior as a description of chain of command, but NOT as an adjective or descriptor or in any way saying the person IS superior.

I better stop before I make it worse by rambling....