UK - Nurse Lucy Letby, Faces 22 Charges - 7 Murder/15 Attempted Murder of Babies #26

[Sundial]

Did we ever find out what the potential job opening was that LL thought she was lined up for around the end of June 2016? I'm guessing it wasn't the move to admin that she was referring to

Letby asks: "What gestation are the trips? I don't mind being busy anyway..."

Doctor: "33+5 [weeks gestation]. 3x Optiflo..."

After more messages, the doctor asks Letby if she has any choice where she is working.

Letby: "No, not with this new handover. Shift leader of night shift allocates for the day shift and vice versa. If your on a run of shifts you tend to stay with same babies."

Letby adds due to the skillsets, she tends to work in nursery room 1.

Letby adds she feels "most at home with ITU [intensive treatment unit] and the girls know that Im quite happy to be in 1 so works out well most of the time."

The doctor replies: "...I like it when you're in itu - everything feels safe and well organised..."

Letby: "Awe that's nice to hear, Huw often says that too - see what happens tomorrow."

Letby adds there is a potential job opening on the unit which she believes she might be lined up for.

The doctor: 'If you didn't want it now, could you defer?'

Letby: 'Yes good to know and worth thinking about...& yes, I'm sure she would let me defer.'

Recap: Lucy Letby trial, Wednesday, March 8

The trial of Lucy Letby, who denies murdering seven babies at the Countess of Chester Hospital neonatal unit and attempting to murder 10 more, is…

www.chesterstandard.co.uk

This kind of brings me back to that whole band 6 thing, the potential “job” she thought she was lined up for.

Also interesting where she says to dr choc:

Letby: "Awe that's nice to hear, Huw often says that too - see what happens tomorrow."

Who is this “Huw” person? Or is this a typo in the reporting? I don’t recall.

In addition to that, she says she tends to work in room one; but now this isn’t the impression I got at all. If anything, to me it sounds like they all worked a mix of the different nurseries (which I’d generally expect tbh) and she appears real p**** about that when she was allocated elsewhere.

Again, notice how she makes reference to the “skillset”. She implies to dr choc it’s this nice skill mix but when she talks to her nursing colleagues (and on the stand), she actually sounds really quite bitter and snide towards the skills everyone brings to the team as a whole.

I don’t know what it is, but the whole thing with skills, the job, banding of nurses etc, to me just stinks. If guilty, Was she actually creating this horrific environment to these tiny helpless babies just to progress her career, superiority?
For me, IMO if guilty, the stuff with dr choc came secondary to progressing to where she wanted. If guilty, he was the ideal person to claim how brilliant she was; as he said in his gushing messages to her and giving a statement etc.

She appeared to have manipulated him the same as everyone else for a reason.

If guilty etc
Moo JMO

 

[ColourPurple]

This kind of brings me back to that whole band 6 thing, the potential “job” she thought she was lined up for.

Also interesting where she says to dr choc:

Letby: "Awe that's nice to hear, Huw often says that too - see what happens tomorrow."

Who is this “Huw” person? Or is this a typo in the reporting? I don’t recall.

In addition to that, she says she tends to work in room one; but now this isn’t the impression I got at all. If anything, to me it sounds like they all worked a mix of the different nurseries (which I’d generally expect tbh) and she appears real p**** about that when she was allocated elsewhere.

Again, notice how she makes reference to the “skillset”. She implies to dr choc it’s this nice skill mix but when she talks to her nursing colleagues (and on the stand), she actually sounds really quite bitter and snide towards the skills everyone brings to the team as a whole.

I don’t know what it is, but the whole thing with skills, the job, banding of nurses etc, to me just stinks. If guilty, Was she actually creating this horrific environment to these tiny helpless babies just to progress her career, superiority?
For me, IMO if guilty, the stuff with dr choc came secondary to progressing to where she wanted. If guilty, he was the ideal person to claim how brilliant she was; as he said in his gushing messages to her and giving a statement etc.

She appeared to have manipulated him the same as everyone else for a reason.

If guilty etc
Moo JMO

I think Huw was a registrar at the time. He was one of the other doctors and was involved with Baby N(and also L and O, maybe more?). Also re the "see what happens tomorrow" part of that sentence.

The doctor replies: "...I like it when you're in itu - everything feels safe and well organised...

Letby: "Awe that's nice to hear, Huw often says that too - see what happens tomorrow."

I think the text was sent on 22nd June 2016, so what happened "tomorrow" was Baby O died!

Here's some info on Huw:

After three attempts to intubate, the doctor {Doc Choc} abandoned the procedure. His note from that morning, shown to the court, stated: "Intubation abandoned due to blood present at oropharynx and likelihood of trauma due to repeated attempts".
Child N was placed on non-invasive breathing support, via a mask, but later that day another doctor made an attempt to intubate after a further collapse.
Dr Huw Mayberry, giving evidence via live link from Australia, told the court that he was crash called to attend the neonatal unit at around 15:00 on 15 June.
Dr Mayberry told jurors he was "unable to get a very clear view because there was substantial swelling within the airway" of Child N.
He said that the swelling was "unlike anything I had encountered previously."
Dr Mayberry said the infant's epiglottis, which is a flap of tissue at the back of the throat, was "quite swollen". He added: "It looked quite large and reddy pink in colour. I had not seen this in my practice before, only in textbooks."

Doctors saw blood in baby's throat, nurse trial told

Nurse Lucy Letby is accused of trying to kill the boy at Countess of Chester Hospital.

www.bbc.co.uk

 

[ColourPurple]

I would love to know what that job was, and why he thought she might not want it at that time.

Yes, what was the job, why did she think she might be lined up for it, why did Doc Choc think she might need to defer if she was offered it, and why would LL think that the unnamed woman in charge of offering the job would agree to her deferring the start date?

 

[Tortoise]

@MrDanDonoghue
·
2h

Replying to
@MrDanDonoghue
The judge has just indicated that - if there are no more delays - the defence closing will be completed by the end of next week, his summing up will be done the following week, meaning jury may go out to consider their verdict in week of 10 July

I’ve just seen that there is no court today on Dan’s twitter feed.

I was in Manchester on Wednesday and thought if I had time I’d go over to court but changed my mind after reading Mon and Tues compelling closing speeches. I got all upset just reading them and think hearing it and also hearing the babies names would of tipped me over the edge.

Is this turning out to be fate? My son's graduation at Manchester Uni is on 12th July and I've been considering going up the day before because it's such a long train journey. When I heard the jury would be going out on 3rd July I thought there's probably no way that the jury will still be deliberating on the 11th/12th, but if they go out on the 10th.....???

I might have to make a cardboard cut-out of myself for the graduation pics

 

[Tortoise]

Was any evidence adduced that I have missed from the parents phone? Would there not be a digital record if switched off for a period?

LL's cross-examination was the first the prosecution knew that the parents' agreed evidence was now disputed. I suppose the prosecution could have been granted permission to reopen their case, to call the parents to give evidence, but they might have considered it wasn't necessary. The jury still got to hear the parents' evidence even if they were instructed it was no longer agreed, and it might be considered the defence's loss, not having them challenged. Could it be a matter for an appeal? LL still got to say she disputed it, so I have my doubts about that.

I'm not sure phone records would have proved much, if they were available at this late stage. They don't tell you what was said or who placed the call.

JMO

 

[Tortoise]

Yes, what was the job, why did she think she might be lined up for it, why did Doc Choc think she might need to defer if she was offered it, and why would LL think that the unnamed woman in charge of offering the job would agree to her deferring the start date?

Plumbing department?

 

[Tortoise]

I am kind of shocked though that the defence is going to take a week. I can't work that out.

I suppose he is going to respond to all the prosecution's points.

 

[dalsglen]

Plumbing department?

we don't need anymore cowboy tradesmen.

God can you imagine her in prison telling everyone how they're doing it all wrong.

I don't think they'll take a week either, unless it's only one day in attendance...

 

[Marantz4250b]

I am kind of shocked though that the defence is going to take a week. I can't work that out.

I suppose he is going to respond to all the prosecution's points.

I'm wondering they could possibly talk about for that length of time!

Is it another short week, perchance?

 

[Diddly1]

Perhaps the week might be in case the juror is still unwell. In which case it could be considerably shorter than a week.
I think the judge is trying to cover everything and if the defence finishes earlier he will start sooner. But he will try to start on a Monday with his summing up. If this makes sense at all?

 

[ColourPurple]

I am kind of shocked though that the defence is going to take a week. I can't work that out.

I suppose he is going to respond to all the prosecution's points.

I'm wondering they could possibly talk about for that length of time!

Is it another short week, perchance?

I wonder if they're allowing a week maximum, but it'll actually be finished well before then?

 

[MachinaCollecta]

I wonder if they're allowing a week maximum, but it'll actually be finished well before then?

This is my thought too, that the week is the allowed maximum but it won’t be as long as that.

 

[Sundial]

I think Huw was a registrar at the time. He was one of the other doctors and was involved with Baby N(and also L and O, maybe more?). Also re the "see what happens tomorrow" part of that sentence.

The doctor replies: "...I like it when you're in itu - everything feels safe and well organised...

Letby: "Awe that's nice to hear, Huw often says that too - see what happens tomorrow."

I think the text was sent on 22nd June 2016, so what happened "tomorrow" was Baby O died!

Here's some info on Huw:

After three attempts to intubate, the doctor {Doc Choc} abandoned the procedure. His note from that morning, shown to the court, stated: "Intubation abandoned due to blood present at oropharynx and likelihood of trauma due to repeated attempts".
Child N was placed on non-invasive breathing support, via a mask, but later that day another doctor made an attempt to intubate after a further collapse.
Dr Huw Mayberry, giving evidence via live link from Australia, told the court that he was crash called to attend the neonatal unit at around 15:00 on 15 June.
Dr Mayberry told jurors he was "unable to get a very clear view because there was substantial swelling within the airway" of Child N.
He said that the swelling was "unlike anything I had encountered previously."
Dr Mayberry said the infant's epiglottis, which is a flap of tissue at the back of the throat, was "quite swollen". He added: "It looked quite large and reddy pink in colour. I had not seen this in my practice before, only in textbooks."

Doctors saw blood in baby's throat, nurse trial told

Nurse Lucy Letby is accused of trying to kill the boy at Countess of Chester Hospital.

www.bbc.co.uk

Ah I recall now, thank you.
That’s disturbing. If guilty, she’s saying that Huw thought the same as dr choc. Allegedly.
All so very uncomfortable.

Moo if guilty etc

 

[ColourPurple]

Ah I recall now, thank you.
That’s disturbing. If guilty, she’s saying that Huw thought the same as dr choc. Allegedly.
All so very uncomfortable.

Moo if guilty etc

And Ali Ventress before them. It does come across like she enjoyed impressing the registrars... whether guilty or innocent.JMO

 

[Sundial]

Yes, what was the job, why did she think she might be lined up for it, why did Doc Choc think she might need to defer if she was offered it, and why would LL think that the unnamed woman in charge of offering the job would agree to her deferring the start date?

Not ready for it? Perhaps.
Is it possible this is what she was trying to prove?
If guilty. Only if guilty.

JMO

 

[Sundial]

And Ali Ventress before them. It does come across like she enjoyed impressing the registrars... whether guilty or innocent.JMO

I think this is one thing that I can’t seem to shake from my thoughts. Just my own opinion, but for me it was really noticeable how friendly she was with dr V, I thought ok nothing wrong with that.
But then as the case progresses there’s this really odd connection between her and the doctors, I just can’t place what it is. It’s like she seems to gravitate specifically towards them; overcompensating to impress them perhaps. Then with the job, her competencies etc, the banding, her bitter remarks about the skills and her nursing colleagues. All just sits and smells like a huge fish to me- along with the plumber, shredder and all the other weird stuff going on.

JMO if guilty.

 

[Sundial]

Thinking further- JMO could this then be what the “I’m not good enough to care for them” thing she wrote on the post-it notes was all about? If guilty.

There’s this job mentioned in the evidence, deferral discussions etc. The one to the scene, she said to dr choc she tends to work in room 1 etc (yet didn’t). Was it that she wasn’t competently ready? Why wasn’t she good enough (as she wrote on that note)? Then there were also the concerns made about her practice and the “bitchy” comments from other staff we heard about when she was discussing with her manager.

I noticed how she made a point of showing that conversation from her manager to her nursing colleague. Her manager said how much she’d grown in confidence etc. Could this be the same manager who’d discussed deferring a said job? Something extremely weird and quite unsettling here. I wonder if she was making minor mistakes prior to these awful cases and out of frustration to progress further (or held back in progression) it’s all just escalated. If guilty.

JMO

 

[Tortoise]

I think this is one thing that I can’t seem to shake from my thoughts. Just my own opinion, but for me it was really noticeable how friendly she was with dr V, I thought ok nothing wrong with that.
But then as the case progresses there’s this really odd connection between her and the doctors, I just can’t place what it is. It’s like she seems to gravitate specifically towards them; overcompensating to impress them perhaps. Then with the job, her competencies etc, the banding, her bitter remarks about the skills and her nursing colleagues. All just sits and smells like a huge fish to me- along with the plumber, shredder and all the other weird stuff going on.

JMO if guilty.

I imagine there is the inevitable age difference between her and the doctors too. Could they have been as young as her? I've no idea how long it takes to become a registrar. I'm not saying from a romance point of view, but who she gravitates towards perhaps. Then there is the writing of her teacher's name.

It could be to do with the way she views herself, intellectually. Perhaps not an age thing but in terms of her mental prowess. If you are going to gaslight people you have to view your victims as more stupid than yourself. So in a way I think she thought she was more clever than the doctors, to be fooling them, if guilty. I think it reveals disdain for them. IMO

 

[Sundial]

I imagine there is the inevitable age difference between her and the doctors too. Could they have been as young as her? I've no idea how long it takes to become a registrar. I'm not saying from a romance point of view, but who she gravitates towards perhaps. Then there is the writing of her teacher's name.

It could be to do with the way she views herself, intellectually. Perhaps not an age thing but in terms of her mental prowess. If you are going to gaslight people you have to view your victims as more stupid than yourself. So in a way I think she thought she was more clever than the doctors, to be fooling them, if guilty. I think it reveals disdain for them. IMO

Interesting thoughts.
Considering this got me thinking about Dr J, we know a little about him/potential age from his tv documentaries; Are we born naughty? (Ironic given the circumstances)

Her attitude referring to the doctors (she said on the stand) as b**** and this discussion in general. Even if innocent she just reminds me of someone that when advising you they’ve not done something correctly and rather than take it as constructive feedback, appears to take it as quite a personal attack. As though she doesn’t take any form of criticism or correction well, or being told no. Childlike. I can’t describe how I feel, but I get this impression of something else bubbling away under the surface that you don’t quite get to see/hear.

Yet.
If guilty. Moo
JMO

 

[Dotta]

"The Beginning of the End"

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