GUILTY UK - Rebecca Watts, 16, Bristol, 19 Feb 2015 #15

[Gigi-G]

No, I suggested it when Retribution was posting, but it didn't happen and then Retri left us

I have, however, asked Kate B about having a general UK discussion thread somewhere downstairs (the Parking Lot & the Jury Room contain threads accessible only to members). She thinks it could work so fingers crossed. Who's coming?!

(Kate / Coldpizza - if you see this - pleeeeease??)

Ohh this would be a brill idea.. I do hope Retribution joins us again now the Verdicts are in. There's no reporting clauses in place now 😀

 

[Gigi-G]

I think there was or the police had put KD under surveillance as his mobile number would have shown in NM's or SH's mobile phone records after their arrest. At the time the confession came from NM, KD and someone else left the house and were stopped by the police which I think were already watching.




Exactly, it's not sympathy for the perps, it's looking into how we can prevent this tiny proportion of our children that get a challenging upbringing and end up combining and creating this one in a million combination that unlocked this unjustified murder of Becky Watts.

I'm 40 yr old 6ft6" man but cried watching the after court statements. The horror of Becky's death and the life she missed out on will haunt me forever.

You're in a minority being male I think... lol

:welcome:

 

[Gigi-G]

FFS You were her mother! If you weren't happy with your 14 year old daughter being in a relationship with a man in his twenties, then you should have done something about it. In fact, by law you should have stopped it!

And what kind of mother sits by and lets her daughter's boyfriend act like that, regardless of the daughter's age?

Is it any wonder SH turned out the way she did - there were clearly no morals or boundaries when she needed them during puberty.

Agreed!! What kind of Mother let's their daughter to even think about having a bf that much older?
I know SH had not been living at home all that much and maybe mom might of thought 'well if she's here I can keep a watchful eye out'
But noooooooooooooooooooooooo. .. that's adding fuel to an already lit fire!
SH may of gone off on her own accord with NM without mom's knowledge. Or been a typical stroppy teen. 'Been there, done that, got the t shirt' kind of flippant behaviour.
But as SH must of been under guidance of Social Services at that time also. Mom should of raised the issue THEN to THEM!...
ugghh. Hindsight is such a wonderful thing.
8 years later. Her daughter is gonna languish for some amount of time in HMP.
Bet she wished she'd contacted SS now.

 

[CoverMeCagney]

You're in a minority being male I think... lol

:welcome:

What were the stats again, was it 92% of members female and over 40?

I'd love to know how many British members there are. It will be a small fraction of the total members (which I think is about 50,000) so yes, when you narrow it down there are proportionally not many men here, so probably only a handful of Brit boys!

 

[TupeloMz]

I just now found out that the verdict is in. Omg. Already?
Wow now I have to get caught up. Just not expecting it so soon!

 

[Gigi-G]

OHHHH i´m crying... only knew now... I'm crying...

Bless you Beesknees. We were earlier also. #JusticeservedforBecky ♡

 

[Gigi-G]

Me too, and tonight I am actually going to SLEEP at bedtime instead of still being awake at silly o'clock. If you catch me here after 11pm please tell me off! :bed:

Hahaha I think I was counting sheep still at 3 a.m.
But yes you're right. Justice has been done. Our faith in the Jury rewarded. We just need the sentences to fit the crime now. Not some lenient drizzle.
Well you've a little over 2 hours till 11. So plenty time to post some more and still make it to bed pre midnight 😁😂

 

[CoverMeCagney]

For those of you needing to go back and catch up, Clio's post announcing the verdict was post #452 at 2:22pm UK time.

 

[Alyce]

Agree, am hoping for a good night's sleep tonight. Was awake til all hours last night, just hoping the Jury would get it right and not take too long about it.

I was stunned, but delighted by the speed and, as you say Gigi, our faith in the Jury has been rewarded.

Fly Free Becky - Justice has been Served for you x


:rose: :rose: :rose: :rose: :rose: :rose: :rose: :rose:

:rose: :rose: :rose: :rose: :rose: :rose: :rose: :rose:

 

[Legal]

quite, but why did the jury think it was a and not b?

they must have believed that there was no plan to kill as part of the kidnap plan. is that because NM denied he planned to kill Becky? did they believe his stupid reason about teaching her a lesson? did they think it was for sex only? if they thought it was for sex - did they think through whether they would have just let Becky go afterwards? etc..

I think they could have benefited from spending more time on probing those questions. never mind I suppose, it is what it is, and better than her getting off on the kidnap and the killing charges.

Hello, me again! Hope I'm not totally boring everybody or repeating the obvious, if so let me know!

NM had already admitted killing Becky. To find him guilty of murder the prosecution only had to prove beyond reasonable doubt he intended to cause grievous (serious) bodily harm to her. Clearly the jury believed this was achieved, probably from evidence such as his threats to her, her telling the psychiatrist she was afraid of him, the stun guns, the weapons he said he took with him, and the video.

In order to charge SH with murder, the bar was set much higher and the jury probably didn't think that the prosecution had proved it beyond reasonable doubt. It doesn't mean they believed NM's pack of lies or didn't think she was involved. Just that there wasn't enough evidence there for a conviction.

By the way, I'm useless with technology and thought I'd already posted this but can't find it, so apologies if it's a duplicate.

 

[Gigi-G]

Not surprised by the verdict as I felt the evidence was substantial and significant. Hope they both get the max they are both dangerous in my view and will continue to be. I wish the UK would introduce whole life terms for violent heinous crimes. I cannot understand how anyone could do this to another human being. It's hard enough seeing a dead person at a funeral directors never mind what happened here.

Thank you to all of you for your dedication and commitment to Rebecca's case.

R.I.P Rebecca Watts very sorry you never got to live your life. Thoughts and prayers are with your family and friends.

Hi there. I think many hold your view on whole life sentencing. Just our prison system needs a whole radical reboot.
There used to be hardcore long term prisons. Pentonville, Belmarsh, Parkhurst. But they are old. And as our local Prison here in Gloucester very archaic. Victorian era Prisons.
We don't have a death penalty. And seems that over crowding now is the norm. What were single cells now double up.
If the Government want to place people such as NM & SH into the system for life. Then more needs to be done. Like new builds. We've just had prominent trials from Rotherham and Oxford. With so many men being found guilty of indencies against children. A majority of which aren't British by birth. But British law has sentenced them.
The whole system needs a shake up as they did with the schools....
Sorry rant over... (Not really a rant just a worry of too lenient sentencing) apologies

 

[Gigi-G]

What were the stats again, was it 92% of members female and over 40?

I'd love to know how many British members there are. It will be a small fraction of the total members (which I think is about 50,000) so yes, when you narrow it down there are proportionally not many men here, so probably only a handful of Brit boys!

Yeah something like that. Makes me wonder tho. Do you think the Jury would of returned the same Verdicts had it been majority of men to women?
Just curious....lol

 

[innocenteyes]

IMO I really think he/NM hasn't elaborated much else to the facts of the case other than what we know. Because he wants 'his' family to be spared of the stomach churning details he has in his head. NM wanted love.. a Mothers love. And when BW took a huge part of his mom/AG in those first few years when AG spent months as an unpaid TA in BW'S classroom. That was the pinnacle for me..... For whatever reason NM was sent to live with his Grandmother. Yes, his Grandmother did a fine job of raising him. But the seeds of doubt had already been sewn in his mind... 'why?'
What did this 'Becky' girl have what he didn't have? She in fact 'stole' his mother. And I don't think he's ever forgot that betrayal by someone he loved so much. To distance themselves from him. I feel much resentment followed from this point on.
I really think that it's unrequited love.
There ain't no love like a Mothers love. And NM hated BW for that.
He just wants his mother to love him. He ' got rid of the problem that was Becky.' His mother and stepdad didn't have to go thru all the anguish of the big arguments. Stuff left lying around. His mom was safe now. And it was down to him she was safe.
That's how I see it. The letter he wrote his Mother while on remand. We don't know it's contents. But I'm sure it reads something like ' I'm so sorry mom. But I couldn't bear her being so nasty to you. Forgive me I love you mom' .... to that effect.

Sorry to babble on. Jmoo
#justiceforBecky♡

But don't you think there is something more sinister to this? I mean why was there a need to dismember the body if it was an accident? It seems almost satanic IMO.

 

[mrazda71]

It's possible to feel sadness whilst also welcoming the verdict.

Yes yes you are right of course

 

[Gigi-G]

But don't you think there is something more sinister to this? I mean why was there a need to dismember the body if it was an accident? It seems almost satanic IMO.

Ohh yes indeed. There is without a doubt a whole lot more to this to what degree. And why. I really don't think we'll be privy to the details. Unless NM & SH writes their memoirs and publishes a book.
I'm sure in the coming days we'll find out more from the experts who put forward the Evidence for the case. But I will be surprised if it will go too far, out of respect for the family.
Profiling the pair of them. I've said before. They (NM & SH) are peas in a pod.
They both fed off each other. Who was the manipulative one. I wouldn't be surprised if it were SH.
She was the cool calm collected one. To which she played till the end. And that, was her downfall.

 

[skibaboo]

Me too, and tonight I am actually going to SLEEP at bedtime instead of still being awake at silly o'clock. If you catch me here after 11pm please tell me off! :bed:

Yes, get your butt to bed early!! Skibs orders Otherwise you will end up like me, body clock is whack, I'm never in bed before 2am and more often than not its around 4am when I do finally call it a night. I should just pretend to be Anerican lol I'm more Texas time than Yorkshire thanks to SCHMAE introducing me to WS!

 

[Gigi-G]

:fireworks: arty: :up:

A lil tipple guys n gals. I think we well deserve it. It's been such an overwhelmingly sad sad case. With many lives shattered. Here's hoping they can repair and restore and remember Becky how she should be remembered, at peace with the Angels who look after her now. ♡Namastè♡

 

[Kaly99]

Just when you think it's safe to leave the forum for a few days because of course, there won't be any new developments till at least Friday...

Hello, me again! Hope I'm not totally boring everybody or repeating the obvious, if so let me know!

NM had already admitted killing Becky. To find him guilty of murder the prosecution only had to prove beyond reasonable doubt he intended to cause grievous (serious) bodily harm to her. Clearly the jury believed this was achieved, probably from evidence such as his threats to her, her telling the psychiatrist she was afraid of him, the stun guns, the weapons he said he took with him, and the video.

In order to charge SH with murder, the bar was set much higher and the jury probably didn't think that the prosecution had proved it beyond reasonable doubt. It doesn't mean they believed NM's pack of lies or didn't think she was involved. Just that there wasn't enough evidence there for a conviction.

By the way, I'm useless with technology and thought I'd already posted this but can't find it, so apologies if it's a duplicate.

And yet, I think there may be more to it than only a higher burden of proof - it raises some interesting questions as to what the jury believed the intention of this "kidnap plan" was...

If they believed beyond reasonable doubt that there was a kidnap plot, as they must have, then in order to find SH not guilty of murder they must also have believed that SH agreed to the plan not thinking that BW would be seriously injured or killed in the process. Or at least that there was a possibility this was the case.

So what did the jury believe the intention of the kidnap plot to be? Did they accept NM's story that it was to give Becky a shock, but disbelieved him when he said SH had nothing to do with it? Or did they think the motive was sexual, but that there was no intention to kill Becky at the end of it, that perhaps they'd have let her go?

It's an interesting one - I'm curious to see how the judge will deal with it on Friday.

 

[CoverMeCagney]

Yeah something like that. Makes me wonder tho. Do you think the Jury would of returned the same Verdicts had it been majority of men to women?
Just curious....lol

Given they went out at 11am, would have had a wee / smoke / sandwich and then chosen a foreman, and were back in shortly after 2pm with a unanimous verdict, I'd say YES! Yes, I think by the sounds of it the evidence was overwhelming and undeniable.

 

[CoverMeCagney]

Will JI and DD be back at home now?