UK - Scarlett Vickers (14) stabbed to death at home in Darlington. Parents charged with murder (5 July '24)

[bobbymkii]

Following the live updates, thank you for posting.

I dread to think what kind of life poor Scarlett had, living in that environment.
May she rest in peace.

I'm not really following you here. Usually in cases like this involving the death of a child with a parent standing accused, the prosecution case takes weeks to present in court as the investigation uncovers evidence of all kinds of awful abuse and neglect. If there's anything shocking about this case, it's that there is none of that evident. Scarlett appears to have had a perfectly normal upbringing and family life and whatever happened to produce such a shocking and tragic end to her life it appears to have happened completely without warning.

And the two people who were present have not proven to be very reliable witnesses.

JMO

 

[ChatteringBirds]

Scarlett appears to have had a perfectly normal upbringing

Who really knows, though. There are a lot of forms of dysfunction, and some you don't even realize you are living in, because they are "your normal."

 

[bobbymkii]

Who really knows, though. There are a lot of forms of dysfunction, and some you don't even realize you are living in, because they are "your normal."

I can only base my opinions on the evidence that is made public:

12:56David Huntley

Phones were examined​

Scarlett’s phone and Vickers’ and Sarah Hall’s were all examined. There was nothing to suggest anything untoward was happening, the witness says.

The witness says he is “not aware of any motive why any parent would have harmed Scarlett, never mind kill her”.

12:55David Huntley

No social services involvement​

Mr Lumley asks about the relationships between the family members. The witness says that police made inquiries about the relationships and found there was “nothing untoward that would suggest it was anything other than a normal family”.

There was no social services involvement, the jury hears, and there were no concerns.

Updates as dad jailed for 15 years for murdering teen daughter Scarlett Vickers

Simon Vickers, 50, of Geneva Road, Darlington, was found guilty of the murder of his daughter, Scarlett, 14.

www.chroniclelive.co.uk

 

[OceanElix]

I can only base my opinions on the evidence that is made public:

12:55David Huntley

No social services involvement​

Mr Lumley asks about the relationships between the family members. The witness says that police made inquiries about the relationships and found there was “nothing untoward that would suggest it was anything other than a normal family”.

There was no social services involvement, the jury hears, and there were no concerns.

Updates as dad jailed for 15 years for murdering teen daughter Scarlett Vickers

Simon Vickers, 50, of Geneva Road, Darlington, was found guilty of the murder of his daughter, Scarlett, 14.

www.chroniclelive.co.uk

sbm
Thanks for posting this.

It seems odd there was no involvement, I wonder if there was ever a referral and if so, whether it didn't meet the threshold or was NFA'd.

 

[wtiger]

has anyone actually seen one piece of evidence that a murder actually took place here?

correct me if i'm wrong but this guy needs to prove zero in court......where is the case to prosecute for murder???

 

[Dotta]

has anyone actually seen one piece of evidence that a murder actually took place here?

correct me if i'm wrong but this guy needs to prove zero in court......where is the case to prosecute for murder???

IMO
the pathologist's opinion is quite damning
(11 cm deep stabbing, firm grip on the knife).
This is a fact.

"Throwing knives mucking around"
sounds like fiction to me.

JMO

 

[Yellowbelly]

has anyone actually seen one piece of evidence that a murder actually took place here?

correct me if i'm wrong but this guy needs to prove zero in court......where is the case to prosecute for murder???

We've got to bear in mind that we only get to hear the edited highlights of the evidence, rather than everything that gets put in front of the jury, but this is a reasonable point. I think the combination of the evidence from the pathologist and the paramedics puts the knife in his hand, but has the prosecution shown him thrusting it into Scarlett's chest to the satisfaction of the jury, rather than Scarlett stumbling onto it, for example?

The thing is, Scarlett stubbling onto the knife isn't the story that the parents have been telling. Their version of events is so clearly nonsense that it's reasonable to ask why they are lying and what they are trying to hide.

 

[bobbymkii]

https://www.itv.com/news/tyne-tees/2025-01-21/mum-tells-jury-partner-accused-of-their-daughters-murder-would-never-harm-her

 

[jepop]

https://www.itv.com/news/tyne-tees/2025-01-21/mum-tells-jury-partner-accused-of-their-daughters-murder-would-never-harm-her

I don't know what happened/the mechanics of how it happened, but I don't think Vickers murdered his daughter. I don't think there was ever an intent to harm her. However it happened it was not deliberate. Just my opinion.

Maybe there is some sort of recklessness but moo I don't believe either parent realised their daughter had been stabbed in the moments immediately after she said 'ow' and fell to the floor. The source you post for this trial detailed his testimony of efforts to apply first aid, and witness testimony of the emotional and distraught state of both parents. I only think they realised about the knife after the paramedics arrived. Both were in extreme shock imo and just trying to put it together. JMO

 

[OceanElix]

I don't know what happened/the mechanics of how it happened, but I don't think Vickers murdered his daughter. I don't think there was ever an intent to harm her. However it happened it was not deliberate. Just my opinion.

Maybe there is some sort of recklessness but moo I don't believe either parent realised their daughter had been stabbed in the moments immediately after she said 'ow' and fell to the floor. The source you post for this trial detailed his testimony of efforts to apply first aid, and witness testimony of the emotional and distraught state of both parents. I only think they realised about the knife after the paramedics arrived. Both were in extreme shock imo and just trying to put it together. JMO

From the previous reports is it that they were too out of it with drink/substances to understand what was actually happening?

 

[jepop]

From the previous reports is it that they were too out of it with drink/substances to understand what was actually happening?

Moo prior to paramedics they knew Scarlett was in trouble and something terrible had happened to her, she was bleeding and losing consciousness and having difficulty breathing. But yes for sure, it doesn't seem unreasonable, at least to me, that moderate intoxication (not mild but also not extreme blackout stage) (was it a few,/3 or 4,? glasses of wine and some pot?) combined with extreme shock could impact their understanding in the moment and also recollections when questioned. I feel like his testimony revealed a very confused and distressed state of mind. Jmo.

 

[ChatteringBirds]

The thing is, Scarlett stubbling onto the knife isn't the story that the parents have been telling. Their version of events is so clearly nonsense that it's reasonable to ask why they are lying and what they are trying to hide.

(Quote snipped by me.)
I agree with you, because if it was an accident, you should just say what happened.

Something that may happen in domestic situations is that a person becomes angry, grabs a weapon nearby, and it all happens within seconds. Then they might start telling a story, including to themselves, because who wants to admit that their anger led to an impulsive act that became tragedy?

(Some people would admit it, but they would have to have upstanding character.)

Just my opinions.

 

[imstilla.grandma]

Scarlett was a year nine pupil at Haughton Academy, and the school paid tribute to her in a statement. The school described her as a lovely girl, and important member of the community.

Updates as dad jailed for 15 years for murdering teen daughter Scarlett Vickers

Simon Vickers, 50, of Geneva Road, Darlington, was found guilty of the murder of his daughter, Scarlett, 14.

www.chroniclelive.co.uk

 

[Atlasiamgoing]

(Quote snipped by me.)
I agree with you, because if it was an accident, you should just say what happened.

Something that may happen in domestic situations is that a person becomes angry, grabs a weapon nearby, and it all happens within seconds. Then they might start telling a story, including to themselves, because who wants to admit that their anger led to an impulsive act that became tragedy?

(Some people would admit it, but they would have to have upstanding character.)

Just my opinions.

I do not understand how mum’s charges were dropped - there are three people in the kitchen two don’t know what happened and the other has died so why are they just thinking it was him?

 

[Honeybirdette]

I’ll be shocked if he’s not found guilty. His version is so implausible. And the mum conveniently wasn’t looking when it happened even though she was in the room.
Why would he even throw some tongs at his daughter? Even if it was messing about, they could hurt her.
We’ll never know what actually happened because the dad doesn’t want to go to prison and the mum is covering for him.

 

[bobbymkii]

I do not understand how mum’s charges were dropped - there are three people in the kitchen two don’t know what happened and the other has died so why are they just thinking it was him?

Because he said in police interview "it must have been (me)." I'm wondering more why she was charged in the first place. If you scroll right back to one of the first comments on this thread, you'll see me make a comment something along the lines of "if there's only one stab wound, surely there's only one stabbist." And I'm seeing very little to suggest this could ever have been considered a joint enterprise case, so I don't know how the CPS decided to authorise the murder charge against Sarah Hall in the first place.

 

[Yellowbelly]

The jury has gone out to reach their verdict.

Updates as dad jailed for 15 years for murdering teen daughter Scarlett Vickers

Simon Vickers, 50, of Geneva Road, Darlington, was found guilty of the murder of his daughter, Scarlett, 14.

www.chroniclelive.co.uk

 

[ChatteringBirds]

Is there only one possible charge for the jury to consider?

 

[bobbymkii]

Is there only one possible charge for the jury to consider?

no. They can find him guilty of either murder or manslaughter.

 

[Deleted member 339775]

no. They can find him guilty of either murder or manslaughter.

I’m thinking he’ll get manslaughter because murder is a tough one to prove when the only other living witness is sticking firmly to her story