UK UK - Suzy Lamplugh, 25, Fulham, 28 Jul 1986 #3

[Observe_dont_Absorb]

I would imagine the brother of the Shorrolds Road Herring was also given same nickname at school or in the local area - that's how it works with one of those sort of names.

 

[Cluesleuth]

I would imagine the brother of the Shorrolds Road Herring was also given same nickname at school or in the local area - that's how it works with one of those sort of names.

Perhaps the older one was called Kipper and the younger Kip

 

[asyousay]

Isn't the point that the timing might be off due to the witness being a little unreliable or mistaken?

Well LE would of checked him out like they did with BW. Also being 3/4 hours out would be a massive jump as well.

 

[WestLondoner]

Well LE would of checked him out like they did with BW. Also being 3/4 hours out would be a massive jump as well.

I am sure you're right in principle, but suppose you're leading the inquiry.

You've rushed to go public before cross checking key statements from staff about who was where when, and you've only now realised that HR is a total flake and could easily have been describing a visit by MG and SF.

Despite your TV appeal you've had no further sightings of Mr Kipper whether at 37SR or anywhere else. Do you go public again saying Actually forget all that Mr Kipper stuff, or do you double down and insist on it more?

I reckon you do the latter. It's less embarrassing and it looks like you're following an active lead.

Like you I vary in what I think, mainly between thinking something happened at the pub and something eg an abduction happened en route to it. I don't buy the 37SR story at all because none of the other supporting evidence for it you would expect to have shown up ever has. No departure from 37SR by SJL has ever been seen; no nearby property to which SJL might have taken has ever been found; no reports by neighbours of mysterious comings and goings at a supposedly empty property; no BMW belonging to Mr Kipper has ever turned up; and so on. Literally zippo.

This in turn makes me sceptical of any JC involvement, because Mr Kipper is a wraith and a master criminal whereas JC is an incredible Macchu Poochu sedimentary cretin. JC, for example, carried evidence of his having committed one crime (SB's tax disc) around in his car while committing other crimes. And this is the the master criminal who made both himself and SJL vanish?!

 

[Observe_dont_Absorb]

Well LE would of checked him out like they did with BW. Also being 3/4 hours out would be a massive jump as well.

I personally sense that there was a lot of things LE didn’t check out as fully and rigorously as one could imagine. Mostly because they were off from the start with a firm narrative which directed all their actions.

Until we get full disclosure for independent scrutiny, there’s no way of knowing. I do not have blind faith in London Metropolitan Police because like many of us I’m a Londoner and have witness too many failings and corruption over the years.

 

[asyousay]

I personally sense that there was a lot of things LE didn’t check out as fully and rigorously as one could imagine. Mostly because they were off from the start with a firm narrative which directed all their actions.

Until we get full disclosure for independent scrutiny, there’s no way of knowing. I do not have blind faith in London Metropolitan Police because like many of us I’m a Londoner and have witness too many failings and corruption over the years.

Yep we have certainly seen loads of botched stuff over the years.


But with stuff like this it just seems like text book stuff and there have been reviews of this case so I can cannot fathom such a glaring over sight.


Like I can understand somebody being 25 mins out on time. But 3 or 4 hours would be basically
Impossible imo


MG was at Lunch and then realistically he goes back to the office and nobody would start to think anything is amiss until 2ish. and then maybe you think car Trouble and other reasonable possibilities and so he wouldn’t of been at SR Until gone 3pm at earliest .
That sketch can not be MG if he saw a couple at 1pm which Coincidentally is just when SL would of been showing a client around the property.


imo ,
Moo

 

[WestLondoner]

How do we know HR saw anyone at all?

 

[asyousay]

How do we know HR saw anyone at all?

You could say that about any witness though ?

We know for example with BW they checked her out and made sure she was credible which she was. So if they did that with her then it would of been the same for the others.

 

[Pinkizzy]

I wonder whether the male passenger with SJL ever came forward to say he was in the car travelling along Fulham Palace Rd.

 

[WestLondoner]

You could say that about any witness though ?

We know for example with BW they checked her out and made sure she was credible which she was. So if they did that with her then it would of been the same for the others.

And then dismissed her sighting...

 

[asyousay]

And then dismissed her sighting...

I thought she did a tv interview and was considered credible?

 

[Whitehall 1212]

I wonder whether the male passenger with SJL ever came forward to say he was in the car travelling along Fulham Palace Rd.

Probably not!

 

[WestLondoner]

I thought she did a tv interview and was considered credible?

Very much so - all the more reason to wonder why her sighting was discounted. If accurate it undermines any PoW visit but also the 37SR-to-123SR timeline.

 

[Whitehall 1212]

Very much so - all the more reason to wonder why her sighting was discounted. If accurate it undermines any PoW visit but also the 37SR-to-123SR timeline.

I have to question why BW waited a number of days, a week I believe, before she provided a statement?

Surely with all the publicity and that she knew SJL she'd be banging the Met Police Commissioner's door down!

I wasn't convinced by her TV interview, she came across us someone trying to sound convincing when they doubted themselves.

She said she saw SJL with a man, yet could not describe anything about him....again.....she SAW a man but could not describe ANYTHING about him! That in my book is highly unusual.

The car with the straw boater was splashed all over the TV news and in the papers. I very much doubt that BW had an opportunity see what may be on the rear parcel shelf ....yet not describe anything about the man.

I think BW was a ghost witness. Quite possibly well meaning but wanted to 'help' rather too much.


JMO

 

[WiseOwl]

I have to question why BW waited a number of days, a week I believe, before she provided a statement?

Surely with all the publicity and that she knew SJL she'd be banging the Met Police Commissioner's door down!

I wasn't convinced by her TV interview, she came across us someone trying to sound convincing when they doubted themselves.

She said she saw SJL with a man, yet could not describe anything about him....again.....she SAW a man but could not describe ANYTHING about him! That in my book is highly unusual.

The car with the straw boater was splashed all over the TV news and in the papers. I very much doubt that BW had an opportunity see what may be on the rear parcel shelf ....yet not describe anything about the man.

I think BW was a ghost witness. Quite possibly well meaning but wanted to 'help' rather too much.


JMO

Better to wait a week than 14 years like some other witness did!

 

[WestLondoner]

The thing about the 'Kipper = MG' possibility is that if you look at what AS wrote in 1988, it was put to the police in 1987.

"When viewers of Crimewatch phoned to say that Gurdon looked similar to the photofit picture of Mr Kipper, the detectives merely laughed.' (p130)

He doesn't write that this possible misidentification was investigated and ruled out; instead, detectives just laughed and it wasn't taken seriously at all. What else was laughed at? What was not laughed at that should have been?

 

[WiseOwl]

It might have taken a week after Suzy disappeared for BW to give a statement, but for all we know she could have contacted the police the day after she went missing.

Didn't they interview something like 1,600 people during the investigation? I doubt very much that if you contacted the police with any information about Suzy at the time that they would be able to speak to you straight away - it could well take a week before they got round to taking a statement or before it was released to the public.

 

[Whitehall 1212]

Better to wait a week than 14 years like some other witness did!

The point is that BW knew SJL.....so why wait a week with all the publicity? Would you....if you were in that situation?

I suggest that it was a ghost sighting for the reasons I gave in my previous post (#1198).

Other witnesses coming forward later need to be assessed for reliability on a case-by-case basis. I am discussing BW, not others.

 

[asyousay]

Cluesleuth Posted these a few weeks ago

AS Book page 52
BW had come into the police station and given detectives some astonishing information.
The previous Monday she told detectives, she left her office some time after 2.30 in the afternoon. She was on her bike, and cycled from Munster road into Fulham palace rd thru Fulham Cemetry. And there driving north towards Hammersmith in a white Ford Fiesta with a straw boater on the back sill - who did she see but her old friend Sussanah Lamplugh.

AS Book pg 52-53
BW was the first witness to report seeing Susannah who actually knew her and therefore was much less likely to be mistaken. She was a sound, sane, well educated professional woman.
The police checked with her colleagues thats she had indeed made the journey on the Monday and all confirmed she had.

 

[Cluesleuth]

It might have taken a week after Suzy disappeared for BW to give a statement, but for all we know she could have contacted the police the day after she went missing.

Didn't they interview something like 1,600 people during the investigation? I doubt very much that if you contacted the police with any information about Suzy at the time that they would be able to speak to you straight away - it could well take a week before they got round to taking a statement or before it was released to the public.

Good point WO.
It was also July she could have away been on holiday for all we know.