UK UK - Suzy Lamplugh, 25, Fulham, 28 Jul 1986 #4

[Cluesleuth]

It's literally what everybody had to do. Your landline was physically tethered to the wall, and there were no cordless handsets. So you had your conversation wherever that was: kitchen, living room, in larger houses (not 2-bed flats) one of the bedrooms. If you receive a personal call on your mobile at work today, you probably walk away from your desk, for the same reason.

I would have to disagree with this the lead cable could be as long as you requested it to be and definately long enough to stretch across a hallway to another room in a flat
JMO

 

[Cluesleuth]

Well, I'm not sure the evidence does say that.

First, the cheque book was more likely lost than stolen, because there was no point stealing a cheque book without the cheque guarantee card. You couldn't pay for anything just with a cheque, because if it were for more than what you had in your account, it would bounce. So you had to produce the cheque card. This had your signature on it and the payee was supposed to compare the signature on that with the one on the cheque you had just written, and make sure they're the same. If they are, s/he writes the number on the card across the back of the cheque. When presented, the bank would then pay that cheque, hence "cheque guarantee card", whether you had enough money in your account or not. Therefore, to use stolen cheques, you needed to steal the cheque card as well. For this reason, banks told you not to keep it with the cheque book. If they suspected that you had, they would deduct the stolen cheques from your balance, exactly like they do with cash withdrawals today if they think you've kept your PIN with your debit card. So theft is unlikely.

Have you considered that she also had a credit card. Its said that her pursed contained £15 and her cards.
JMO

 

[WestLondoner]

Have you considered that she also had a credit card. Its said that her pursed contained £15 and her cards.
JMO

This doesn't make the cheque book more useful to a thief though. It just says that she would have had to use a credit card for non-cash purchases.

 

[Cherwell]

It would make no difference to CV which day he found them, Friday or Monday.
As he was only due to take over on Monday wouldn’t he have arrived on Sunday?

No - he had been there for three months, undergoing training.

 

[asyousay]

Not really she could have missed them Sunday evening.

Al knew the items were missing
Theres no record of a telephone call between them on Monday before she disappeared.
Did she tell him her items were missing in the Sunday evening telephone call?

Where we know they visited Mossops on Friday evening we have absolutely no idea if she took those items with her over the weekend.

JMO

She was also insanely busy that weekend so as you rightly said it could have been Sunday night before she noticed.

 

[WestLondoner]

I would have to disagree with this the lead cable could be as long as you requested it to be and definately long enough to stretch across a hallway to another room in a flat
JMO

And was it?

 

[WestLondoner]

She was also insanely busy that weekend so as you rightly said it could have been Sunday night before she noticed.

In which case we need to know where the stuff was for 48 hours and how it travelled from Mossops to the pub.

 

[WestLondoner]

No - he had been there for three months, undergoing training.

But not immediately beforehand though.

I had about three couples that trained with me at the Prince of Wales. They normally stayed with us for about twelve weeks, because that was the length of the course. Once they finished the twelve-week training course, they then went round and did relief in various pubs around the country....‘When I was on holiday, I always insisted that the people I’d trained at my pub do my relief work. Those were the ones that ran my pub when I wasn’t there.'

Videcette, David. FINDING SUZY: The Hunt for Missing Estate Agent Suzy Lamplugh and 'Mr Kipper' (p. 159). DNA Books. Kindle Edition.

The end of July was week 30, hence he'd so far trained 2 couples. One of them, CV/KF, returned to run the pub in his absence. So they had been there before but necessarily immediately before.

 

[RichardKimble]

Am I right in thinking, four places are linked to Sl and her belongings, her flat, her car, her office and the POW, did the answer lay or lie in one of those ?

 

[Cluesleuth]

This doesn't make the cheque book more useful to a thief though. It just says that she would have had to use a credit card for non-cash purchases.

I agree but the cheque book was returned, we know little about the condition of the returned items- like were any pages of the diary or blank cheques missing.
Had anyone tried to cash a cheque from that cheque book that weekend?
Was the cheque book inside the pages of the diary so it wasnt the thiefs main interest the return of a cheque book seems odd.

There were said to be other items to have gone missing too, How many items and what were they?
Why were they never recovered.

Its all very suspicious.
JMO

 

[Cluesleuth]

And was it?

That would be a question perhaps NB or the previous owners of the SJL's flat could answer.

JMO

 

[Cherwell]

But not immediately beforehand though.

I had about three couples that trained with me at the Prince of Wales. They normally stayed with us for about twelve weeks, because that was the length of the course. Once they finished the twelve-week training course, they then went round and did relief in various pubs around the country....‘When I was on holiday, I always insisted that the people I’d trained at my pub do my relief work. Those were the ones that ran my pub when I wasn’t there.'

Videcette, David. FINDING SUZY: The Hunt for Missing Estate Agent Suzy Lamplugh and 'Mr Kipper' (p. 159). DNA Books. Kindle Edition.

The end of July was week 30, hence he'd so far trained 2 couples. One of them, CV/KF, returned to run the pub in his absence. So they had been there before but necessarily immediately before.

I haven't read the DV book, but I'm sure I read that "CV" had been there for the previous three months. It might be in AS, but the book has gone back to the library so I can't check.

 

[Terryb808]

No - he had been there for three months, undergoing training.

But not the three months prior to SJL disappearance, he was call back to cover for the permanent landlord, who obviously like him.

 

[Terryb808]

I haven't read the DV book, but I'm sure I read that "CV" had been there for the previous three months. It might be in AS, but the book has gone back to the library so I can't check.

I have both books for reference and don’t recall it in AS, I’ll check and post it I find it.

 

[WestLondoner]

Am I right in thinking, four places are linked to Sl and her belongings, her flat, her car, her office and the POW, did the answer lay or lie in one of those ?

There certainly appear to have been four places she might have gone - home, 37SR, 123SR, and the PoW. The first three were all searched, she wasn't found at any and there was no sign she'd been inside 37SR or 123SR. The last place, the PoW, never was searched.

I still find this unfathomable, given that the pub was the last place she spoke to, and was the only one of those four places that we know she definitely intended to go to that day. IMO, she can't be said definitely to have intended to go to 37SR. As the client name is made up, so might the whole appointment be.

 

[asyousay]

There certainly appear to have been four places she might have gone - home, 37SR, 123SR, and the PoW. The first three were all searched, she wasn't found at any and there was no sign she'd been inside 37SR or 123SR. The last place, the PoW, never was searched.

I still find this unfathomable, given that the pub was the last place she spoke to, and was the only one of those four places that we know she definitely intended to go to that day. IMO, she can't be said definitely to have intended to go to 37SR. As the client name is made up, so might the whole appointment be.

Yes I don’t believe CV did it but a lot is just his word for things so definitely should of been looked into more.


ETA - or maybe he was and we are just not privy to that information.

 

[WestLondoner]

Yes I don’t believe CV did it but a lot is just his word for things so definitely should of been looked into more.


ETA - or maybe he was and we are just not privy to that information.

It's hard to fathom. If CV did it, he would have had the same motive as any abductor, but it's not obvious that he had as much opportunity, given that he had a pub to run. He did, however, tell DV he was at the pub on his own ('...I was in by myself while… this was going on’ - DV p. 168) and, in the second interview, that KF was not there:

Was she present when it was happening? How does she know about it all?’ I asked, smiling at him. Clive stayed silent. ‘Was she there on the Monday?’ I asked again. ‘No,’ he said flatly, staring back at me in an odd way....– he began shouting again at the top of his voice; this time he couldn’t control himself, getting angrier by the second – ‘SHE HAD NOTHING TO DO WITH IT!’ ‘I don’t understand why I’ve upset you,’ I verbally prodded him. ‘I told you she had nothing to do with it.’ Clive lowered his voice (p195, 199).

AS says the police found his revised account of what happened so hard to understand that they eventually decided he had made a mistake, and that his previous account was correct. This, along with handwaving BW's sighting away, makes me uneasy about how well the investigation was conducted. Both instances suggest they'd settled on a narrative, and that information undermining that narrative was explained away, rather than taken seriously.

 

[Cluesleuth]

AS book pg 90
Many of SJL's colleagues on the QE2 were Northerners.
page 117
It was established that SJL had been mixing with a group of people from the QE2 only a month before her disappearance, when she and JH spent the weekend in Leeds attending the wedding of a friend from the ship.
page 127
JH rembered that as they were making arrangements for the wedding SJLhad told him she was seeing a married man. He had told her she was asking for trouble.
......
So as far back as a month before she disappeared she told someone that she had been seeing a married man.
JMO

 

[Pinkizzy]

Is JH the one who lived on Wardo and Shorrolds Rd?

 

[Cluesleuth]

Is JH the one who lived on Wardo and Shorrolds Rd?

No.. JH was an ex boyfriend of SJL's they had were in a relationship when both worked on board the QE2