UK UK - Suzy Lamplugh, 25, Fulham, 28 Jul 1986 #8

[WestLondoner]

Thanks. I wonder if it's worth the faff. I wonder how she came to be writing notes on a true crime book in the first place?

 

[lee sumner]

Someone mentioned above that maybe TS / PSS are litigious. One or other of them is.

PSS divorced TS not long after the SJL and bankruptcy episodes and has given press interviews where she describes living on the breadline with 2 kids and no help from TS whom she describes IIRC as intimidating, possibly violent. The press interviews related to her second career as a sex expert, in which capacity she's been a talking head on Big Brother and has written a number of guides on how to do sex. These include titles such as Sizzling Sex: The Sex Doctor's 250 Hottest-Techniques, Sinful Sex: The Uninhibited Guide To Erotic Pleasure, Sex Academy: Essential Lessons in Seduction and Spectacular Sex, Steamy Sex: The Sex Doctor's Guide To Keeping It Hot, Fabulous Foreplay: The Sex Doctor's Guide To Teasing and Pleasing Your Lover, Naughty Tricks and Sexy Tips: A Couple's Guide To Uninhibited Erotic Pleasure, and Make Love All Night and Talk to Him in the Morning: Bite-Size Tips for Sex and Relationships. She's clearly not a shy person, then, but she has no Wikipedia page. A few years ago a now-banned member contacted her through either X or LinkedIn and asked her what her take on SJL was. She replied that SJL was a dear friend whom she missed terribly but would have nothing else to say.

TS got out of bankruptcy and made some more money, but I am not sure where or how. He has no online profile.

DV posted a Twitter update once from Elizabeth Street, the road in Belgravia TS/PSS lived in. Make of that what you will. I'd be amazed if he had made no attempt to contact them and PSS would be very easy to reach, yet neither of them has been so much as mentioned in anything written or screened about the case since AS' book came out.

elizabeth st. that is where lord lucan lived when he killed SR. he had his own flat after he split up from his wife VL. the house where murder took place was around the corner. i wonder what number did PSS live at. just curious.

 

[Konstantin]

Thanks. I wonder if it's worth the faff. I wonder how she came to be writing notes on a true crime book in the first place?

I might give it a go if I get some time.
My recollection is that she did review books, was possibly interested in the SJL case and perhaps knew AS even slightly. Her own books are very far from crime novels so that's not her interest. It is odd though.

 

[Klclevi]

Someone mentioned above that maybe TS / PSS are litigious. One or other of them is.

PSS divorced TS not long after the SJL and bankruptcy episodes and has given press interviews where she describes living on the breadline with 2 kids and no help from TS whom she describes IIRC as intimidating, possibly violent. The press interviews related to her second career as a sex expert, in which capacity she's been a talking head on Big Brother and has written a number of guides on how to do sex. These include titles such as Sizzling Sex: The Sex Doctor's 250 Hottest-Techniques, Sinful Sex: The Uninhibited Guide To Erotic Pleasure, Sex Academy: Essential Lessons in Seduction and Spectacular Sex, Steamy Sex: The Sex Doctor's Guide To Keeping It Hot, Fabulous Foreplay: The Sex Doctor's Guide To Teasing and Pleasing Your Lover, Naughty Tricks and Sexy Tips: A Couple's Guide To Uninhibited Erotic Pleasure, and Make Love All Night and Talk to Him in the Morning: Bite-Size Tips for Sex and Relationships. She's clearly not a shy person, then, but she has no Wikipedia page. A few years ago a now-banned member contacted her through either X or LinkedIn and asked her what her take on SJL was. She replied that SJL was a dear friend whom she missed terribly but would have nothing else to say.

TS got out of bankruptcy and made some more money, but I am not sure where or how. He has no online profile.

DV posted a Twitter update once from Elizabeth Street, the road in Belgravia TS/PSS lived in. Make of that what you will. I'd be amazed if he had made no attempt to contact them and PSS would be very easy to reach, yet neither of them has been so much as mentioned in anything written or screened about the case since AS' book came out.

There was one posting on her website about the death of DL I just found yesterday. It is very brief.
Very, very sad to read that safety campaigner Diana Lamplugh OBE has died 25 years after her daughter Suzywas abducted, never to be found.

She had enormous strength and courage and did something incredibly positive out of an absolute tragedy by setting up the Suzy Lamplugh Trust.

It does fantastic work and one small way you can support the Trust is if you need a personal safety alarm then buy one from their website. I wish the very best for the rest of her family who have always been brave and courageous in handling their tremendous loss

Interesting she posts -never to be found?! Would you not say something along the lines of - her body has never been found to this day? That is weird if you ask me.

If SJL was in the habit of also having affairs with married men - TS could very well have been one of them or the one referred to? She could have threatened to expose the relationship (thinking he might leave PSS for her and she would then have the upper class life?)

Have a think about it - she knew him - a fair bit of trust I would say. He with all promises of a life with her but it was never going to get serious in the long run according to him. He would not let her risk the assets he and PSS did have. Though I would have to question this angle if he filed for bankruptcy 8 days later but that is not to say assets such as a Belgravia house were not protected by other means (not sure how that works in the UK - companies, trusts, all matter of legal structures)

SJL could have made the ruse to meet him at that lunchtime Monday but he had other ideas. PSS was obviously at home because it was the nannys day off therefore he was probably free to move around as he liked. SJL had not been in touch with PSS for some time prior to her disappearance when they were apparently planning a business venture together, could this be because she was shagging her hubby?

If they lived in Belgravia they def were not povvos, he could have driven a LH drive BMW for all we know. They could have owned property in Fulham that was vacant, he could have asked her to have a look at it to sell as part of the lunchtime meetup or even to just meet for sex ? And see you later Suzy...

Does not explain the POW scenario at all or BW sighting either , but just putting another thought out there. SJL IMO has more links with this couple (or just the husband) than meets the eye.

 

[lee sumner]

I agree the couple don't fit his theory. But there are other people who don't fit his theory either - AL for example - but it doesn't stop DV including him and making something of a point out of his reaction to being questioned.

I've never really been of the opinion that the couple were involved in SJLs disappearance; moreso that, if nothing else, their inclusion would simply add some colour to his book!
For me, he DOES lean into the dramatic, which is perhaps why I find the book pretty readable; to me it is more like a novel than an investigative analysis however.

DV thought it was strange what AL said, but i dont. AL is probably tired of all the rumour and myth surrounding the lamplugh case. after nearly 4 decades, iam not surprised he thinks she will never be found.

 

[lee sumner]

On some detail points above - the Wardo Avenue bike contract note most likely simply means "remember to bike over to the owner of that house in Wardo the contract whereby we're retained to sell his / her house".

Her imminent commission of £3,000 was quite likely just the ordinary sales commission on dwellings she'd sold. She talked about this on Saturday 26th July and payday was the following Thursday, the 31st (end of the month). Estate agents then charged about 2% commission, of which the one who won the instruction and the one whose buyer exchanged on the property would get 15%, i.e. 0.3% for either slice. My source for this is a friend who was an EA nearby in 1990; that was his pay structure. A commission of £3,000 is thus her slice of £1 million of property, which is about six or seven houses / flats - or fewer than that if she also won the instruction. The fact that she had a diary note to bike a contract round suggests that she did get involved in winning instructions as well as selling.

How blonde SJL actually was is a matter of opinion. The last (IIRC) photo taken of her was at the 21st birthday party she went to on Saturday, in which she doesn't look that blonde at all. This was right after the blonding was done. It was the family, conducting their own press conferences in their back garden, who unleashed all the brunette photos that so muddied the waters. While she certainly looks very pretty in many of them, it is not clear how representative they were.

It's instructive to compare some of the photos of her and look at her face and build. In some, she is decidedly jowly. In others, she is exceedingly svelte. It has been suggested she was slimming rapidly at the time; one wonders why. When women do this it is quite often new-bloke-related.

AS did indeed have access to the police files. As the police failed to find any killer until the press and the family told them it was Cannan, you wonder what special insight the files gave, if any. We can hazard a guess at what was omitted from the book from the comments about the News of the World quality of that material, the money offered for it and the hints left in AS. Without saying so expressly he indicates that she was four-timing AL - besides him there was DH, her persistent ex, someone she slept with the previous weekend and from memory one other besides. He'd been on holiday for a week but she promptly blanked him all weekend: very unfriendly. They should have been all over each other on the Friday.

The implication I draw is that she was yours for as long as you paid generously for everything; i.e. she was not "tomming it" but she was highly available to open-handed prosperous men, including married ones, whether she was herself ostensibly attached or not. This was still a thing in the 1980s - I knew many young women who spent literally nothing on their social life because they could get all of it paid for by their boyfriends.

This stuff was kept out because ultimately, DL was more concerned to preserve SJL's reputation than to find her killer. If - 100% hypothetically, this is not the true position - but if convicting SJL's killer would have revealed that she had been working as a hooker, DL in that case would have rather seen the case left unsolved.

This probably explains IMO AL's white lie to DV that he and SJL had never been to the PoW. In 1986 his story was that they went there on Friday and her stuff went missing. But the landlord is adamant her stuff was found on Sunday, in which case she was not there with AL at all. She'd already dumped him, but as a favour to DL and perhaps because he genuinely liked SJL, he tactfully misrepped what happened. I like him for doing this, even though it's unhelpful.

There is a much, much better possible case against Cannan, but it's not the one trotted out by the police, which relies on insinuation, misdirection and decades-old hearsay that's never admitted to as such. The publicly-made case against Cannan is based on this nonsense because it enables the police to say they only found out who did it years later. There were in fact many pointers to Cannan at the time, which they failed to follow up. The real case against him could have been made in 1986/7 and Shirley Banks would still be alive. One notable point is that AR, his married solicitor girlfriend, apparently remembered Cannan mentioning SJL to her before she disappeared. She reported these conversations to the police after she did so, and the police did nothing about it. They can't admit this, so that's why it's all "I saw Cannan looking in the window" 14 years after the fact. JMO.

Sandra Court is puzzling, but on balance Cannan probably did it IMO. Her belongings were scattered along the roadside at intervals of miles. If you plot where they were found, it's consistent with a logical route towards the M3 and back to London.

DV has done a good job picking apart "facts" that are often simply unacknowledged assumptions at the time. E.g HR is an unreliable witness whose minimum, least contentious claim is that he heard 37SR's door slam and saw 2 people coming out. When the police entered 37SR, they thought that nobody had been inside that day and they found no evidence SJL had ever been inside (if they had we'd know about it). With or without the keys, she never went inside, so HR's account is demonstrably embellished. Between DV's lines, it was MG who forgot to mention to the police that the keys they used to get in were the only set they had.

A point brought up but not parsed by DV is the odd behaviour of "CV" (= KH) in 1986. While the landlord MH is away, with CV in charge, the police visit the pub to retrieve the belongings of the country's most famous missing person, who's all over the press. When MH gets back, CV said....absolutely nothing. The first MH heard of the police visit was when they turned up a year later for a close-off chat and find that MH was not the landlord they'd spoken to a year before. Which is pretty odd - the first thing MH is going to say on his return would be "How did it go then? Any dramas?" To which CV evidently said "Nah, all quiet" and completely failed to mention the pub's role in a major news story. Eh?

There are three major problems with DV's alternative hypothesis. First, he glosses over the pub's floor having been lowered in the 1990s. How could you do that and not notice a body? Concealment on the embankment is more likely as the pub floor scenario would implicate a single person. On the embankment, she could have been put there by anyone. Second, without saying why, he ignores the BW sighting, which was by someone who knew her and which blows his pub scenario apart. Third, he ignores all the information laid against Cannan by JT, who had a flat within walking distance of 37SR.

DW strikes me as a waste of time to listen to. I've never heard him say anything he wasn't simply repeating from one of the many identical documentaries.

thanks for info, regarding pay structure. i have always been curious about the 3 grand commision SL was expecting. now iam starting to understand how EA worked back in the 1980s.

 

[lee sumner]

Have I read somewhere that she was a sex therapist or something like that? Yes completely understand- they would have had a field day!

see excerpt below from the following article - how I would love to read that news of the world piece today!
Susannah Clapp · Ventures

Andrew Stephen’s book has added to this celebrity. So have the newspaper stories about his story. For three long weeks the Observer carried huge chunks of this tiny book. Their estimate of the story which was most likely to attract readers was the same as that of the News of the World, who shortly before Andrew Stephen’s book was published put a picture of Susannah Lamplugh on the cover of its colour-supplement. This showed her sitting on a bunk smoking, in a little silky garment. Alongside large amounts of tanned thigh was the legend: ‘REVEALED! SUZY LAMPLUGH’S SECRET LOVER.’ Inside, a gruellingly banal article described a (non-secret) affair with a hairdresser on the QE2. ‘Right from the start there was something between them, Jon remembers. “When I first saw Suzy I thought, ‘Wow, who is she?’ ” ’ Other papers, excited by the news that the Lamplugh parents had turned against the book, expressed their excitement in ways peculiar to themselves. The People said Stephen credited Susannah with fifty lovers: he doesn’t. The Times said the Lamplugh family had left home while the book was being publicised and published: they were back for publication date. The Guardian denounced the ‘public voyeurism that provokes publication’ of such an ‘archetypal ghoul’s story’ – though it was the Lamplughs, not a ravening mob, who had approached the publishers with the idea for this book, and the publishers were free to say no. Andrew Stephen had one defender in Anita Brookner – but the effectiveness of her attack on his attackers was diminished by its appearing in the Observer while that paper was ending its serialisation of the book. He also mounted his own defence, or attack.

wow, 50 lovers. is that a lot for a woman of 25 yrs old. in AS book, he does say SL had a high sex drive, and men thought she was a good lover. i cant imagine DL being pleased about this info in the book.

 

[Klclevi]

wow, 50 lovers. is that a lot for a woman of 25 yrs old. in AS book, he does say SL had a high sex drive, and men thought she was a good lover. i cant imagine DL being pleased about this info in the book.

I am guessing he got this information from somewhere -you would not put this out there in the arena basically insinuating SJL got around a bit if you did not hear it from the horses mouth.

I still think NB knows way more about SJLs nocturnal activities than he has ever put into the public arena, probably for the sake of her family.

 

[WestLondoner]

You wonder who but SJL would have known that number (if true) and who would then have shared it.

 

[lee sumner]

I am guessing he got this information from somewhere -you would not put this out there in the arena basically insinuating SJL got around a bit if you did not hear it from the horses mouth.

I still think NB knows way more about SJLs nocturnal activities than he has ever put into the public arena, probably for the sake of her family.

you mean because he was her lodger. NB said him and SL were just friends, but he would have known her well if he lived with her. he probably knows a lot like you said.

 

[WestLondoner]

50 men by 25 is only 8 per year since 19 - a new partner every 6-7 weeks. A friend of mine hit 100 by 25, 300+ by her mid-30s. Uncommon among women, but doable with attractiveness and the right circle and appetite.

I've noticed women with very high/low body counts often have respectively low/high family connection. Epstein's victims had absent parents; my high-count friend had little parental connection. Conversely, low-count exes quickly introduced me to their family. SJL's detachment from family suggests risk-taking behaviour. This is not victim-shaming - but more partners must increase the chances of encountering dangerous individuals.

We know something was omitted from the public reporting - that hindered the search or distressed family - but was short of prostitution. Police found nothing like that, and said the suppressed material was not material. But since they didn't catch the perpetrator, they can't know what's truly material. A complex/lucrative sex life, and a lost diary containing details, wouldn't be immaterial to the case.

 

[WestLondoner]

you mean because he was her lodger. NB said him and SL were just friends, but he would have known her well if he lived with her. he probably knows a lot like you said.

If SJL didn't bring blokes back, then she stayed out with them at their place. This would probably have suggested to NB that she was sexually active, but he would have had no idea of who was involved. It could as easily have been one steady bloke or a different one, each overnight absence. I cannot imagine she'd have shared any of this with him.

 

[Eastend Eagle]

Now that it is known that the gunman in the Jill Dando case stayed in her next-door neighbour's house the night before the murder, then around SJL's disappearance should it not be ascertained if it was indeed that person's then-future mother-in-law resident at 1 Rostrevor Road, Fulham in 1986?

 

[Klclevi]

Now that it is known that the gunman in the Jill Dando case stayed in her next-door neighbour's house the night before the murder, then around SJL's disappearance should it not be ascertained if it was indeed that person's then-future mother-in-law resident at 1 Rostrevor Road, Fulham in 1986?

Hi EE sorry can you explain more ?

 

[Klclevi]

I am still on the TS line of thought as a possible theory. This is from the London Gazette 9/12/1986 (I have shortened the name to his initials only (as PSS was her hyphened name at the time and now she is PS)

Date of of filing 5th August 1986. Occupation (which I find very interesting BUILDER at 85 Elizabeth St in Belgravia) (Surname first)

S,T of Morlands, High Halden, Near Ashford, Kent, and lately residing and presently carrying onbusiness as a BUILDER at 85 Elizabeth Street, LondonS.W.I. Court—HIGH COURT OF JUSTICE. Date ofFiling Petition—5th August 1986. No. of Matter—2535of 1986. Date of Receiving Order—1st December 1986.No. of Receiving Order—2235. Whether Debtor's orCreditor's Petition-^-Creditor's. Act of Bankruptcy provedin Creditor's Petition—Section 1-1 (G) Bankruptcy Act1914.

Then- as per the London Gazette 29/5/1987- he looks like he has moved ( Westlondoner i think it was you that said PSS left him not long after SJL disappeared?)

S, T of 85 Elizabeth Street. London S.W.I, CONTRACT MANAGER and COMPANY DIRECTOR, lately residing at Flat 5, 11 Hyde Park Gardens, London W.2 and Marlands, High Halden, near Ashford, Kent, described in the Receiving Order as lately residing and presently carrying on business as a Builder at 85 Elizabeth Street, London S.W.I. Court—HIGH COURT OF JUSTICE. No. of Matter—2535 of 1986. Date of Order—15th April 1987. Date of Filing Petiing—5th August 1986.

https://www.thegazette.co.uk/London/issue/50741/page/15918/data.pdf

https://www.thegazette.co.uk/London/issue/50932/page/7000/data.pdf

My lines of thought are

1. She ended up having an affair with him as a result of her friendship with PSS ( she gave them both facials according to AS and then drank wine), he wasnt happy about her apparent lunch date on the Tuesday with PSS (who knows - he could have been crapping himself that she might tell him about their affair and so made a plan to meet her on the Monday - now as a builder he would have no shortage of places he probably had access to that he may have been working on at the time.

2. He was the man that was 'leaning on her in ways that was unpleasant , wrong and she did not want to have any more to do with it- she was almost angry ' according to her uncle. So just putting it out there - was he using her real estate connections to get work as a builder ?

Having said that, having a Belgravia address does not indicate you are just the working class. (and no I have not watched the series ha ha) . He was likely highly geared ( probably PSS did not know this and hence she left the marriage with next to nothing)

This angle of SJLs life is really really odd IMO. Something I think has way more substance to it in terms of her disappearance than JC.

 

[lee sumner]

I am still on the TS line of thought as a possible theory. This is from the London Gazette 9/12/1986 (I have shortened the name to his initials only (as PSS was her hyphened name at the time and now she is PS)

Date of of filing 5th August 1986. Occupation (which I find very interesting BUILDER at 85 Elizabeth St in Belgravia) (Surname first)

S,T of Morlands, High Halden, Near Ashford, Kent, and lately residing and presently carrying onbusiness as a BUILDER at 85 Elizabeth Street, LondonS.W.I. Court—HIGH COURT OF JUSTICE. Date ofFiling Petition—5th August 1986. No. of Matter—2535of 1986. Date of Receiving Order—1st December 1986.No. of Receiving Order—2235. Whether Debtor's orCreditor's Petition-^-Creditor's. Act of Bankruptcy provedin Creditor's Petition—Section 1-1 (G) Bankruptcy Act1914.

Then- as per the London Gazette 29/5/1987- he looks like he has moved ( Westlondoner i think it was you that said PSS left him not long after SJL disappeared?)

S, T of 85 Elizabeth Street. London S.W.I, CONTRACT MANAGER and COMPANY DIRECTOR, lately residing at Flat 5, 11 Hyde Park Gardens, London W.2 and Marlands, High Halden, near Ashford, Kent, described in the Receiving Order as lately residing and presently carrying on business as a Builder at 85 Elizabeth Street, London S.W.I. Court—HIGH COURT OF JUSTICE. No. of Matter—2535 of 1986. Date of Order—15th April 1987. Date of Filing Petiing—5th August 1986.

https://www.thegazette.co.uk/London/issue/50741/page/15918/data.pdf

https://www.thegazette.co.uk/London/issue/50932/page/7000/data.pdf

My lines of thought are

1. She ended up having an affair with him as a result of her friendship with PSS ( she gave them both facials according to AS and then drank wine), he wasnt happy about her apparent lunch date on the Tuesday with PSS (who knows - he could have been crapping himself that she might tell him about their affair and so made a plan to meet her on the Monday - now as a builder he would have no shortage of places he probably had access to that he may have been working on at the time.

2. He was the man that was 'leaning on her in ways that was unpleasant , wrong and she did not want to have any more to do with it- she was almost angry ' according to her uncle. So just putting it out there - was he using her real estate connections to get work as a builder ?

Having said that, having a Belgravia address does not indicate you are just the working class. (and no I have not watched the series ha ha) . He was likely highly geared ( probably PSS did not know this and hence she left the marriage with next to nothing)

This angle of SJLs life is really really odd IMO. Something I think has way more substance to it in terms of her disappearance than JC.

this is very interesting info.

 

[Hexe]

Now that it is known that the gunman in the Jill Dando case stayed in her next-door neighbour's house the night before the murder

Excuse me, WHAT? What's the source of that?

 

[lee sumner]

elizabeth st. that is where lord lucan lived when he killed SR. he had his own flat after he split up from his wife VL. the house where murder took place was around the corner. i wonder what number did PSS live at. just curious.

PSS said if only she had lunch with SL on monday that would have changed events, but how would it have changed things. SL would still have met mr kipper at 1245pm, just before her lunch break.

 

[lee sumner]

50 men by 25 is only 8 per year since 19 - a new partner every 6-7 weeks. A friend of mine hit 100 by 25, 300+ by her mid-30s. Uncommon among women, but doable with attractiveness and the right circle and appetite.

I've noticed women with very high/low body counts often have respectively low/high family connection. Epstein's victims had absent parents; my high-count friend had little parental connection. Conversely, low-count exes quickly introduced me to their family. SJL's detachment from family suggests risk-taking behaviour. This is not victim-shaming - but more partners must increase the chances of encountering dangerous individuals.

We know something was omitted from the public reporting - that hindered the search or distressed family - but was short of prostitution. Police found nothing like that, and said the suppressed material was not material. But since they didn't catch the perpetrator, they can't know what's truly material. A complex/lucrative sex life, and a lost diary containing details, wouldn't be immaterial to the case.

the press said claudia lawrence had 40 lovers in her lifetime. its not that many.

 

[Spy Versus Spy]

Bonnie Blue had 1000 in 12hrs apparently. Makes both look like Mother Theresa and Anne Widecombe.

the press said claudia lawrence had 40 lovers in her lifetime. its not that many.