UK UK - Suzy Lamplugh, 25, Fulham, 28 Jul 1986 #8

[Klclevi]

I won't link the article for obvious reasons but when PSS started writing for The People on June 15 2003 she had some interesting things to say about her life and loves.

""I understand what being a single mother is like, what it's like scraping for pennies and what it's like going through divorce. I also know what it's like to fight for your independence and climb the career ladder."

Readers with love problems will also benefit from her experiences dealing with male admirers. She dated Guy Ritchie in 1994 after they met at a karate club.

"He was a very funny man, extremely handsome and brilliant at karate," recalls black-belt holder Dr P**. "I used to love watching him because I was still learning.

"He was about eight years younger than me so he definitely goes for older women. We enjoyed a few dinner dates but kept them secret because our karate club was very gossipy and we did not want other members to know. On our third date we went to see Schindler's List. I was gob-smacked by the film and Guy was very moved by it too."

But the romance ended when her telly presenter pal Dale Winton introduced her to his agent **** - now Dr P**'s husband and stepdad to her children...

Another celebrity suitor was Anthony Hopkins. Dr P** says: "He was a member of the same gym as me. We used to chat on the treadmill and one day he suggested we meet for lunch.

"He was a great reader and very interested in psychology so we had a lot in common...

But life wasn't always so glamorous for Dr P**, who moved to England in 1977 to study psychology at the University of East London.

At 20, she discovered she was pregnant - a big shock to her father, a human biology professor, and mother, who has a masters degree in botany.

The baby's businessman father was 16 years older than Dr P**, already had two children and had only recently parted from his wife.

But Dr P** was head over heels in love. She says: "We had met in a wine bar near to where I lived and he was devastatingly handsome - a cross between Clint Eastwood and Julio Iglesias. I was swept off my feet.

"Our son *** was born a month prematurely. He was tiny, severely jaundiced and struggled to feed. Now he's a strapping 6ft 5in guy and we're incredibly close."

Despite having a baby to care for, the young mum graduated in 1981. She married her lover, becoming stepmother to his two sons, aged 15 and 10.

The couple had daughter ***** in 1984 but the marriage ended in a bitter divorce in 1992.

Dr P** reveals: "My husband was very jealous and controlling and I was deeply unhappy.

"I spent most of the marriage bringing up my children alone because he was never around. I was more like a single mum than a wife."

She considered moving back to America to be with her family but says: "My girlfriends kept me going. And I loved the UK - I did not want to leave behind bad memories."

She calls the next phase of her life the "baked bean years" when money was tight for the single mum.

"I'd cook enormous stews of baked beans, kidney beans and tinned tomatoes that kept us going for days," she says. "And I'd pop to the local market to buy complete outfits for the kids for less than a fiver.

"My ex hasn't paid maintenance since 1994 when he bought *** a pair of shoes. It was tough but brought us all closer together."

(My asterisks to shield certain people's identities)

PSS wrote in the Sun on 13 March 2018:

"I chose to have a year of celibacy in my late twenties.

I went through a painful split from my first husband and as I licked my wounds, having divorced on the grounds of his unreasonable behaviour, I thought, “I’m not being treated badly by another man again"....

It was not a decision I came to lightly, especially as I am a highly sexed woman who loves passion and intimacy.

But I discovered I didn’t need a man to make myself whole and I was determined to wait until I had met my equal."

Don't know what happened to TS but if alive he would be pretty ancient by now if he was 16 years older than PSS.

BTW TS and PSS lived in Belgravia, as did Lucan, not Mayfair. Both of course are part of London's "Golden Triangle" with Knightsbridge. Which of the three is poshest is probably a matter of opinion.

Oh WOW now this is very interesting. Particularly about the bit about him looking like Julio Iglesias- handsome, dark and suntanned - that surely cannot be a coincidence to the sightings of Suzy with Kipper! Not to mention his behaviour.
OMG I am blown away.

 

[lee sumner]

I won't link the article for obvious reasons but when PSS started writing for The People on June 15 2003 she had some interesting things to say about her life and loves.

""I understand what being a single mother is like, what it's like scraping for pennies and what it's like going through divorce. I also know what it's like to fight for your independence and climb the career ladder."

Readers with love problems will also benefit from her experiences dealing with male admirers. She dated Guy Ritchie in 1994 after they met at a karate club.

"He was a very funny man, extremely handsome and brilliant at karate," recalls black-belt holder Dr P**. "I used to love watching him because I was still learning.

"He was about eight years younger than me so he definitely goes for older women. We enjoyed a few dinner dates but kept them secret because our karate club was very gossipy and we did not want other members to know. On our third date we went to see Schindler's List. I was gob-smacked by the film and Guy was very moved by it too."

But the romance ended when her telly presenter pal Dale Winton introduced her to his agent **** - now Dr P**'s husband and stepdad to her children...

Another celebrity suitor was Anthony Hopkins. Dr P** says: "He was a member of the same gym as me. We used to chat on the treadmill and one day he suggested we meet for lunch.

"He was a great reader and very interested in psychology so we had a lot in common...

But life wasn't always so glamorous for Dr P**, who moved to England in 1977 to study psychology at the University of East London.

At 20, she discovered she was pregnant - a big shock to her father, a human biology professor, and mother, who has a masters degree in botany.

The baby's businessman father was 16 years older than Dr P**, already had two children and had only recently parted from his wife.

But Dr P** was head over heels in love. She says: "We had met in a wine bar near to where I lived and he was devastatingly handsome - a cross between Clint Eastwood and Julio Iglesias. I was swept off my feet.

"Our son *** was born a month prematurely. He was tiny, severely jaundiced and struggled to feed. Now he's a strapping 6ft 5in guy and we're incredibly close."

Despite having a baby to care for, the young mum graduated in 1981. She married her lover, becoming stepmother to his two sons, aged 15 and 10.

The couple had daughter ***** in 1984 but the marriage ended in a bitter divorce in 1992.

Dr P** reveals: "My husband was very jealous and controlling and I was deeply unhappy.

"I spent most of the marriage bringing up my children alone because he was never around. I was more like a single mum than a wife."

She considered moving back to America to be with her family but says: "My girlfriends kept me going. And I loved the UK - I did not want to leave behind bad memories."

She calls the next phase of her life the "baked bean years" when money was tight for the single mum.

"I'd cook enormous stews of baked beans, kidney beans and tinned tomatoes that kept us going for days," she says. "And I'd pop to the local market to buy complete outfits for the kids for less than a fiver.

"My ex hasn't paid maintenance since 1994 when he bought *** a pair of shoes. It was tough but brought us all closer together."

(My asterisks to shield certain people's identities)

PSS wrote in the Sun on 13 March 2018:

"I chose to have a year of celibacy in my late twenties.

I went through a painful split from my first husband and as I licked my wounds, having divorced on the grounds of his unreasonable behaviour, I thought, “I’m not being treated badly by another man again"....

It was not a decision I came to lightly, especially as I am a highly sexed woman who loves passion and intimacy.

But I discovered I didn’t need a man to make myself whole and I was determined to wait until I had met my equal."

Don't know what happened to TS but if alive he would be pretty ancient by now if he was 16 years older than PSS.

BTW TS and PSS lived in Belgravia, as did Lucan, not Mayfair. Both of course are part of London's "Golden Triangle" with Knightsbridge. Which of the three is poshest is probably a matter of opinion.

this was very interesting info was TS a controlling man. she said he was a cross between eastwood and iglesias. so he had a dark look about him, just like a witness description of mr kipper.

 

[lee sumner]

I won't link the article for obvious reasons but when PSS started writing for The People on June 15 2003 she had some interesting things to say about her life and loves.

""I understand what being a single mother is like, what it's like scraping for pennies and what it's like going through divorce. I also know what it's like to fight for your independence and climb the career ladder."

Readers with love problems will also benefit from her experiences dealing with male admirers. She dated Guy Ritchie in 1994 after they met at a karate club.

"He was a very funny man, extremely handsome and brilliant at karate," recalls black-belt holder Dr P**. "I used to love watching him because I was still learning.

"He was about eight years younger than me so he definitely goes for older women. We enjoyed a few dinner dates but kept them secret because our karate club was very gossipy and we did not want other members to know. On our third date we went to see Schindler's List. I was gob-smacked by the film and Guy was very moved by it too."

But the romance ended when her telly presenter pal Dale Winton introduced her to his agent **** - now Dr P**'s husband and stepdad to her children...

Another celebrity suitor was Anthony Hopkins. Dr P** says: "He was a member of the same gym as me. We used to chat on the treadmill and one day he suggested we meet for lunch.

"He was a great reader and very interested in psychology so we had a lot in common...

But life wasn't always so glamorous for Dr P**, who moved to England in 1977 to study psychology at the University of East London.

At 20, she discovered she was pregnant - a big shock to her father, a human biology professor, and mother, who has a masters degree in botany.

The baby's businessman father was 16 years older than Dr P**, already had two children and had only recently parted from his wife.

But Dr P** was head over heels in love. She says: "We had met in a wine bar near to where I lived and he was devastatingly handsome - a cross between Clint Eastwood and Julio Iglesias. I was swept off my feet.

"Our son *** was born a month prematurely. He was tiny, severely jaundiced and struggled to feed. Now he's a strapping 6ft 5in guy and we're incredibly close."

Despite having a baby to care for, the young mum graduated in 1981. She married her lover, becoming stepmother to his two sons, aged 15 and 10.

The couple had daughter ***** in 1984 but the marriage ended in a bitter divorce in 1992.

Dr P** reveals: "My husband was very jealous and controlling and I was deeply unhappy.

"I spent most of the marriage bringing up my children alone because he was never around. I was more like a single mum than a wife."

She considered moving back to America to be with her family but says: "My girlfriends kept me going. And I loved the UK - I did not want to leave behind bad memories."

She calls the next phase of her life the "baked bean years" when money was tight for the single mum.

"I'd cook enormous stews of baked beans, kidney beans and tinned tomatoes that kept us going for days," she says. "And I'd pop to the local market to buy complete outfits for the kids for less than a fiver.

"My ex hasn't paid maintenance since 1994 when he bought *** a pair of shoes. It was tough but brought us all closer together."

(My asterisks to shield certain people's identities)

PSS wrote in the Sun on 13 March 2018:

"I chose to have a year of celibacy in my late twenties.

I went through a painful split from my first husband and as I licked my wounds, having divorced on the grounds of his unreasonable behaviour, I thought, “I’m not being treated badly by another man again"....

It was not a decision I came to lightly, especially as I am a highly sexed woman who loves passion and intimacy.

But I discovered I didn’t need a man to make myself whole and I was determined to wait until I had met my equal."

Don't know what happened to TS but if alive he would be pretty ancient by now if he was 16 years older than PSS.

BTW TS and PSS lived in Belgravia, as did Lucan, not Mayfair. Both of course are part of London's "Golden Triangle" with Knightsbridge. Which of the three is poshest is probably a matter of opinion.

very posh area to live. i think SL was going around to PSS house at least twice a week. maybe more to crack open a bottle of wine and talk business. TS had a drink with them as well.

 

[Hexe]

this was very interesting info was TS a controlling man. she said he was a cross between eastwood and iglesias. so he had a dark look about him, just like a witness description of mr kipper.

He seems to be too old for Kipper though. He was what, 36 in 1977, so in 86 he was 45.

 

[lee sumner]

He seems to be too old for Kipper though. He was what, 36 in 1977, so in 86 he was 45.

the age range is off. TS was older in his 40s in the 1980s, and mr kipper was said to be in his mid 20s, early 30s. i still find TS an interesting character.

 

[lee sumner]

I am still on the TS line of thought as a possible theory. This is from the London Gazette 9/12/1986 (I have shortened the name to his initials only (as PSS was her hyphened name at the time and now she is PS)

Date of of filing 5th August 1986. Occupation (which I find very interesting BUILDER at 85 Elizabeth St in Belgravia) (Surname first)

S,T of Morlands, High Halden, Near Ashford, Kent, and lately residing and presently carrying onbusiness as a BUILDER at 85 Elizabeth Street, LondonS.W.I. Court—HIGH COURT OF JUSTICE. Date ofFiling Petition—5th August 1986. No. of Matter—2535of 1986. Date of Receiving Order—1st December 1986.No. of Receiving Order—2235. Whether Debtor's orCreditor's Petition-^-Creditor's. Act of Bankruptcy provedin Creditor's Petition—Section 1-1 (G) Bankruptcy Act1914.

Then- as per the London Gazette 29/5/1987- he looks like he has moved ( Westlondoner i think it was you that said PSS left him not long after SJL disappeared?)

S, T of 85 Elizabeth Street. London S.W.I, CONTRACT MANAGER and COMPANY DIRECTOR, lately residing at Flat 5, 11 Hyde Park Gardens, London W.2 and Marlands, High Halden, near Ashford, Kent, described in the Receiving Order as lately residing and presently carrying on business as a Builder at 85 Elizabeth Street, London S.W.I. Court—HIGH COURT OF JUSTICE. No. of Matter—2535 of 1986. Date of Order—15th April 1987. Date of Filing Petiing—5th August 1986.

https://www.thegazette.co.uk/London/issue/50741/page/15918/data.pdf

https://www.thegazette.co.uk/London/issue/50932/page/7000/data.pdf

My lines of thought are

1. She ended up having an affair with him as a result of her friendship with PSS ( she gave them both facials according to AS and then drank wine), he wasnt happy about her apparent lunch date on the Tuesday with PSS (who knows - he could have been crapping himself that she might tell him about their affair and so made a plan to meet her on the Monday - now as a builder he would have no shortage of places he probably had access to that he may have been working on at the time.

2. He was the man that was 'leaning on her in ways that was unpleasant , wrong and she did not want to have any more to do with it- she was almost angry ' according to her uncle. So just putting it out there - was he using her real estate connections to get work as a builder ?

Having said that, having a Belgravia address does not indicate you are just the working class. (and no I have not watched the series ha ha) . He was likely highly geared ( probably PSS did not know this and hence she left the marriage with next to nothing)

This angle of SJLs life is really really odd IMO. Something I think has way more substance to it in terms of her disappearance than JC.

you have to be loaded to live in belgravia. i imagine SL would have been impressed with how PSS and her family lived, and probably wanted the same lifestyle.

 

[lee sumner]

Did someone say on this thread that he is now dead? I seem to remember reading something.

yes, i think he has passed away.

 

[WestLondoner]

TS would be about 80 today. The Belgravia "house" was in fact a maisonette, so desirable then and now but not in centimillionaire territory. The fact he was personally bankrupted within weeks of SJL's disappearance is never parsed in any of the many documentaries - I learnt of it here. It's possible he was never that wealthy, just highly geared, and got caught out. Interest rates went from just over 9% in 1984 to 11.375% in 1985 and were still at 11.something % in 1986; maybe that caused his problem.

My interest in this dates from July 1986. I was a 22-year-old graduate sales rep, first job, working from home. I used to meet potential customers alone and with no paper trail, sometimes in quite out of the way places: farms in Welsh mountains, empty stretches of B-roads. I had female colleagues doing the same and this disappearance sent a shiver up many spines. Towards the end of the year my reporting line changed; my new manager lived in Putney and had bought his house that year or perhaps late in 1985. He had been to Sturgis in Fulham among other agents when looking for that house, and was sure he'd encountered SJL; there was one very good-looking woman, on the phone when he came in, so he spoke to her colleague. He bought through someone else in the end. I hadn't heard of six degrees of separation then but I remember thinking how close that seemed - the lifestyle and the actual contact.

I read AS when it came out and then more or less lost interest when JC appeared and was indicated; this one appeared to have been solved. What re-interested me over the next 30 years was the odd sameness of all the reporting and documentarisation about the case. Every supposed investigation, whoever was making it, appeared focused on proving JC did it, not on going back to first principles and questioning everything. JC increasingly looked like this random sc umbag who'd wandered into the frame and was a detestable perverted daemon so he'd do; but the case offered against him was always pitiful. This is why DV's book was so welcome, even though I don't agree with his conclusion.

There is a case to be made against JC, but it could have been developed in 1986. This is obviously embarrassing, so the "official" reasons why he was the suspect are ones cooked up after the fact that don't stand up to scrutiny. For example, you often hear references to the Birmingham "house-for-sale rapist" ("HFSR"). The HFSR raped women whose Birmingham houses had a 'For Sale' board outside, JC was from Birmingham, 37SR was for sale - coo, makes yer think dunnit? Musta been JC! Except no, not really, because the HFSR didn't kill anyone; several of his victims described him and he looked nothing like JC; JC was 20 at the time while the HFSR was in his 40s; the HSFR went unannounced to the door and assaulted the occupant if she were at home alone, whereas "Kipper" booked a viewing; there was no 'For Sale' sign outside 37SR; and the HSFR assaulted occupants, not agents.

Then there's the myth of the Sierra DNA and the 60% match. That's not a 60% chance SJL was in the car. It's a 60% match with her DNA, meaning 60% of the population matched as well - so about 30 million people. Even if it were a 0.1% match, it would mean 50,000 people shared it besides her. This is of no value.

On balance I think it's about 70% likely this was JC, and I allow the 30% because it's possible there's someone out there who used his MO and got away with it. Just like JC was never in the original inquiry, some other perp could still not be.

37SR is IMO a blind alley; the events actually occurred in Stevenage Road and the jogger, the taxi fare and BW saw parts of it happening.

 

[Klclevi]

I still cannot quite wrap my head around how (and why ) JC would murder SJL only 3 days after being released from prison. Totally nuts (but then again I guess he was).

 

[Klclevi]

He seems to be too old for Kipper though. He was what, 36 in 1977, so in 86 he was 45.

mm could have looked younger for his age though, thats quite possible. esp If he had an olive complexion (or quite olive like JI due to a european background)

 

[Spy Versus Spy]

Has anyone ever asked PSS directly about SJL? Given the nature and scope of her work, there mustve been times where the discussive nature of problems/emotions required openess and honesty, which couldve left her in a position where someone would feel possibly able to do so. Her response wouldve been v telling.

 

[WestLondoner]

Yes, she just says that SJL was a dear friend and she doesn't want to talk about it. This is quite odd when you consider what she does feel happy talking and writing about.

The oddest thing about this case is that in no documentary or book are either of this couple mentioned. Nor, with the exception of crank theories like "Fred West dunnit because Kippers is fish", is any suspect other than JC considered.

 

[WestLondoner]

I still cannot quite wrap my head around how (and why ) JC would murder SJL only 3 days after being released from prison. Totally nuts (but then again I guess he was).

There are some grounds to suggest he killed Sandra Court wven before that.

 

[Klclevi]

I am no statistician and I also do not know the crime stats in the UK . But pretty much- overall statistically - alot of crimes of this nature are committed by someone the person knew. You do not just disappear off the street in the majority of cases . Having said that there is not alot of information that I can find about how SB was actually abducted ( and the lead up to that - did he know her? did he send her flowers and stuff? or did he just see her at Debenhams and go - oh right she is the one tonight ? I guess that is totally possible.

There is evidence SJL knew TS. There is really no evidence that she had any involvement with JC at all.

Have a look at this statement (thanks Steve H) . Draw any comparisons? If SJL was having an affair with him (herself being highly sexual by all accounts we have read - this could (could) be a betrayal by a friend with her husband??

I went through a painful split from my first husband and as I licked my wounds, having divorced on the grounds of his unreasonable behaviour, I thought, “I’m not being treated badly by another man again"....
It was not a decision I came to lightly, especially as I am a highly sexed woman who loves passion and intimacy.

Why would PSS hide it all these years if she knew or had any inkling that he had anything to do with it? No disrespect to her in any way if she has had to raise two kids on her own with a bankrupt philandering husband. I would have kicked him to the curb as well.
It smacks of him being a shady character all around and I can only guess she does not want to be implicated in a crime she did not commit but would likely be associated with. It makes you wonder if (as per the AS book she showed up at East Sheen Av on I think the Tuesday after SJL disappeared - if this was fake because she knew something or was trying to find something out from the family)

Its a thought dear fellow SJL peeps!

 

[Klclevi]

There are some grounds to suggest he killed Sandra Court wven before that.

Yeah WL i know but really even that seems far fetched . I am just doing my own head in . ha ha

 

[Hexe]

There are some grounds to suggest he killed Sandra Court wven before that.

What grounds exactly? Sandra was found fully dressed, there was no evidence she was raped or beaten and the murderer used minimal force required to strangle her. That's very much unlike Cannan who was primarily a rapist, with penchant for brutal violence. He bludgeoned Shirley Banks to death with a stone. Also, he was checked by the police as a potential suspect in this case and no ties were found.

 

[Klclevi]

What grounds exactly? Sandra was found fully dressed, there was no evidence she was raped or beaten and the murderer used minimal force required to strangle her. That's very much unlike Cannan who was primarily a rapist, with penchant for brutal violence. He bludgeoned Shirley Banks to death with a stone. Also, he was checked by the police as a potential suspect in this case and no ties were found.

Hexe - what are your thoughts?
I often think she is just in plain sight all these years. Buried behind some wall or cellar/ cupboard thing in a house in Fulham. God forbid its actually 37SR .

 

[Hexe]

Hexe - what are your thoughts?
I often think she is just in plain sight all these years. Buried behind some wall or cellar/ cupboard thing in a house in Fulham. God forbid its actually 37SR .

I think Suzy was killed by someone she knew, most probably an unwanted admirer, who got firmly rejected that day and did not take it well. Where she is? Not in Fulham, I think.

 

[Klclevi]

Mm ok. I am going to bang on about the canal possibilty again. I am going to put it out there. Maybe it could have been TS. He and JC probably didnt look that different in colouring.

You look at this case of 21 years solved by sonar . Its an amazing story. Totally diff circumstances of course but hey they found those two kids. ( I am not American I am Aussie)
I know its a car not a suitcase but hey. Maybe there are other methods other than dredging that canal nowadays. Its a long shot but why not. What I am trying to say is there is always hope and a possibility. She has to be somewhere.

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[WestLondoner]

What grounds exactly? Sandra was found fully dressed, there was no evidence she was raped or beaten and the murderer used minimal force required to strangle her. That's very much unlike Cannan who was primarily a rapist, with penchant for brutal violence. He bludgeoned Shirley Banks to death with a stone. Also, he was checked by the police as a potential suspect in this case and no ties were found.

Cannan had the use of a red Sierra in which a car park ticket dating to the day she disappeared was later found. This puts Cannan's car in Southampton, i.e. in the right area on the right day. Her personal effects were found discarded at intervals along the roadside, on a route that would lead from the site the body was found, to London. SJL cancelled a date with someone unknown the weekend SC was killed.

It's all highly circumstantial, of course. But it is consistent with Cannan being angry at getting blown out by SJL, killing SC in a rage and then dumping her stuff out of a car window.