UK UK - Suzy Lamplugh, 25, Fulham, 28 Jul 1986 #8

[WestLondoner]

is anybody else getting this?

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[lee sumner]

The implication of being ordered to "enter" and search the property is that you don't have the keys. When one has the keys, entering is automatic, assumed. You can infer from that alone the keys were never to hand.

yes, we think the same, ha, ha. SL taking the keys is a key detail in the case, but some people who follow the case dont seem to understand this.

 

[lee sumner]

Is that what DV wrote?
If so it's his own interpretation of events?
I think DV did some good and interesting work on the case but for me he fits all his facts together in a narrative that produces the conclusion he wants. I felt he leads the reader - I got the impression, And this is my personal view, that he felt contempt for the police officers he interviews. DV knows best.
But again, this is my view and I'm happy to change it if I can be persuaded!

i thought DV book was terrible. he says he knows who killed SL and where her remains are buried, then on a recent PC interview says it could have been an accident, then says he does not know what happened to her. this guy is all over the place, and cant make up his mind, but he is a great investigator and researcher, ha, ha.

 

[lee sumner]

Yes, I really think the Sun to Fri change is the odd but inconsequential detail the police asked AS to alter. It puzzled him but he felt it had no bearing on rest of information. Unfortunately quite a bit of that centred on the unreliable testimony of HR. HR went to Belgium & said Kiper looked like the man he saw which looked nothing like his photofit. He also said he saw SL bundled into a van.

If this WAS the change AL could legitimately talk about lost item events taking place on Friday.

Barley has now told us in podcast SL DID effectively see someone post her parents on Sun night & tried to cover her tracks with AL. Did they ever get to bottom of who this was? The expat, especially if her plus one at 21st & his upper class/upper middle social circle, will have definitely overlapped with Birthday lady & they likely knew each other socially anyway, is the obvious choice. I think he was due to legitimately leave the country post a party on the Tues. The police used interpol to question so presumably did so only a bit later on.

Perhaps the person SL DID see on Sun eve was a ‘commercial’ contact though, not so much a love interest. We do know via her uncle this deal to buy the house she couldn’t otherwise afford was troubling her & her business associate was pressurising her. Her unusually good mood on Mon am, pre NH taking commission, she’d assumed was hers, might be because she’d finally adjusted the terms of deal OR pulled out. The police did feel in 86 this house deal was key, vital & they didn’t know about it early on. The last conversation she apparently had with her parents was on this very deal - will post press article.

That last call she took OR made, may have been to tell ‘Kipper’ she couldn’t pay any money owed immediately - no expected commission after all & arranged to meet him briefly & collect items too from pub. Why the urgency to sell her flat? Three failed attempts. Presumably her family knew? She had nowhere to go, did she need the cash fairly urgently?

Conjecture is one thing but we DO know the police asked AS to change what he saw as a meaningless detail poss on timeline. Like the butterfly effect if so, proved to be anything but. Can they check what this was? Will it be noted anywhere?

JD has now computerised all those cards on case. Fantastic. Can someone with good, detailed knowledge of case sit & cross reference with contact book etc? In AS time they had looked at only a fraction of contacts he said. NOT ALL. The police didn’t know about the house deal in golden hour & at time & HR was at least in part spinning yarns by his own admission & the police were under resourced. No one can blame them if they missed a vital lead. Barley said they’d looked at boyfriends where they could - did they go back here though & finish what they’d started with a fine tooth comb? Is SW from QE2 in her contact book?

JD said the BMW jogger witness came forward AT time & reinvestigating all this told police that. He went to a pop up police station in Stevenage Rd. It was missed at time.

‘Sarah’ calling pub & leaving number & message for SL - the message was also ‘lost’ & as JD sees it due to errors & overwhelm this was also possibly legitmately ‘lost’. Is there a clue in contact book? - not necessarily under ‘Sarah’ a wife or girlfriend of the pressurising deal maker perhaps?

The police also presumably know if the contact book was salacious or otherwise. This is important too. It all helps build a better ‘Kipper’ picture. Was there a thread that bound & connected most of the contacts together.

yes, the mystery man SL stayed overnight with is a business associate of AL. mr bahamas i call him.

 

[Eastend Eagle]

P.187 ‘Hodgkinson’ very specifically given first - that spelling -Prime Suspect CBD.

Although JC did also add it might have been ‘Hodgeson’ or similar name - you’re right. First & foremost ‘Hodgkinson’ given though. It might all be a coincidence ofc.

DH had been away for a few months teaching sailing from memory. It’s possible even likely - pre social media & mobiles etc - they were writing to each other esp as not a short holiday. She was a big writer - writing to her sister in NZ etc. If this was the postcard in her diary/contact book - as yet unsent - & it mentioned something about their lasting love - then it might be relevant or interesting. And/or if anything in contact book under his name given rumours around this ‘address book’ that DV said friends or family hadn’t seen before.

I thought it interesting too that AS mentioned DH as her most enduring love with above in mind. May mean nothing.

Why would Cannan say the Bristol-based businessman's name was Hodgkinson even if he'd been aware that a Hodgkinson had been the love of Putney-based SJL's life?

 

[Rookie D]

Chilling discovery after woman's body found strangled in ditch

Police have launched a new investigation after Sandra Court was last seen in Bournemouth in the early hours of May 3, 1986 - the day QE2 crew member Wright had docked 30 miles away in Southampton

www.mirror.co.uk

Looks like Steve Wright is being potentially linked to the murder of Sandra Court in May 1986, as it occurred on the same day he docked at Southampton.

A carbon copy of Suzy Lamplugh being murdered on the day he docked in Southampton around 13 weeks later.


Both in 1986.

There's a pattern developing here I think.

Did Wright have a penchant for disembarking and then abducting a woman on the same day?


Curious indeed

 

[Lady Stoddart-West]

Why would Cannan say the Bristol-based businessman's name was Hodgkinson even if he'd been aware that a Hodgkinson had been the love of Putney-based SJL's life?

Because according to AS he was her greatest & only enduring love. If JC had known her- & as we know he was incredibly jealous etc - DH might have registered in back of mind as a hated figure. This Hodgkinson was according to JC effectively killer of both SB & SL.

JC did a very deep dive with a private investigator on AR & wanted to destroy her husband. SB found this sinister PI investigative doc (on AR) in JC’s flat & SB’s thumb print on it helped prove SB once captive there. Had he stalked SL & got similar info on her life?

DH away for a few months overseas so it’s not inconceivable rifled/lost/missing postcard was to him as yet unsent. Especially as SL wrote a lot. I don’t necessarily believe JC had sight of these belongings or involvement but AL seemingly did.

Anyway, It’s very likely another of the many (!) coincidences in this case but it’s a more uncommon name than some he made up. For this reason it jumped out at me.

 

[Lady Stoddart-West]

Chilling discovery after woman's body found strangled in ditch

Police have launched a new investigation after Sandra Court was last seen in Bournemouth in the early hours of May 3, 1986 - the day QE2 crew member Wright had docked 30 miles away in Southampton

www.mirror.co.uk

Looks like Steve Wright is being potentially linked to the murder of Sandra Court in May 1986, as it occurred on the same day he docked at Southampton.

A carbon copy of Suzy Lamplugh being murdered on the day he docked in Southampton around 13 weeks later.


Both in 1986.

There's a pattern developing here I think.

Did Wright have a penchant for disembarking and then abducting a woman on the same day?


Curious indeed

SC very visibly left re: MO. What was SW’s general MO? Will look. JC in very close proximity too on right day. The police may still have 86 notes on SW to cross reference. NB: AS p.99

“With the help of Cunard’s security dept in Southampton, they began the long & laborious process of checking Susannah’s male colleagues on the QE2.- cross referencing to see if those on her ship also happened to be on leave in England on the day she disappeared”.

 

[tes1984]

Steve Wright's QE2 movements were also checked by Interpol, but I'm not sure of they re-checked potential UK offences.

All his known crimes were in areas he was very familiar with. Cannan was similar but also attacked in areas he didn't know that well.

Both left bodies in water. SW obviously a strangler. JC seemingly more of a bludgeoner. Neither have known victims who remained undiscovered for long periods.

 

[Lady Stoddart-West]

yes, the mystery man SL stayed overnight with is a business associate of AL. mr bahamas i call him.

We seem to know from Barley in recent podcast now that SL lied to AL about who she saw after her parents on Sun night. Was it him? The friend alibi she apparently gave didn’t check out.

Looking back at AS, P:81, “They spoke later on the phone that evening [Sunday before she went missing] and discussed the arrangements for a party the following Tuesday. It was to be at the flat of a wealthy young man who lived in Park Lane, in the heart of Mayfair”.

The seems odd given AL had turned up in Worthing & left without her earlier…

 

[Klclevi]

Not sure if he should be named on public boards, as he's not a convicted murderer, kidnapper etc. I suppose his name was put out in association with the case though.

FWIR he was a big time property developer in the mid 80s, with ambitious plans for developments in London.

Yes my apologies I should not have done that.

That is interesting info though and I wonder why they put that out there in the press at the time.

 

[Klclevi]

We seem to know from Barley in recent podcast now that SL lied to AL about who she saw after her parents on Sun night. Was it him? The friend alibi she apparently gave didn’t check out.

Looking back at AS, P:81, “They spoke later on the phone that evening [Sunday before she went missing] and discussed the arrangements for a party the following Tuesday. It was to be at the flat of a wealthy young man who lived in Park Lane, in the heart of Mayfair”.

The seems odd given AL had turned up in Worthing & left without her earlier…

Hi all
Having read back through articles this past few weeks. AL definitely has some - i guess you would say some quite oddball things to say. Lots of articles are misquoted saying they were together for a year, and even headed for the altar. AS says it was a few months but they had known one another for a year so I guess thats where it has been miscontrued.
Even his now (i assume still current) wife was on one article ( EL) .

Very early reports say he said they were meant to go to a football match at Wembley the weekend after as they both loved the football. ( i guess that means soccer in UK). He then says in another article about the weekend prior to 28.7 that he was hardly about to get down on bended knee that weekend. (will reference the articles).

He was only 27 - absolutely no doubt blindsided by what happened . He then had to find out the revelations of her other boyfriends.
Maybe he thought they were exclusive but she obviously did not really think that in her own mind and kept the others on the side a secret but he never knew this.

His interview with Dv does stand out out as really odd on first reading. However once you immerse yourself in this case maybe it is not so. I read that and thought (What the hell !!) . But if you read into it its an emotional response, to years of the unresolved, he is probably OVA it all.

No disrespect to him, maybe thats just his personality - he is probably not very tactful or there is not alot of EQ in his expressions.

The fact that he is still in touch with TL (who I have learned through all these articles, he helped her in many ways and supported her in the aftermath) makes me think this response is just the up to 'pussys bow' with it all and the many failed attempts at finding her was again going to yield nothing for the family.

Now, that the DV interview with AL has been published, he is probably never going to agree to be interviewed again.
I am no detective, but i would never have started the conversation the way that DV did.

Maybe he knows something about SLs other ventures/relationships. Maybe he does not. If he does he needs to speak up now in 2026 .

 

[Lady Stoddart-West]

Having read back through articles this past two weeks. AL definitely has some - i guess you would say some quite oddball things to say. Lots of articles are misquoted saying they were together for a year, and even headed for the altar. AS says it was a few months but they had known one another for a year so I guess thats where it has been miscontrued. .
Even his wife was on one article ( EL) .

Very early reports say He said they were meant to go to a football match at Wembley the weekend after as they both loved the football. ( i guess that means soccer in UK). He then says in another article about the weekend prior to 28.7 that he was hardly about to get down on bended knee that weekend.

No disrespect to him, maybe thats just his personality - he is probably not very tactful or there is not alot of EQ in his expressions.

He was only 27 - absolutely no doubt blindsided by what happened . He then had to find out the revelations of her other boyfriends. Maybe he thought they were exclusive but she obviously did not really think that and kept the others on the side a secret but he never knew this.

His interview with DL does stand out out as really odd on first reading. However once you immerse yourself in this case maybe it is not so. I read that and thought (What the hell !!) . But if you read into it its an emotional response, to years of the unresolved, he is probably OVA it all.

The fact that he is still in touch with TL (who I have learned through all these articles, he helped her in many ways and supported her in the aftermath) makes me think this response is just the up to 'pussys bow' with it all and the many failed attempts at finding her was again going to yield nothing for the family.

Now, that the DV interview with AL has been published, he is probably never going to agree to be interviewed again.
I am no detective, but i would never have started the conversation the way that DV did.

Maybe he knows something about SLs other ventures/relationships. Maybe he does not. If he does he needs to speak up now in 2026 but its unlikely.

For me, my interest around AL has been re: determining whether the Sun night date for lost possessions was switched to Fri (with all evidence we have- esp now Barley has said via recent podcast effectively she went out post parents) I think it was.

She might have seen the person briefly on ‘deal’ post parents, it’s not inconceivable especially as she’d spoken to her father ‘at length’ about it not long before. Did she have a niggle to iron out over a drink?

Getting timeline & timings straight so important particularly as very confused in this case. If we take out 37 viewing but leave in BW’s sighting (which she remained adamant about) & evidence at Stevenage Rd we’re looking at a very different scenario & timeline. I am not saying no viewing at 37 but considering all possibilities.

NB said/implied to DV AL not the steady, main boyfriend in SL eyes. He was however a close family friend, defender of her honour & he stepped up. The family & police knew they needed the public onside. I think he knew & understood SL.

SL was very sexually active NB: article attached. Nothing wrong in that but in 1986 they wanted to paint a picture of an ambitious. girl-next-door with a steady wholesome boyfriend to help solve the case & keep all on side. AL protected her reputation. He himself had an attractive female flatmate (platonic) there’s press on this too but the slant positive. He was decent, honourable & a good friend to her & family.

AL due to take her to an American football game on the Sunday the week she went missing. NB: Sunday Mirror attached. Tickets were very (!) scarce & £ - maybe AL got via work.

 

[Klclevi]

For me, my interest around AL has been re: determining whether the Sun night date for lost possessions was switched to Fri (with all evidence we have- esp now Barley has said via recent podcast effectively she went out post parents) I think it was.

Getting timeline & timings straight important particularly as very confused in this case. If we take out 37 viewing but leave in BW’s sighting (which she remained adamant about) & evidence at Stevenage Rd we’re looking at a very different scenario & timeline. I am not saying no viewing at 37 but considering all possibilities.

NB said/implied to DV AL not the steady, main boyfriend in SL eyes. He was however a close family friend, defender of her honour & he stepped up. The family & police knew they needed the public onside. I think he knew & understood SL.

AL due to take her to an American football game on the Sunday the week she went missing. NB: Sunday Mirror attached.

Apologies yes thats the article!
Now I tend to agree with you regarding AS.

So BWs sighting says this
see last paragraph.

IMO I dont think this is an incorrect sighting as claimed by the police but you guys are way more experienced than me.

 

[Lady Stoddart-West]

Apologies yes thats the article!
Now I tend to agree with you regarding AS.

So BWs sighting says this
see last paragraph.

IMO I dont think this is an incorrect sighting as claimed by the police but you guys are way more experienced than me.


View attachment 645839

The evidence is very strong BW was right. The police tried to disprove but she was & remained certain. It was Monday so less easy to confuse with another working day - they interviewed those she was meeting - went to her office to check her diary to look at poss timing.

Like the jogger & BMW it didn’t fit timeline they had in mind.

 

[Klclevi]

My mind is now circling back to this milkman sighting TBH . I know I posted upthread about where this Boulevard Restaurant was in 86 ( in some article it says it was yards from Sturgis but its clearly not there today) . How this milkman would have identified the car is probably BS but, i will put the article below
Sunday Mirror 24.8.86
THis cannot be true IMM.

 

[WestLondoner]

Obviously opinions vary, but not establishing where SJL was on Sunday, concocting an account of that evening, dismissing BW, losing the sighting of the BMW, relying on HR as a witness, and not being curious about recent prison releases all seem to me to be pretty egregious clangers. For me, dropping them undermines any claims that "the police would never have done / would never have failed to do" this or that because they were such streetwise and experienced coppers.

They appear in fact to have stumbled into exactly the same pitfall as George Oldfield, the man in charge of the Ripper hunt 6 years previously. Despite the survivors of Ripper attacks telling him their attacker was from Bradford, the FBI telling him the tapes were a hoax and his own officers telling him there was nothing in them not in the public domain, Oldfield insisted they were real. Suspects including Sutcliffe were eliminated for not having a Wearside accent. In this new instance of the mindset, any sighting or detail that suggested nothing had happened at 37SR or that more important things had happened elsewhere were processed out.

Just as Cannan was never in the original investigation it is possible this was the work of someone who still is not.

I'd really, really like to hear the police account of what they think actually took place that day if this was Cannan, and which of the witness accounts support it. I don't think we ever will. If they admit it involved the use of Taggart's garage / flat, they'll be challenged on why they never spotted that in 1986. If they shrug and say they have no idea, they're admitting they've no way to connect SJL and JC (which is why the CPS declined to proceed).

 

[Lady Stoddart-West]

My mind is now circling back to this milkman sighting TBH . I know I posted upthread about where this Boulevard Restaurant was in 86 ( in some article it says it was yards from Sturgis but its clearly not there today) . How this milkman would have identified the car is probably BS but, i will put the article below
Sunday Mirror 24.8.86
THis cannot be true IMM.

I imagined they eliminated etc as you say.

That said I do think the answer is much simpler than some have thought. As the early police team said it was a case that was all about the timings & the data on that & timeline not all correct.

They were overwhelmed & how could they possibly know if all alibis honest/correct? As time ticked on got even more difficult to establish! I wonder if there were any niggles on anyone on the ‘list’? 228 current clients & 700 old ones. It says they looked at those with criminal records, names similar to Kipper & those who had ceased contacting Sturgis post 28 July 86 first. What about the private contacts? Some of the reasons for knowing her here did sound very odd & AS said they only looked at a sample…

See below.

 

[WestLondoner]

My mind is now circling back to this milkman sighting TBH . I know I posted upthread about where this Boulevard Restaurant was in 86 ( in some article it says it was yards from Sturgis but its clearly not there today) . How this milkman would have identified the car is probably BS but, i will put the article below
Sunday Mirror 24.8.86
THis cannot be true IMM.

It could be true. They went somewhere between 37SR at 1pm and the BW sighting at 2.45. We've long wondered why nobody noticed a good-looking couple, if it is true that Cannan liked to p0nce around in Fulham wine bars copping off with women.

Unless you could get hold of a yellow pages from 1986, it's going to be hard to work out where this place was. A rule of thumb in London planning is that it's generally difficult to get permission to open a new licensed premises or commercial kitchen. Broadly speaking they tend to be premises already in that use; so you can only start up a restaurant where there's been one before. It's not hard and fast, but it's just less hassle to get the go ahead because a restaurant was already there.

This being so the place you have found is almost certainly on the present site of another restaurant. Unfortunately there are oodles - there's a Pizza Hut next door to where Sturgis was, two Lebaneses, a Chinese and a Joe & the Juice opposite, and many others if you look further.

 

[Lady Stoddart-West]

Obviously opinions vary, but not establishing where SJL was on Sunday, concocting an account of that evening, dismissing BW, losing the sighting of the BMW, relying on HR as a witness, and not being curious about recent prison releases all seem to me to be pretty egregious clangers. For me, dropping them undermines any claims that "the police would never have done / would never have failed to do" this or that because they were such streetwise and experienced coppers.

They appear in fact to have stumbled into exactly the same pitfall as George Oldfield, the man in charge of the Ripper hunt 6 years previously. Despite the survivors of Ripper attacks telling him their attacker was from Bradford, the FBI telling him the tapes were a hoax and his own officers telling him there was nothing in them not in the public domain, Oldfield insisted they were real. Suspects including Sutcliffe were eliminated for not having a Wearside accent. In this new instance of the mindset, any sighting or detail that suggested nothing had happened at 37SR or that more important things had happened elsewhere were processed out.

Just as Cannan was never in the original investigation it is possible this was the work of someone who still is not.

I'd really, really like to hear the police account of what they think actually took place that day if this was Cannan, and which of the witness accounts support it. I don't think we ever will. If they admit it involved the use of Taggart's garage / flat, they'll be challenged on why they never spotted that in 1986. If they shrug and say they have no idea, they're admitting they've no way to connect SJL and JC (which is why the CPS declined to proceed).

Excellent points on Ripper case & although I don’t know as much as you do , I know a little & have had the same thoughts. It was much harder without tech & CCTV ofc.

Re: SL they gave up on tracing BMWs that fitted profile seen outside Shorrolds although numbers very finite & they were about 3/4 of way through. Reminded me of Ripper case where they gave up on looking at vehicles with a certain tyre tread. They just missed PS it was proven! Had they seen this through they might have caught him earlier.

IF Jo Yeates had gone missing in 1986 would the unfortunate Christopher Jeffries still be under a cloud & would Vincent Tabak be scot free? Would she have ever been found? I DO think there might be a similar ‘plain sight’ answer in the SL case. If it’s ever solved it might not be particularly complex as such.

Would the tragic Sarah Everard case still be a mystery if 1986?

On JC I think most of strongest evidence is in public domain now. SA in interview with Barley was/is a highly intelligent man. He was very sceptical on JC but was eventually completely convinced even though I think he was never sure about JC’s confession to Barley. Why? It would be good to hear more from him.

JC’s unaccounted for 6 nights post release have to be taken seriously too. There’s good evidence he lied here about whereabouts & used same tactics as he had on SB. They nailed him in part through his cash withdrawals on DT rape - Reading - & SB - Bristol.

Presumably they couldn’t do this for SL? Why not? Tech not there yet? Did he withdraw from bank in this period?